Suggestions for cement mixer media separation

[OnceFired]

Thanks for the ideas, gents. I do appreciate the help.

Yeah, the can't build much permanent problem is the big sticking point right now. I am currently using a sheet metal storage shed to do this in - can't attach anything structural anywhere. I have now moved to the Springfield area, and am trying to get situated here. Once I land permanently somewhere (instead of in the RV park) then I will work toward a more permanent solution.

The wheel barrow idea is interesting. I would need to devise a method to secure the shaker box on top of it. The problem I see is that it won't really agitate the brass enough - no tumbling per se, just jostling. An improvement to be sure, but I think it wouldn't work great overall.

I did find a 16"x16" plastic modular pegboard at the local Home Depot. With a little effort, I could bolt that onto my cement mixer, perhaps even with a hinge, and turn it into the mixer door idea. The opening is 15.5" across, so with a few bolts & brackets, this would work, and also be easily replaced as it wears out from the weight put against it.

ZA

[Don2]

Thanks for the ideas, gents. I do appreciate the help.

Yeah, the can't build much permanent problem is the big sticking point right now. I am currently using a sheet metal storage shed to do this in - can't attach anything structural anywhere. I have now moved to the Springfield area, and am trying to get situated here. Once I land permanently somewhere (instead of in the RV park) then I will work toward a more permanent solution.

The wheel barrow idea is interesting. I would need to devise a method to secure the shaker box on top of it. The problem I see is that it won't really agitate the brass enough - no tumbling per se, just jostling. An improvement to be sure, but I think it wouldn't work great overall.

I did find a 16"x16" plastic modular pegboard at the local Home Depot. With a little effort, I could bolt that onto my cement mixer, perhaps even with a hinge, and turn it into the mixer door idea. The opening is 15.5" across, so with a few bolts & brackets, this would work, and also be easily replaced as it wears out from the weight put against it.

ZA

Hope you come up with something that you can use and will work. ( Keep us in the loop, I'd like to see what you come up with, I'm kinda interested in the same idea. )

I like the pegboard as a pegboard to use over some of my benches. I have a sheet of the old paper board stuff, but think the plastic ones would work better for me. I just want a small one anyways.
Thanks for the heads up on that. I've had a box full of all sorts of board hooks, some came from an old grocery store that held many card mounted items. About 18" long and many other type.

Don2

[Gyrogearhead]

Another way to add vibration to the separating screen box would be to fasten a concrete shaker to it. This is a little round device with a ball bearing race and one steel ball in it. You hook it up to your air compressor and the air causes the ball to whiz around the inside of the ring like the pill in a whistle. The biger they are the more vibration you get. These things are used in industrial size concrete foundation work to vibrate the forms to get the air in the concrete to rise. They can be had used on Ebay for a couple of bucks and you don't have to worry about electric wiring around your work area.

Just my 2c.

Gerry

[OnceFired]

I have to move my stuff from storage up from about 40 miles south of here. I hope to have a solution before the end of the month, which is when I have to move the storage by. :) I'll keep you guys posted.

ZA

[OnceFired]

I appreciate all the thoughts put into this. Once I get my land bought and a shop built, many of these ideas will get implemented together in one spot. :)

I have now moved all my stuff up to be near where I live, instead of 40 miles south of me. I have my tools again and can start tinkering. I still can't build anything big, or anything that would require mounting to a wall, etc. I am still in a storage unit after all.

But, I think I will keep it simple for now. I'll add on 2x4's to triple the overall depth of the sifting tray I have currently, and make it a clam-shell style with a thick dowel through the center, using rotating window style locks to keep it together. That will let me rotate the whole thing around the long axis of the tray, and accommodate sifting 4000+ 5.56 cases at once easily. Tripling the volume of the sifter and keeping the brass count constant - that should allow for enough tumbling to empty out all the media nicely.

So, from the top down...

Mixer
Tray top (inverted version of existing bottom, with handle at one end)
Tray middle (frame for support only, drilled through center lengthwise for rotating axis)
Tray bottom (existing)
Tote
Blue tarp underneath it all

Using that set up, I can build a supporting frame like mini sawhorses that would be the same height as the totes I am using, My process would become:

1) Finish mixer cycle
2) Dump media through open-top tray (bottom 2 pieces already placed on tote)
3) Insert center pole
4) Secure top piece
5) Pull out the tote & tray resting on it from under the mixer
6) Place the mini sawhorses to sides of the tote
7) Insert center pole
8) Remove the tote
9) Spin the trays

I can then dump a single tray of clean brass into whatever large container I need. 4,000 brass is doable if the final container is right next to me.

This will be an improvement upon my current method, which requires me to empty the tray by hand back into the mixer at least 2x-3x for brass-only tumbling to remove media. Keep in mind, it is hard to dump the whole tray back into the mixer - lots more weight with the media that's still in there. This will also allow me to run multiple mixers simultaneously using a single tote & one pair of sawhorses. Cleanup will be straightforward & simple.

Once I have my shop, I would do a few things differently...

a) Raise the mixer approximately 2' on a strong platform
b) Allow for a taller sawhorse
c) Permit a broader / wider / deeper tote underneath

This way, I can work standing upright. Much better to not have my back hunched over, and I really do prefer not putting my face not smack in the middle of all the dust. Cleanup will be easier with a bigger tote, too.

This method would also work well for stainless steel media + water, once in the shop. If it has enough height under the tote itself, I could even empty the water right there to a floor drain or siphon / hose, avoiding the need to move a large & heavy volume of water manually.

Thoughts?
ZA

[Don2]

ZombieApoc , looks like you got it all figured out..!!
Hope it works for you.
When you get it setup and working, post some pics.
I'd like to see you cool invention.

I was reading your tag line and it make me chuckle.
When I get frustrated in my shop over something, forget the video games, I get the 357 revolver out and go outside my shop and shoot a few cylinders of 357....that get the blood flowing again and I feel better and ready to tackle my project again..!!!!
Strange how that really works.

Don2

[jmain]

I experimented with getting rid of the media after doing research on how much lead is floating around when tumbling. The bigger you go, the more exposure...

So I tried a batch of warm water, dawn soap, brasso and simple green. Ran for 15 min, dumped liquids added a heating lamp and dried.
Came out cleaner than I would have thought. I did then run the cleaned brass through clean media and in just a few min they were as good as new.

[Crossfire]

We use this: http://www.dillonprecision.biz/?s=media+separator" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Media separator from Dillon.

[OnceFired]

I stumbled upon what might be a good solution for this situation. I was in the BBQ section of a sporting goods store when the idea hit me.

I have a bunch of these clamps...
http://www.homedepot.com/catalog/produc ... 9e_300.jpg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

And I could buy 3-4 of these grill replacements
http://www.academy.com/webapp/wcs/store ... te&Ntk=All" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I think I can arrange all three grates for minimal pass-through hole sizes, thread the clamp rail through, then re-attach the clamp heads and secure to the mixer.

Not bad for $12 fix, and I won't have to drill into the mixer. Still a pain to use, though. And the multiple layers might get brass stuck in there, although they shouldn't bend or ding because the whole grate system would still be rotating with the mixer.

[Dad24GreatKids]

We use this: http://www.dillonprecision.biz/?s=media+separator" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Media separator from Dillon.

I just purchased one of these and really like it. Easy to assemble and easy to use. Light weight and easy to move around since it is made primarily of plastic.

[OnceFired]

Okay, I finally have a good update here. I got into our rental house about 3 weeks ago, and the past two weekends after recovering from the act of MOVING, I got industrious again and got a few things done.

Got my first batch of citric acid in the mixer without other media - that worked nicely. About one 5 gallon bucket of brass, another 5 gallons of water, and not a lot of time elapsed. Maybe 30 minutes. I think I spent more time on rinsing than the initial acid bath & agitation, in fact.

I didn't have a great way of separating the brass from the water at this point. I originally did so by running them several more rounds in the mixer - each just for a handful of revolutions. But I don't like doing that - it makes me have to hand-cull more brass out due to dings from hitting steel.

So, in the spirit of having enough space now (just in my garage, not a separate shop yet!) I decided to have some fun and I am building my dedicated home made media separator.

I used 2x4's, 1/4" hardware cloth, 1-3/4" circular saw drill attachment, a 4 foot 1-1/2" wooden dowel, brass hinges and brass catches, a whole mess of 1" roof nails, and a handful of 3" deck screws. And a scrap piece of plywood because I ran out of hardware cloth. I of course already had the bottom portion of my tray built from previous efforts, so now I could focus on making the whole thing far more functional.

Here's a photo in progress
2013-10-19 21.29.47 by OnceFiredLakeCityBrass, on Flickr

One showing the back hinges with no top yet
2013-10-19 21.29.12 by OnceFiredLakeCityBrass, on Flickr

And the front
2013-10-19 21.28.52 by OnceFiredLakeCityBrass, on Flickr

And finished
2013-10-20 16.18.09 by OnceFiredLakeCityBrass, on Flickr

It opens up 180 degrees, allows me to easily replace the dowel, functions as a pass-through sieve if needed, etc.

2013-10-20 16.17.56 by OnceFiredLakeCityBrass, on Flickr

All I have left to do now is build the support frame to hold the dowel. I hope to do this with 2x4's as well, and have a couple galvanized fence post type U-shaped braces to help it spin nicely. More to come.

Update: Fixed images from Flickr that weren't working.

Once Fired

[Don2]

Okay, I finally have a good update here. I got into our rental house about 3 weeks ago, and the past two weekends after recovering from the act of MOVING, I got industrious again and got a few things done.

Got my first batch of citric acid in the mixer without other media - that worked nicely. About one 5 gallon bucket of brass, another 5 gallons of water, and not a lot of time elapsed. Maybe 30 minutes. I think I spent more time on rinsing than the initial acid bath & agitation, in fact.

I didn't have a great way of separating the brass from the water at this point. I originally did so by running them several more rounds in the mixer - each just for a handful of revolutions. But I don't like doing that - it makes me have to hand-cull more brass out due to dings from hitting steel.

So, in the spirit of having enough space now (just in my garage, not a separate shop yet!) I decided to have some fun and I am building my dedicated home made media separator.

I used 2x4's, 1/4" hardware cloth, 1-3/4" circular saw drill attachment, a 4 foot 1-1/2" wooden dowel, brass hinges and brass catches, a whole mess of 1" roof nails, and a handful of 3" deck screws. And a scrap piece of plywood because I ran out of hardware cloth. I of course already had the bottom portion of my tray built from previous efforts, so now I could focus on making the whole thing far more functional.


It opens up 180 degrees, allows me to easily replace the dowel, functions as a pass-through sieve if needed, etc.

All I have left to do now is build the support frame to hold the dowel. I hope to do this with 2x4's as well, and have a couple galvanized fence post type U-shaped braces to help it spin nicely. More to come.

Update: Fixed images from Flickr that weren't working.

Once Fired

Is this screen frame to be used on the mixer or by itself?
It looks good and should do the job well.

Don2

[OnceFired]

The media separator will go underneath the cement mixer, but mounted on support arms off the ground. The idea is to put it in the sweet spot so it is above whatever tray I use to catch the water or walnut media, but under the mouth of the mixer when pointed fully downward.

Here's a photo. The temporary setup was just the dowel resting on the storage totes, which wasn't high enough to clear the tray as-is. That's about 1/2 of a 5 gallon bucket of 5.56mm brass in there. So, in terms of volume it would handle 10 gallons of brass at once, with room for it all to move around and allow the media to fall out.

2013-10-21 21.02.25 by OnceFiredLakeCityBrass, on Flickr

[Don2]

The media separator will go underneath the cement mixer, but mounted on support arms off the ground. The idea is to put it in the sweet spot so it is above whatever tray I use to catch the water or walnut media, but under the mouth of the mixer when pointed fully downward.

Here's a photo. The temporary setup was just the dowel resting on the storage totes, which wasn't high enough to clear the tray as-is. That's about 1/2 of a 5 gallon bucket of 5.56mm brass in there. So, in terms of volume it would handle 10 gallons of brass at once, with room for it all to move around and allow the media to fall out.

[ Image ]2013-10-21 21.02.25 by OnceFiredLakeCityBrass, on Flickr

Looks good.
You are surely thinking BIG..!!

Don2