shoulder arms mfgd prior to the GCA '68

[saltydog452]

Were these pre GCA 68 factory manufactured, then legal, shoulder arms 'grandfathered in post GCA 68 and still legal to own?

If not, how can they be legally owned by the next of kin? Its unlikely that they were transferred from grand parent to parent and now to the current generation.

Thanks,

salty

[anygunanywhere]

Were these pre GCA 68 factory manufactured, then legal, shoulder arms 'grandfathered in post GCA 68 and still legal to own?

If not, how can they be legally owned by the next of kin? Its unlikely that they were transferred from grand parent to parent and now to the current generation.

Thanks,

salty

Are you asking about full auto shoulder arms or the semi auto/pump/bolt action varieties too?

[joe817]

Are you asking about full auto shoulder arms or the semi auto/pump/bolt action varieties too?

Good and valid question a.g.a.w.(forgive the abbreviation but your handle is too long to type. lol), but wouldn't a full auto shoulder arm come under the regulation of the National Firearms Act of 1934, instead of the GCA of 1968? I must admit my knowledge of full auto ownership is sorely lacking, but I've never had but a passing fantasy of owning one.

[anygunanywhere]

Are you asking about full auto shoulder arms or the semi auto/pump/bolt action varieties too?

Good and valid question a.g.a.w.(forgive the abbreviation but your handle is too long to type. lol), but wouldn't a full auto shoulder arm come under the regulation of the National Firearms Act of 1934, instead of the GCA of 1968? I must admit my knowledge of full auto ownership is sorely lacking, but I've never had but a passing fantasy of owning one.

You are correct.

I did not fully understand salty dog's question.

The GCA of 1968 did not affect pre-1968 long arms. I own many pre-1968 long guns, some acquired from private individuals, some purchased from FFLs.

During my days as an FFL i do not recall any ATF rules on pre-1968 long guns.

The GCA of 1968 did put restrictions on imported military arms under a "sporting purpose" clause that applied to firearms imported after the law went into effect. There were also requirements for individual serial numbers, which not all imports had.

The main focus of the 1968 GCA was to establish the FFL system, and defined whom could purchase firearms. It states that private sales within a state borders do not have to go through FFLs but sales/transfers across state lines do. Thank the GCA for the form 4473s.

[saltydog452]

OK, my bad. I don't know the difference with GCA 68, or the NFA of '34. I understand that the length issue was in the GCA '68.

The firearms are a Remington 870 and a Winchester lever action.

[anygunanywhere]

OK, my bad. I don't know the difference with GCA 68, or the NFA of '34. I understand that the length issue was in the GCA '68.

The firearms are a Remington 870 and a Winchester lever action.

As long as they meet the overall and barrel length requirements they are legal.

Short-barreled rifles (SBRs)—this category includes any firearm with a buttstock and either a rifled barrel under 16" long or an overall length under 26". The overall length is measured with any folding or collapsing stocks in the extended position. The category also includes firearms which came from the factory with a buttstock that was later removed by a third party.

Short barreled shotguns (SBSs)—this category is defined similarly to SBRs, but the barrel must be under 18" or a minimum overall length under 26". and the barrel must be a smoothbore.

Do with them what you want.

[The Annoyed Man]

Are you guys thinking of the 1986 FOPA, which said:

(o)(1) Except as provided in paragraph (2), it shall be unlawful for any person to transfer or possess a machinegun.

(2) This subsection does not apply with respect to—

(A) a transfer to or by, or possession by or under the authority of, the United States or any department or agency thereof or a State, or a department, agency, or political subdivision thereof; or

(B) any lawful transfer or lawful possession of a machinegun that was lawfully possessed before the date this subsection takes effect.

The new law was effective May 19,1986. The net effect was to make it unlawful to transfer any fully automatic weapon manufactured after 1986...........thereby causing about a 1,000% inflation in prices for items manufactured before 1986.

[joe817]

Not to change directions of the thread, but salty's question got me to thinking of what were the differences in the 2 laws? What I remembered was that:

1.) The NFA of 1934 banned open sales of fully automatic weapons and thus establishing the infamous $200 tax stamp, a national registry of fully automatic weapons, and the system of transferring of same.

2.) The GCA of 1968 banned catalog sales of ALL firearms categories; a system of firearms purchases through FFL's (except private sales). I know I've left out a lot of important stuff, that's important to others, but only what was a concern to me is what I remembered.

I ran across an interesting, but short article regarding the history of gun control:

"History of gun-control legislation".

http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/ ... story.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

And oddly enough, I find it somewhat factual.

[MechAg94]

OK, my bad. I don't know the difference with GCA 68, or the NFA of '34. I understand that the length issue was in the GCA '68.

The firearms are a Remington 870 and a Winchester lever action.

As long as they meet the overall and barrel length requirements they are legal.

Short-barreled rifles (SBRs)—this category includes any firearm with a buttstock and either a rifled barrel under 16" long or an overall length under 26". The overall length is measured with any folding or collapsing stocks in the extended position. The category also includes firearms which came from the factory with a buttstock that was later removed by a third party.

Short barreled shotguns (SBSs)—this category is defined similarly to SBRs, but the barrel must be under 18" or a minimum overall length under 26". and the barrel must be a smoothbore.

Do with them what you want.

I thought short barreled rifles/shotguns were also covered under the NFA of 1934. I thought a sawed off shotgun was the subject of that one lawsuit (Miller?).

[anygunanywhere]

OK, my bad. I don't know the difference with GCA 68, or the NFA of '34. I understand that the length issue was in the GCA '68.

The firearms are a Remington 870 and a Winchester lever action.

As long as they meet the overall and barrel length requirements they are legal.

Short-barreled rifles (SBRs)—this category includes any firearm with a buttstock and either a rifled barrel under 16" long or an overall length under 26". The overall length is measured with any folding or collapsing stocks in the extended position. The category also includes firearms which came from the factory with a buttstock that was later removed by a third party.

Short barreled shotguns (SBSs)—this category is defined similarly to SBRs, but the barrel must be under 18" or a minimum overall length under 26". and the barrel must be a smoothbore.

Do with them what you want.

I thought short barreled rifles/shotguns were also covered under the NFA of 1934. I thought a sawed off shotgun was the subject of that one lawsuit (Miller?).

They are. The NFA made them legal with the tax stamp. If the rifle or shotgun is shorter than the lengths given they are SBRs and SBSs and must be permitted under the tax stamp.

[Jumping Frog]

... but wouldn't a full auto shoulder arm come under the regulation of the National Firearms Act of 1934, instead of the GCA of 1968? I must admit my knowledge of full auto ownership is sorely lacking, but I've never had but a passing fantasy of owning one.

The NFA '34 required full auto firearms (hereinafter "FAF" ) used in interstate commerce to be registered with a $200 tax stamp.

If someone owned a FAF that they purchased in Texas, for example, and they never removed it from Texas, nobody bothered with the $200 tax stamp.

The GCA '68 had two effects on FAFs. First, it made it explIcit that ALL full auto firearms had to be registered with the $200 tax stamp to be legal regardless of intrastate or interstate.

Second, it provided a 30 day amnesty period to add any previously unregistered FAFs to the registry and pay the tax stamp. If you missed that 30 window, then those unregistered FAFs could never be added to the registry and could never again be possessed legally. There were literally millions of FAF war trophies from WWI, WWII, and Korea that came home with servicemen that were suddenly illegal to possess and impossible to register.

The GCA '68 allowed newly manufactured FAFs to be registered and sold to civilians.

That is what changed with the Hughes Amendment in 1986, when the registry was frozen forever. Previously registered FAFs can be transferred.

[joe817]

Good info J.F.! Thanks!

[saltydog452]

Your comments are appreciated. But, I didn't mention automatic.

My bad on the GCA 68, or whatever restrictions came before of after '68.

The question was, or should have been, directed to refr to firearms that were legal in length at the time of original purchase but now is a violation. A Winchester 'Trapper' lever action, and 870 with a barrel less than 18", both factory, bought in the late 50s/early 60s then legal, now not so much. Since these came from an Estate passed down from Grndparent, to Parent, and now to current descendent. Can they be legally passed down to the next family member?

Hopefully that is a bit clearer.

salty

[Rifleman55]

Some of the early Winchester trappers have been declared courious and relics and no longer need to be registered I doubt that the shotgun is on that list.

[saltydog452]

Thanks for the Trapper information.

As I understand it, in the 50s-60s, 870s with 18" barrels could be bought with no legal conflict for the owner. The problem with the 18" barrel was that some LEO,s JP Courts, etc, measured the barrels at slightly less than 18". That created more than few issues for the owners. In an attempt to prevent such problems for future owners, Remington then started making the short barrels at 18.25".