How does one legally manufacture a supressor?

[Kalrog]

Actually, if you build in the suppressor as a non removable part of the barrel and that makes it more than 16", then it is no longer an SBR, but you do still need the stamp because now it is a suppressor. So still 1 stamp for the item.

[Supercat]

Let me finish my 2 liter of coke and get some electrical tape,,,

I can never forget "on deadly ground"

[avid]

Here is a forum that might be of assistance in your endeavor,

http://www.silencertests.com/forum/inde ... efc5fe6ca0

[CleverNickname]

IIRC, the main body tube is the registered part for a silencer, (i.e. it's the part your Form 1 applies to) so it should be possible to make it in such a way that you can try several different kinds of internals without having to deal with the paperwork and tax every time. Double-check that in writing with ATF before risking it, though.

The body is typically the registered part, but the BATFE considers baffles also to be suppressors in and of themselves. You should only have one set of baffles per suppressor, otherwise the BATFE will consider the extra baffles to be an unregistered suppressor.

So yes, you could try out different types of baffles but you'd need to destroy one set prior to making another set.

[CleverNickname]

I am pretty sure that making it a threaded barrel does not mean it has to have a tax stamp. But many people thread on a suppressor to an SBR and then they both do need a stamp.

Correct. A rifle with a <16" barrel or <26" OAL is a title II firearm. A rifle with a >16" barrel and >26" OAL and a threaded barrel is not a title II firearm. A permanently attached sound suppressor is counted towards the barrel length of a rifle, just like a permanently attached flash suppressor is counted towards the barrel length of a rifle.

IMO though if you're going to spend the money to get a suppressor, permanently attaching it is pretty stupid.

[apostate]

and what if, by putting a suppressor on a pistol, it made it a sbr?????

You could put a 5", 10", 14" or 20" barrel on a pistol and it still would be a pistol rather than a SBR.

[frankie_the_yankee]

My Mini-14 has whatever barrel Ruger put on it. I don't know how long it is, but I'm sure it's longer than 16" because I bought it new from a store in RI and there's no way it was or is Class 3.

And as far as I know, threading the barrel itself doesn't make it Class 3. I could thread the barrel and put a flash hider or muzzle break on it without getting any special licenses whatsoever. The threaded barrel "problem" went away with the sunset of the AWB.

Kalrog, you must be talking about "The Gun Store". I've been there once. At some point I might get curious about what they have. But the main thing for me is the fun aspect of the project itself. I'm sure it will cost me more to make one than to buy one. I've just wanted to make one ever since I read the Tom Clancy book.

From looking over the Form 1 that someone helpfully posted, it does not seem that the rifle itself would become Class 3 just from having a supressor fitted for it. The supressor itself will have its own serial number. So I think that is the Class 3 element rather than the rifle.

I probably need to talk to a Class 3 dealer or some other expert on the subject of trying out different baffle designs. I do not think the baffles need to be serial numbered, just the supressor body. So it seems you could have 500 baffles, and if the supressor could only hold 5 at a time, you only have one useable supressor at any given moment. I haven't read the federal law myself yet (and wouldn't trust my own interpretation even after doing so), but I believe the part that refers to having the parts needed to make one being equivalent to having the unit itself applies only if you have ALL the parts, or nearly all of them. For instance, a baffle might be a metal disk with a hole in the center, and maybe a few other holes here and there. The supressor might take 5 of them. But no one is going to convince me that if I happen to have a metal disk in my garage with a hole in the middle, AND NO OTHER SUPRESSOR PARTS, that BATFE is going to raid my house and drag me off to prison for having an unregistered supressor.

But anyway, I probably need to talk to an expert about this part of it.

As to the loudness of a Mini-14, all I know is that:

1) Mine is awfully loud to me when I'm shooting it.

2) I once served as an RO at a "Rattle Battle" put on by a gun club I belonged to way back when. Six person teams would get 60 seconds to put as many rounds as possible into targets at 100 and 200 yards range using semi-auto rifles. Rifles were limited to .223 caliber. Almost everyone had either an AR-15 or a Mini-14. I can still remember walking around behind the line while teams were shooting, watching for safety violations while people were reloading. It was impossible not to notice that the Mini-14's were much louder than the AR's. It wasn't even close.

I have no idea what they might have sounded like on the other side of the muzzle (i.e. in front of it). But behind the firing line, the Minis were loud as all heck.

When I'm shooting mine, I am always behind it. So that's a major thing for me, besides what the neighbors might think.

2 liter soda pop bottles and duct tape? I wouldn't have the faintest idea what you are talking about.

[rm9792]

You are getting a lot of "expert" bad info here. You need to speak to several Class 3 dealers and compare their info. You can have threaded barrels and it is not registered. Go to any gun show and you can buy an HK with factory threaded barrel and walk away. You can buy "tactical" versions of some other pistols with threaded barrels as well. My GF bought a little Grendel .380 and it is factory threaded, no class 3 paperwork from AJC at a Houston show last year. How many rifles have threaded on flash hiders? Are you saying that if I remove the hider it is now a threaded barrel and I am a felon? IANAL but you do need to pay the tax before making your own and you are golden. You can manufacture your own just like you can make your own firearm, but selling requires more paperwork as you become a manufacturer. But again, dont even take my advice as gospel, get it from the pros.

Get the ATF forms and go to specialized web sites like mentioned earlier for solid advice. There was some good info on this thread but you cant separate the wheat from chaff since you dont know already. The are other ways of getting the paperwork signed other than chief LEO in your area which is why you need solid advice from several dealers or the ATF.

[frankie_the_yankee]

rm9792,

Thanks for the advice. I noticed the contradictions between some of the posts. As I stated, I don't think threading the barrel itself makes a gun Class 3. And I too have seen plenty of pistols with threaded barrels, rifles with flash supressors, muzzle breaks, etc. that were not Class 3.

In fact, for the heck of it, I just might thread the end of the barrel and buy a flash supressor and/or muzzle break and see what that does to the noise, if anything.

In my area, I'm not expecting any problems getting the forms signed.

I just need to do a bit more research and decide whether to go through with the project or not. (Out of basic fairness, I feel that Wife Unit needs to agree that I can lay out the money. I'll need to be buying some tools and such that will probably cost several times what it would cost to just buy a supressor. But as I said, that's the fun part. )

And thanks to everyone who offered advice, accurate or not. It's the thought that counts. And rest assured, I will check with experts with "boots on the ground" to make sure I stay within the law.

[rm9792]

No prob'. Usually I am requesting the advice of this group and it is almost always good. This subject though is not one many are familiar with and lots of old rules or urban legend floating around. I have researched this because as soon as my smith upgrades his milling machine I have first dibs on his old one so I plan on making a rifle and a pistol one myself. Just for the project cause i like to make things.

[CleverNickname]

I haven't read the federal law myself yet (and wouldn't trust my own interpretation even after doing so), but I believe the part that refers to having the parts needed to make one being equivalent to having the unit itself applies only if you have ALL the parts, or nearly all of them. For instance, a baffle might be a metal disk with a hole in the center, and maybe a few other holes here and there. The supressor might take 5 of them. But no one is going to convince me that if I happen to have a metal disk in my garage with a hole in the middle, AND NO OTHER SUPRESSOR PARTS, that BATFE is going to raid my house and drag me off to prison for having an unregistered supressor.

Here's the relevant law, 18 USC 921(a)(24).

(24) The terms “firearm silencer� and “firearm muffler� mean any device for silencing, muffling, or diminishing the report of a portable firearm, including any combination of parts, designed or redesigned, and intended for use in assembling or fabricating a firearm silencer or firearm muffler, and any part intended only for use in such assembly or fabrication.

Emphasis mine. Of course, just having some large washers that theoretically could be used as improvised baffles isn't illegal in and of itself, but if the BATFE happened to find out that someone had some washers and had reason to believe that they were planning on building an unregistered suppressor, then yes they could and probably would try to haul them into court, whether the suppressor had actually been built or not.

[frankie_the_yankee]

Emphasis mine. Of course, just having some large washers that theoretically could be used as improvised baffles isn't illegal in and of itself, but if the BATFE happened to find out that someone had some washers and had reason to believe that they were planning on building an unregistered suppressor, then yes they could and probably would try to haul them into court, whether the suppressor had actually been built or not.

Thanks.

Offhand, I would interpret "any combination of parts" to mean that you need to have ALL the parts, or nearly all of them, to have a problem.

You can't make a supressor without a body. So having a few fender washers floating around here or there is as legal as breathing as far as I can tell.

And let me make it clear that I am not planning on building an unregistered anything. Anything I do, I'm gpoing to jump through all of the required hoops first. Y'all can take that to the bank.

Remember the title of this thread. It's about how to legally manufacture a supressor.

[rm9792]

Feel free to give updates and pics when you do this. like I said, I want to build myself.