Shooting at Virginia Tech

[TheRising]

Hey guys, I sent a copy of my original post to both President Graham Spanier of Penn State University (my alma mater) and the Director of the PSU police department. Still haven't heard anything back.

Good luck with all that you can do. I plan on writing them until I get a response.

[G.A. Heath]

Lets get some information here. Out of a need to know I wonder how many of our existing laws this guy broke prior to committing the first murder. Word, according to fox news, is that he was a Chinese nation here on a student visa.

If so he could not legally buy, sell, or posses a fire arm correct?
if so he could not legally buy, sell, or posses ammunition correct?
He reportedly took multiple guns into a gun free zone, or in his case a victim rich environment.

Yep those gun control laws really do work, at disarming the victims.

[TheRising]

I have a suggestion for allowing students to carry on campus:

-Students must go through proper channels to first obtain their CHLs (this includes any necessary monetary obligations to state or local governing bodies including any necessary classes to obtain the license)

-Students must then participate in a month long class given at the school of attendance. This class will cover the law and scenarios extensively. The student will be continually warned of the consequences of showing their guns. They will also be given instruction on how to use their weapon. This class will cost the student out of their own pocket and will not be good for any credit. If a student can not pay, he/she will be allowed to volunteer their time to the university. The student will need to pass both a written test on the laws of their state, their university and must pass a shooting skills test.

-Students will be made to sign a "contract" with their university that outlines their responsibilities as a concealed handgun carrier.

-Students caught showing their gun (unless in a defensive life threatening situation) on campus will be subject to prosecution at both the state and university level. A suspension of the student or probation is the first step and a possible forced withdrawal from the semester. Harsh consequences breed students willing to follow the rules.

-Students found drinking at "house parties" or "dorm parties" when they are armed will be punished in the most severe way, usually expulsion.



Please add anything to this that you think may be helpful. I am planning to send this to both legislators and my alma mater President and Director of the Police department.

[Geister]

I have a better idea, TheRising. How about I carry a concealed firearm on campus WITHOUT having to ask for the school's permission? Especially since it's my inalienable Right. I shouldn't need to ask the school administration at all; it's none of their business. In fact, I'd prefer it if they didn't know that I carry at all.

As long as it's a public school supported by tax dollars they should have no say in the matter.

Your heart is in the right place but we need LESS gun control, not more. Gun control is ineffective.

[gigag04]

Your heart is in the right place but we need LESS gun control, not more. Gun control is ineffective.

Big +1. As a college student, my rights are no less protected by the constitution than yours. A university isn't any more special than any other place where you can carry

How would you like for the college students to get together on the forum and draft stricter provisions for YOU to carry at the places you frequent?

Like was said before, your heart is in the right place, but I feel like this is a bad idea.

-nick

[frankie_the_yankee]

I have a better idea, TheRising. How about I carry a concealed firearm on campus WITHOUT having to ask for the school's permission? Especially since it's my inalienable Right. I shouldn't need to ask the school administration at all; it's none of their business. In fact, I'd prefer it if they didn't know that I carry at all.

As long as it's a public school supported by tax dollars they should have no say in the matter.

Your heart is in the right place but we need LESS gun control, not more. Gun control is ineffective.

I think YOUR heart is in the right place geister, but I think some training should be required, just like we do for CHL's. These days, many people grow up without proper exposure to guns. Without some basic safety training, I think there would be accidents.

Actually, I know this to be true from my own very stupid experience as a young, albeit very lucky, fool (which I posted in another thread).

I'm a big fan of training. I think it is more necessary in the present day than it was in times past for the reason I cited above.

Like I said, your heart is in the right place. But we shouldn't let the perfect be the enemy of the good.

To me, If a university wanted to impose a comprehensive training requirement (both safety AND legal training) upon completion of which it would allow student and faculty CHL's to carry, I'd say, "Good deal."

[TheRising]

I have a better idea, TheRising. How about I carry a concealed firearm on campus WITHOUT having to ask for the school's permission? Especially since it's my inalienable Right. I shouldn't need to ask the school administration at all; it's none of their business. In fact, I'd prefer it if they didn't know that I carry at all.

As long as it's a public school supported by tax dollars they should have no say in the matter.

Your heart is in the right place but we need LESS gun control, not more. Gun control is ineffective.

Ya, that's great if you want to walk around with your head in the clouds. You must understand that we are trying to get things changed, and by walking around like a tough guy we're not going to get anything accomplished. I agree with you that we should all be allowed to carry where we want, but that is just not reality. You have to think it out more thoroughly than that.

Your heart is in the right place but we need LESS gun control, not more. Gun control is ineffective.

Big +1. As a college student, my rights are no less protected by the constitution than yours. A university isn't any more special than any other place where you can carry

How would you like for the college students to get together on the forum and draft stricter provisions for YOU to carry at the places you frequent?

Like was said before, your heart is in the right place, but I feel like this is a bad idea.

-nick

I wonder if you read ANY of my previous posts, Nick. I JUST GRADUATED FROM PENN STATE UNIVERSITY. I have been through trying to get the rules changed to no avail. Like I said to Geister, when you are dealing with the powers that be, it is better to take a little and give a little. It is best to not act childish in this situation. How much stricter could the laws get about carrying on campus???? Are you serious??? You aren't even allowed now!!! Come on, be serious.

[txinvestigator]

I have a better idea, TheRising. How about I carry a concealed firearm on campus WITHOUT having to ask for the school's permission? Especially since it's my inalienable Right. I shouldn't need to ask the school administration at all; it's none of their business. In fact, I'd prefer it if they didn't know that I carry at all.

As long as it's a public school supported by tax dollars they should have no say in the matter.

Your heart is in the right place but we need LESS gun control, not more. Gun control is ineffective.

Ya, that's great if you want to walk around with your head in the clouds. You must understand that we are trying to get things changed, and by walking around like a tough guy we're not going to get anything accomplished. I agree with you that we should all be allowed to carry where we want, but that is just not reality. You have to think it out more thoroughly than that.

Your heart is in the right place but we need LESS gun control, not more. Gun control is ineffective.

Big +1. As a college student, my rights are no less protected by the constitution than yours. A university isn't any more special than any other place where you can carry

How would you like for the college students to get together on the forum and draft stricter provisions for YOU to carry at the places you frequent?

Like was said before, your heart is in the right place, but I feel like this is a bad idea.

-nick

I wonder if you read ANY of my previous posts, Nick. I JUST GRADUATED FROM PENN STATE UNIVERSITY. I have been through trying to get the rules changed to no avail. Like I said to Geister, when you are dealing with the powers that be, it is better to take a little and give a little. It is best to not act childish in this situation. How much stricter could the laws get about carrying on campus???? Are you serious??? You aren't even allowed now!!! Come on, be serious.

You are really pushing it here, son. Calling people childish who disagree with you is NOT a sign of maturity and wisdom. NO one is acting like a tough guy, but there is someone acting like a spoiled kid.

[j1132s]

This is such a terrible news that I don't even know where to begin. I can't imagine what the victims' families and friends are going through right now, and I am saddened by this unfortunate even where so many innocent people died.

I hope this event can help bring more people over to allow conceal carry at more places so that people can defend themselves. However, we being responsible CHLers may have a different view than non-CHLers. I can't help but relate this event to the 9/11 terrorist even that prompted arming pilots.

[TheRising]

Thanks for confirming my suspiscions. While this may not go for most of you, I suspect you old guys just HATE it when a new, younger guy comes in with a new idea. Your tough and rugged "no compromise" attitude is the very reason why we have the restrictions we do when carrying our weapons. It is because of people like you TxInvestigator, that no one wants to deal with US. The collective outsider group of "anti's" see only old men with their rifles and shotguns on their doorstep, waiting for the liberals to walk by, and you have shown me much about this gun community you are a part of. When you decide to live in a world where compromises must be made for the whole, so that those of us who want to protect ourselves and them can, maybe your contribution will be heeded.

As for this forum, I appreciate all of the knowledge and wit that is passed around here, but I refuse to be part of a community of people that would rather be bull-headed in their approach, knowing nothing will be done about it, than taking a compromise so that we can protect the student who will replace us all in the future. You clearly have a problem with "young-blood" thoughts and new ideas. You are no longer the young guns of this issue and it kills you to deal with it. This issue needs a younger generation to relate to the younger and younger people who are running this country.

I have real world experience. I tried at my school of over 50,000 students to get the law changed with your old timer attitude and nothing was changed. Maybe if you would prepare yourself for the world you are living 10 years behind in, you would better understand my approach. But, to be honest, I could care less because I know you are already set in your ways. And that will get you nowhere. This isn't the rural South anymore, and you don't make the rules.

And for the record, please don't ever call me son again. My father is much more respectable than you will ever be.

This will be my last post. Feel free to do with it as you may. Hopefully you'll let a couple people read it.

[j1132s]

This will be my last post. Feel free to do with it as you may. Hopefully you'll let a couple people read it.

I think this forum is kind of like a good old boys club, and I too feel like an outsider. However, there are some unique things this forum can offer that I've not seen elsewhere, e.g. local to Texas, knowledgable people on TX CHL laws, and responsible, mature posters.

I post what I believe and don't embellish or pretend, and I've found many posters do just that. You don't find too many Internet forums with such a high percentage of generally truthful users.

Don't be too offended by TXInvestigator; otherwise, you'll not be able to sleep well tonight. He seems to know something about CHL laws, and I've learned a lot from him. However, his opinions may be, like you noticed, a bit rigid, and he's entitled to them and they are just opinions.

I remember during my college days, Internet email flame wars happen all the time. If I decided to quit the Internet back then, I'd b missing out on all this web stuff and forums.

[txinvestigator]

This will be my last post. Feel free to do with it as you may. Hopefully you'll let a couple people read it.

I think this forum is kind of like a good old boys club, and I too feel like an outsider. However, there are some unique things this forum can offer that I've not seen elsewhere, e.g. local to Texas, knowledgable people on TX CHL laws, and responsible, mature posters.

I post what I believe and don't embellish or pretend, and I've found many posters do just that. You don't find too many Internet forums with such a high percentage of generally truthful users.

Don't be too offended by TXInvestigator; otherwise, you'll not be able to sleep well tonight. He seems to know something about CHL laws, and I've learned a lot from him. However, his opinions may be, like you noticed, a bit rigid, and he's entitled to them and they are just opinions.

I remember during my college days, Internet email flame wars happen all the time. If I decided to quit the Internet back then, I'd b missing out on all this web stuff and forums.

So, in your opinion, it is acceptable to attack those with whom you disagree, rather than discuss and attempt to persuade?

It is "rigid" for me to object to that?

I admit, that is funny.

[pbandjelly]

http://www.roanoke.com/news/roanoke/wb/wb/xp-50658

Virginia Tech spokesman Larry Hincker was happy to hear the bill was defeated. "I'm sure the university community is appreciative of the General Assembly's actions because this will help parents, students, faculty and visitors feel safe on our campus."

AhThankYou

[pbandjelly]

So, in your opinion, it is acceptable to attack those with whom you disagree, rather than discuss and attempt to persuade?

It is "rigid" for me to object to that?

I admit, that is funny.

I am glad I am not the only one perplexed by this behaviour.
funny, I'm still in my 20's, but I guess I'm considered old....

[Wildscar]

So, in your opinion, it is acceptable to attack those with whom you disagree, rather than discuss and attempt to persuade?

It is "rigid" for me to object to that?

I admit, that is funny.

I am glad I am not the only one perplexed by this behaviour.
funny, I'm still in my 20's, but I guess I'm considered old....

Well theres on old saything that Im sure yall have heard before. May it will apply to a few of us old timers and shed some light for the youngens.

"To be old and wise you must first be young and stupid."

I'm sure he will see that an inyour face attitude isn't the best course to deal in politics. You have to go in with hard evidence thats backed by hard fact in a tactfull manner or you might as well be a ghost in the room.