NRA Gun Collectors Show & Seminar

[Chemist45]

I see that the 16th Annual NRA Gun Collectors Show & Seminar will be in Dallas on Aug 20th & 21st.

http://www.dallasarms.com/index.cfm/sho ... tors-show/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It will be hosted by the Dallas Arms Collector's Assn.
Ive never been to a DAC show. How are they?
When I have been to other "Collector's Association" shows they have been stuffy affairs full of people showing (But not selling) their collections.
Awards are handed out for best displays but very little sales of firearms goes on.
In fact, the attitude is one of snobbery. ("Oh we do have any black rifles here. That's an evil weapon.")

What can I expect from this show?

(Note: Its a four hour drive to Dallas. That's why I'm asking.)

[tacticool]

It looks like they don't honor a Texas CHL and they don't allow private sales. Those are enough for me to skip it even if it was a 15 minute drive.

[Wysiwyg101]

I see that the 16th Annual NRA Gun Collectors Show & Seminar will be in Dallas on Aug 20th & 21st.

http://www.dallasarms.com/index.cfm/sho ... tors-show/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It will be hosted by the Dallas Arms Collector's Assn.
Ive never been to a DAC show. How are they?
When I have been to other "Collector's Association" shows they have been stuffy affairs full of people showing (But not selling) their collections.
Awards are handed out for best displays but very little sales of firearms goes on.
In fact, the attitude is one of snobbery. ("Oh we do have any black rifles here. That's an evil weapon.")

What can I expect from this show?

(Note: Its a four hour drive to Dallas. That's why I'm asking.)

It's a big show. Yes, it has some of those tables that are setup more for display purposes and even some where they are selling jerky and jewelry and stuff like that. Both the gun shows I have been to (Dallas and Houston) had those features so I guess it's to be expected at most gun shows. However, this show is so large that there are far more gun tables, ammo table, accessory tables etc than there are those other kind of tables. And, I heard that they are starting to fill up the other hall as well. And there are lots and lots of black rifles...lol.

It looks like they don't honor a Texas CHL and they don't allow private sales. Those are enough for me to skip it even if it was a 15 minute drive.

I have been to the one here in Dallas once but I didn't buy anything. I may buy something next month, but, we'll see. I don't exactly know what you mean by not honoring CHL's. Nor by private sales. I saw several people walking around with rifles that had for sale signs on them. If by not honoring CHL's you mean they ask you to unload and safety your weapon then yeah, they do that. Most gun shows do from what I have heard.

[Texasdude29]

Perhaps I can explain more about the gun show at Market Hall which is now the largest gun show in the state of Texas with over 2,000 tables. The Dallas Arms Collects holds the gun show 5 times a year at Market Hall in Dallas. The DACA is made up of gun collectors, educator of weapons, and people who support the 2nd Amendment. Unlike the DACA Market Hall Gun Show the majority of gun shows around the country are put on by individual promoters as their line of business. The DACA is a not for profit 501(c)(3) organization. The Houston Gun Collectors that hold the show at Reliant is another not for profit gun club. The club members within the DACA cannot share in the money collected. Most of the money generated by the DACA goes for such things as Children's Scottish Rites Hospital, Circle 10 Boy Scouts, Girl Scouts, local SWAT teams for training and competition, equipment donations to local police department (i.e. radios, specialized weapons such as .50 caliber sniper rifles, etc.), education on gun collecting, donations to the Texas State Rifle Association, support of the NRA Firearms Museum, etc. Space is sold to vendors while collection displays are encouraged and generally given table space at no charge.

In order to maintain reasonable insurance rates the insurance company used for liability requires that ALL firearms, working or not, brought into the Dallas Market Hall Gun Show be checked to make sure they are NOT loaded, the clip or detachable magazine is out of the firearm while in the show, and the firearm is tied (i.e. with a plastic tie) to make the firearm inoperable while in the show. There are signs at the gun show entrance to unload your firearm, CHL or othewise, and NO loose ammo is allowed. Boxes of ammo must be in sealed bags or be taped shut while in the show. Ammo vendors within the show must have their ammo sealer or taped shut too. Gun vendors who have firearms for sale must have magazines or clips out of the gun, the guns tied, and handguns either in a case or with a cable alarm through the trigger guard to discourage theft. People who have gun collections on display are not required to have their guns tied because they are not for sale and do not have people picking them up and handling the firearm. If the firearm is for sale or can be readily picked up then no clip and the firearm is tied.

There are numerous signs that say, "No Loaded Guns" or "No Loose Ammo". In the last 3 year period there were enough "UNLOADED" guns and gun "NOT LOADED" brought to the gun checking table to fill a 5 gallon plastic Ozarka style water bottle. At the last gun show I found 3 guns in a row that had live ammo in the chamber in the first 10 minutes of the gun show being open. The DACA is NOT anti-CHL because most of the members have their CHL. If you have a CHL carry gun un load it from the chamber and clip. Leave the ammo in the car along with the gun. If you want to bring the gun into the show, unloaded, no loose ammo, get it verified that it is unload and the tie signifies that it has been checked for everyone to quickly visualize it is inoperable.

Since the Dallas Arms Collectors Assn. is a National Rifle Association gun club, their August 2011 has been selected as the NRA National Gun Show for the DACA's work in promoting the shooting sports and the right of the 2nd amendment. Hopefully this will make several areas clearer for use with CHL and gun show requirements.

[gemini]

Txdude29, Do you know details of the live NRA benefit auction? Day, times and (hopefully) a catalog of items to be auctioned?
Thanks

[jimlongley]

Perhaps I can explain more about the gun show at Market Hall which is now the largest gun show in the state of Texas with over 2,000 tables. The Dallas Arms Collects holds the gun show 5 times a year at Market Hall in Dallas. The DACA is made up of gun collectors, educator of weapons, and people who support the 2nd Amendment. Unlike the DACA Market Hall Gun Show the majority of gun shows around the country are put on by individual promoters as their line of business. The DACA is a not for profit 501(c)(3) organization. The Houston Gun Collectors that hold the show at Reliant is another not for profit gun club. The club members within the DACA cannot share in the money collected. Most of the money generated by the DACA goes for such things as Children's Scottish Rites Hospital, Circle 10 Boy Scouts, Girl Scouts, local SWAT teams for training and competition, equipment donations to local police department (i.e. radios, specialized weapons such as .50 caliber sniper rifles, etc.), education on gun collecting, donations to the Texas State Rifle Association, support of the NRA Firearms Museum, etc. Space is sold to vendors while collection displays are encouraged and generally given table space at no charge.

In order to maintain reasonable insurance rates the insurance company used for liability requires that ALL firearms, working or not, brought into the Dallas Market Hall Gun Show be checked to make sure they are NOT loaded, the clip or detachable magazine is out of the firearm while in the show, and the firearm is tied (i.e. with a plastic tie) to make the firearm inoperable while in the show. There are signs at the gun show entrance to unload your firearm, CHL or othewise, and NO loose ammo is allowed. Boxes of ammo must be in sealed bags or be taped shut while in the show. Ammo vendors within the show must have their ammo sealer or taped shut too. Gun vendors who have firearms for sale must have magazines or clips out of the gun, the guns tied, and handguns either in a case or with a cable alarm through the trigger guard to discourage theft. People who have gun collections on display are not required to have their guns tied because they are not for sale and do not have people picking them up and handling the firearm. If the firearm is for sale or can be readily picked up then no clip and the firearm is tied.

There are numerous signs that say, "No Loaded Guns" or "No Loose Ammo". In the last 3 year period there were enough "UNLOADED" guns and gun "NOT LOADED" brought to the gun checking table to fill a 5 gallon plastic Ozarka style water bottle. At the last gun show I found 3 guns in a row that had live ammo in the chamber in the first 10 minutes of the gun show being open. The DACA is NOT anti-CHL because most of the members have their CHL. If you have a CHL carry gun un load it from the chamber and clip. Leave the ammo in the car along with the gun. If you want to bring the gun into the show, unloaded, no loose ammo, get it verified that it is unload and the tie signifies that it has been checked for everyone to quickly visualize it is inoperable.

Since the Dallas Arms Collectors Assn. is a National Rifle Association gun club, their August 2011 has been selected as the NRA National Gun Show for the DACA's work in promoting the shooting sports and the right of the 2nd amendment. Hopefully this will make several areas clearer for use with CHL and gun show requirements.

So it's the insurance company that's violating the law?

Went to the gun show in Allen this past week. Never saw a 30.06 sign, legitimate or otherwise, was never asked if I was carrying, no one ever stated, nor did I see any signage indicating that my carry gun must be exposed etc, they tie-wrapped my Flobert, and in we went.

[Texasdude29]

Perhaps I can explain more about the gun show at Market Hall which is now the largest gun show in the state of Texas with over 2,000 tables. The Dallas Arms Collects holds the gun show 5 times a year at Market Hall in Dallas. The DACA is made up of gun collectors, educator of weapons, and people who support the 2nd Amendment. Unlike the DACA Market Hall Gun Show the majority of gun shows around the country are put on by individual promoters as their line of business. The DACA is a not for profit 501(c)(3) organization. The Houston Gun Collectors that hold the show at Reliant is another not for profit gun club. The club members within the DACA cannot share in the money collected. Most of the money generated by the DACA goes for such things as Children's Scottish Rites Hospital, Circle 10 Boy Scouts, Girl Scouts, local SWAT teams for training and competition, equipment donations to local police department (i.e. radios, specialized weapons such as .50 caliber sniper rifles, etc.), education on gun collecting, donations to the Texas State Rifle Association, support of the NRA Firearms Museum, etc. Space is sold to vendors while collection displays are encouraged and generally given table space at no charge.

In order to maintain reasonable insurance rates the insurance company used for liability requires that ALL firearms, working or not, brought into the Dallas Market Hall Gun Show be checked to make sure they are NOT loaded, the clip or detachable magazine is out of the firearm while in the show, and the firearm is tied (i.e. with a plastic tie) to make the firearm inoperable while in the show. There are signs at the gun show entrance to unload your firearm, CHL or othewise, and NO loose ammo is allowed. Boxes of ammo must be in sealed bags or be taped shut while in the show. Ammo vendors within the show must have their ammo sealer or taped shut too. Gun vendors who have firearms for sale must have magazines or clips out of the gun, the guns tied, and handguns either in a case or with a cable alarm through the trigger guard to discourage theft. People who have gun collections on display are not required to have their guns tied because they are not for sale and do not have people picking them up and handling the firearm. If the firearm is for sale or can be readily picked up then no clip and the firearm is tied.

There are numerous signs that say, "No Loaded Guns" or "No Loose Ammo". In the last 3 year period there were enough "UNLOADED" guns and gun "NOT LOADED" brought to the gun checking table to fill a 5 gallon plastic Ozarka style water bottle. At the last gun show I found 3 guns in a row that had live ammo in the chamber in the first 10 minutes of the gun show being open. The DACA is NOT anti-CHL because most of the members have their CHL. If you have a CHL carry gun un load it from the chamber and clip. Leave the ammo in the car along with the gun. If you want to bring the gun into the show, unloaded, no loose ammo, get it verified that it is unload and the tie signifies that it has been checked for everyone to quickly visualize it is inoperable.

Since the Dallas Arms Collectors Assn. is a National Rifle Association gun club, their August 2011 has been selected as the NRA National Gun Show for the DACA's work in promoting the shooting sports and the right of the 2nd amendment. Hopefully this will make several areas clearer for use with CHL and gun show requirements.

So it's the insurance company that's violating the law?

Went to the gun show in Allen this past week. Never saw a 30.06 sign, legitimate or otherwise, was never asked if I was carrying, no one ever stated, nor did I see any signage indicating that my carry gun must be exposed etc, they tie-wrapped my Flobert, and in we went.

Jimlongley,

I too went to the Allen gun show this weekend. There was not a 30.06 sign that I saw and like you I was never asked if I was carrying a handgun. I witnessed an incidence that happened at the show this weekend that scared the jibbies out of me and made me a firm believer that guns should be checked to see if they are loaded or not BEFORE coming into the door of a gun show. Or said another way, you may be at the mercy of another person's unsafe gun handling practices.

As I was about to leave the Allen show I stopped by a holster vendor's table. As we were talking a person walks up to the table and wants a holster for his Glock. He reaches under his shirt and pulls one out. The gun is not tied. He drops the magazine which is loaded and checks the holster for proper fit sliding it in and out of the holster. His finger is ON the trigger the entire time. The holster vendor asks him if the gun is loaded. The guy says, "Of course it is UNLOADED! There is the magazine right on your table." We all start backing up as the gun is pointed at his girl friend's belly. "See?" His finger is still on the trigger. The holster vendor quickly pushes the guy's gun hand away from his girl friend and asks him to pull the slide back just to make sure there is not a round in the chamber. He points the gun this time at the holster vendor and pulls the slide back. Out pops a LIVE round. The guy's girl friend said, "He was about to mess up." He sticks the loose round in his pocket, puts the loaded clip back in the gun, racks the slide back for another round in the chamber, puts the gun back in his belt and walks off.

The 3 of us still at the table just look at each other. The vendor selling the holsters said he is getting tired of people pointing a loaded gun at him. He went on to say that another dealer found a guy walking around with a .264 Winchester Magnum with 3 rounds in the magazine earlier in the day. According to him a rifle that already has the appropriate color tie on it does not get checked again to see if it loaded or not. I hope it this is not the case.

To answer your question about the insurance company violating the CHL law. The Allen Event Center, I believe is a government owned or managed building, but I am not positive. I do not know what their insurance requirements are to hold a gun show at the facility and it is a very nice location. Dallas Market Hall on Stemmons Freeway is the LARGEST PRIVATELY owned exhibit hall in the U.S., according to their web page. When the Dallas Arms Collectors leases Market Hall for a gun show, Market Hall requires the club to have a certain amount of insurance. Over the past several years a number of insurance companies have been reviewed. ALL (ALL!)the insurance companies reviewed require all firearms coming into the gun show at Market Hall be checked to determine that they are not loaded, magazines or detachable clips are unloaded and removed from the gun, and no loose ammo. Bulk powder can also be sold at the DACA Market Hall. This is not always the case as to some exhibit halls such as Dallas Convention Center will not allow smokeless gun powder to be sold in their venue. I think the Texas State Rifle Gun Show coming up in Mesquite this weekend requires all firearms to be checked and tied. Each venue is probably different from the others. When the Dallas Arms Collectors decided to have their gun show at Market Hall, it was required to get insurance. If you know of an insurance company that does not require guns to be checked to see if they are loaded, no loose ammo, all firearms to be be tied, and the insurance is at a reasonable rate, please let me know and I pass it along to my buddies at the DACA. Not checking guns resulted in insurance rates being prohibitive. Since it was written into the contact and signed by the DACA the organization has to live up their side of the obligation and the terms of the contract. Best regards,

Texasdude29

[jimlongley]

To answer your question about the insurance company violating the CHL law. The Allen Event Center, I believe is a government owned or managed building, but I am not positive. I do not know what their insurance requirements are to hold a gun show at the facility and it is a very nice location. Dallas Market Hall on Stemmons Freeway is the LARGEST PRIVATELY owned exhibit hall in the U.S., according to their web page. When the Dallas Arms Collectors leases Market Hall for a gun show, Market Hall requires the club to have a certain amount of insurance. Over the past several years a number of insurance companies have been reviewed. ALL (ALL!)the insurance companies reviewed require all firearms coming into the gun show at Market Hall be checked to determine that they are not loaded, magazines or detachable clips are unloaded and removed from the gun, and no loose ammo. Bulk powder can also be sold at the DACA Market Hall. This is not always the case as to some exhibit halls such as Dallas Convention Center will not allow smokeless gun powder to be sold in their venue. I think the Texas State Rifle Gun Show coming up in Mesquite this weekend requires all firearms to be checked and tied. Each venue is probably different from the others. When the Dallas Arms Collectors decided to have their gun show at Market Hall, it was required to get insurance. If you know of an insurance company that does not require guns to be checked to see if they are loaded, no loose ammo, all firearms to be be tied, and the insurance is at a reasonable rate, please let me know and I pass it along to my buddies at the DACA. Not checking guns resulted in insurance rates being prohibitive. Since it was written into the contact and signed by the DACA the organization has to live up their side of the obligation and the terms of the contract. Best regards,

Texasdude29

So a 30.06 sign would be legitimate at Market Hall no matter who required it to be posted.

My collateral question is: Does the same, or any other for that matter, insurance company require a 30.06 or "No Loaded Guns" policy at Fair Park when the show is held there? And Dallas Convention Center?

[Texasdude29]

I have no idea what other facilities, promoters, clubs or their insurance companies require whether it is Houston, Mesquite, Fort Worth, etc.

In all due respects, you can bring a pistol, rifle, shotgun, and your CHL handgun into the Dallas Arms Collectors Market Hall gun show, but ALL guns, dealer and vendor, have to be unloaded before you get to the front door, ALL must be checked, detachable clips out of the gun and remain out of the gun while in the show, and tied to make them unable to fire. ALL ammo whether loose or in boxes have to be sealed. "Sealed" means the boxes have to be taped shut, plastic wrap over ammo cans, or loose ammo in plastic sealed bags. YES, you can bring your CHL into the Dallas Arms Collectors Market Hall Gun Show, but remember it must be unloaded BEFORE coming into the building, verified at the front door it is unload and tied to signify it has been checked and is inoperable while in the show. Put your loose ammo in a sealed container BEFORE you get to the front door with your CHL pistol and you're good to go after being checked. A sealer container can be a plastic sealed bag, snuff tin with tape around it, old Mason jar with a lid, etc. just as long as the ammo is in a sealed container. The only exception to the loaded gun rule are active commissioned police officers either in uniform or plain clothes. I carry my CHL pistol in the show, it is unloaded, tied, clip out of the gun, and my ammo is one bag in my pocket and the clip is in my other pocket. As soon as I leave the building the tie is cut and a loaded clip is placed in the magazine as soon as I get in my car.

The Dallas Arms Collectors at Market Hall really strives to make the show as safe as possible and that people don't go around the show with their finger on the trigger with a round in the chamber. To me, these safety measures go a long way for my peace of mind in knowing someone took the time to check to make sure sure firearms are unloaded and cared enough to make a gun show. I hope this helps everyone why certain procedures are in place and that is to have a safe and enjoyable show. Yep, in talking with the guys at the Dallas Arms Collectors they love CHL people coming to their shows. Just no loaded magazines or gun while in the show.

Texasdude29

[RSJ]

Went to the gun show in Allen this past week. Never saw a 30.06 sign, legitimate or otherwise, was never asked if I was carrying, no one ever stated, nor did I see any signage indicating that my carry gun must be exposed etc, they tie-wrapped my Flobert, and in we went.

I was there both days, a (seemed valid) 30.06 was at the only entrance. It was on an art easel, and was to the right of the inside of the door.

[DoubleJ]

I recently downloaded the ESPN Radio app, and have been keeping up with my Dallas sports teams since moving (yay, me!).
anyway, this morning they had Kelly Webster, from 103.3 ESPN Dallas doing a "live remote" out at the Gun Show!

I couldn't have been happier. that is some great advertising, and that's something great to get more folks into firearms. Not that you really need that down there in Texas, but still...

anywho, did anyone go to the show and/or see the ESPN booth? Woulda been kinda cool to go talk to those folks, cause that's two things I def miss about Texas, gunshows, and dallas sports...

[Bulldog1911]

When I first learned that I wouldn't be allowed to carry into a gun show, I was kinda disgruntled. I mean, it's a GUN SHOW, and I can't carry my gun in(concealed and loaded)? But after reading some threads here, I agree that it is probably best(safest) for them to make sure all guns are unloaded. So, I accept that. After all, just because someone owns a gun, doesn't mean they are going to be safe with it...

Anyway, here is my question. Can they legally stop you from carrying? Doesn't the 30.06 sign have to be posted by the building owner and not the renter? The NRA or whoever is hosting, does not own market hall, so to me it seems they have no say so.

On a side note, do the old dudes at the entrance have to be such...Jerks...? My buddy went in looking for a laser for his M&P compact. He emptied the chamber in the car, dropped the magazine out and put it in his pocket. Went to the front and was asked if he had any guns. He said yes, pulled it out and let the guy inspect it. The guy zip tied it, and asked if he had the magazine. Yes in my pocket, and he pulled it out to show him. The guy saw that he had rounds in the mag and ripped it out his hand and yelled at him that he can't carry ammo inside. Furiously emptied the magazine and dropped the rounds in the ozarka bucket.

As the idiot is stripping rounds out of the magazine, my buddy says, I'll go put them back in my truck. "NO!!!!!!!, there not allowed in here, you shouldn't have brought them in!!!" In an obnoxiously loud voice.
I mean seriously....He lost $20 worth of PDX1's.

The guy was obviously suffering from a major inferiority complex, and went on a power trip.

[OldCannon]

As the idiot is stripping rounds out of the magazine, my buddy says, I'll go put them back in my truck. "NO!!!!!!!, there not allowed in here, you shouldn't have brought them in!!!" In an obnoxiously loud voice.
I mean seriously....He lost $20 worth of PDX1's.

The guy was obviously suffering from a major inferiority complex, and went on a power trip.

Probably unemployed Range Officers

[wheelgun1958]

As the idiot is stripping rounds out of the magazine, my buddy says, I'll go put them back in my truck. "NO!!!!!!!, there not allowed in here, you shouldn't have brought them in!!!" In an obnoxiously loud voice.
I mean seriously....He lost $20 worth of PDX1's.

The guy was obviously suffering from a major inferiority complex, and went on a power trip.

Probably unemployed Range Officers

From Quail Creek.

[The Annoyed Man]

As the idiot is stripping rounds out of the magazine, my buddy says, I'll go put them back in my truck. "NO!!!!!!!, there not allowed in here, you shouldn't have brought them in!!!" In an obnoxiously loud voice.
I mean seriously....He lost $20 worth of PDX1's.

The guy was obviously suffering from a major inferiority complex, and went on a power trip.

Probably unemployed Range Officers

....from Quail Creek.

I have very mixed feelings about 30.06 at gun shows. On the one hand, SHAME on them! I practice good gun safety. They don't need to make the show safe by barring me from carrying my gun inside.........

.........on the other hand, they do probably need to make the show safe by barring the 1 out of 100 people at the show who does not practice good gun safety from carrying their gun inside. I don't have health insurance, and my finances aren't really set up for me to absorb a bullet from someone else's idiocy. The problem of course is that they can't tell the few idiots from the majority of smart folks until after somebody gets a new orifice in their body where there wasn't one before. All of that is to say that I do understand where they are coming from.

But the bottom line for me is that life is not without risks. I risk getting shot because I looked at someone cross-eyed in the Walmart parking lot, etc., etc., etc. I wonder why it is that insurance companies can't simply write policies stating categorically that they will not cover injuries due to accidental gunshot. That would solve the problem. Then you attend the show at your own risk.......which you already do anyway (as demonstrated by the above incident with the Glock-carrying cretin at the holster-maker's table.

I would much rather carry into the show than not. Even so, a gunshow is one exception I will make to my general rule of not frequenting establishments that don't want me in there if I'm armed.

EDIT: See that? I was getting all wordy and stuff, and wheelgun1958 beat me to the Quall Creek joke by a few minutes.