Collapsable Baton?

[WildBill]

I find it amusing that when some people get a permit to carry a handgun, they start asking questions about carrying batons, clubs, blackjacks, switchblades and handcuffs.

[Heartland Patriot]

Well, since this thing is still going, I'll add 2 cents worth and a question. It seems that the law being vague can be used by SOME overzealous parties to give you a ride to their place of employment if they catch you with something they interpret to be illegal. However, it also seems that a GOOD lawyer could also use that same vagueness to get that thrown out. Unfortunately, there are a lot of variables to the whole deal...most of us law-abiding types will err on the side of caution. And that is what is so maddening about the deal: the BGs don't err on the side of caution, in carrying ANY sort of weapon upon them, legal or not (mostly not). Now, my question...my wife bought me a MINI-KBar type knife. The blade is less than the 5.5 inches as stated in the penal code, BUT part of the tip is semi-sharpened upon the back side. Does this make it double edge? Would this be a legal knife to carry? And I'm not really talking about daily carry, but if you were in public with it on (say, coming back from "the ranch" and you went into Wal-Mart), could you get busted for it? I haven't actually done this, but I could easily envision it happening.
Anyway, like I said, 2 cents and a question. Thanks.

[WildBill]

The blade is less than the 5.5 inches as stated in the penal code, BUT part of the tip is semi-sharpened upon the back side. Does this make it double edge?

IANAL, but I think that this is what is called a "false edge" and is legal. I feel your pain about us "legals" following the law and the BGs don't care.

[Ol Zeke]

I find it amusing that when some people get a permit to carry a handgun, they start asking questions about carrying batons, clubs, blackjacks, switchblades and handcuffs.

I’m soooo happy you are amused…..

I think they are just curious, most having just had their first exposure to the laws pertaining to weapons (in their CHL Class).

Personally, I’m infuriated by such laws. The fact that most of these particular laws, have been on the books since the Civil War, is only testament to how easily a free society can be convinced to give up their liberties.

How anyone, with an IQ above room temperature, could somehow believe that the way to stop criminals is to outlaw possession of weapons by everyone, is beyond me.

Most laws are equally ridiculous, in one way or another.

I think Ayn Rand had it right:

The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals, one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws.
Ayn Rand

[srothstein]

After I snipped the quot eof the law to save space:

Is this post going to be completely ignored? Why would they have included CHL holders (carrying a gun and license...) in the same list with judges, officers and the such if they didnt mean it? Does someone have a good arguement as to why it is not legal for a chl holder to carry a pistol (of proper type) a license and a...switchblade? (choosing the most evil knife known to man )

It is not legal for a CHL to carry a switchblade because they are prohibited weapons under PC 46.05, so the CHL exemption does not cover them at all.

But, the debate about illegal knives continues. They include spears, throwing knives, swords, and any blade over 5.5 inches. To tell the truth, I am not sure if they are legal or not. I know, in my heart and without any proof, that it was not the intent of the legislature to allow them to be carried. But I also know, from my training, that the intent of the legislature is only supposed to be considered when the plain language of the statute is unclear. To me, the plain language is pretty clear, but I would never advise someone to trust my interpretation of a law like that.

Heartland Patriot has a sort of point about the interpretation of laws by overzealous people. One of the things I was taught, and taught to other officers, was that there are places that the interpretation of the law is very debatable. And when the law is subject to varying interpretations, I always interpret it in the most favorable way to me. That may not always be the most favorable way to you. I did point out to trainees that one of the greatest flaws, and greatest strengths, of Texas laws is that they are designed to be enforced with lots of common sense applied. If you do not stretch the interpretation but stick with something that can easily be seen as valid, you generally do not have problems. You will have problems with the court if you try to bend and stretch the law way out of what is reasonable.

This point of law is clearly a reasonable interpretation in either direction. An officer who is anti-weapon may make a reasonable argument when he arrests you. You may make a reasonable argument in court. If you win in court, it makes things better for the next guy, who can use your case to help prove his. Of course, even a win in court means you already spent some time in jail. If you win, the officer is not really out anything. He might even be considered as coming out ahead if he gets the overtime pay for appearing in court. He would not get in trouble for a reasonable interpretation.

And you do stand a risk of losing in court, which could be a significant loss. The officer does not really gain anything except the overtime pay again. Do you want to take that risk?

And this is why I advise people to be much more cautious about interpreting the law. You need to be aware of what you are risking when you make those kind of decisions. Know what the chances are, know what you are risking, know what you are willing to risk, and then make your decision on your own.

[speedsix]

...I'm with Ol Zeke...they find it much easier to legislate the object, and lay more laws on the law-abiding, than to punish those who misuse the object, and leave the rest of us alone...that's cowardly, but it doesn't disturb their voting chickens...and the votes come rolling down the chute as long as they don't do that...

...I read 46.15 (b) (6) as making a singular exception to 46.02

..." a person who is: carrying a handgun
and
(carrying) a valid license..."

...but then my Ainglish isn't modern...may even be outdated...so others may read it differently

[AustinMRH]

Steve's post above says all that needs to be said. Until somebody comes along and provides some nice case law for me to base baton carry on, I'll leave the ASP at home.

I'm still carrying my bamboo stick for night time trail running.

[speedsix]

...now you don't KNOW just how badly I needed to say what I posted...so there...my stick's crepe myrtle and if he's runnin'...it ain't me!!!

[WildBill]

Steve's post above says all that needs to be said. Until somebody comes along and provides some nice case law for me to base baton carry on, I'll leave the ASP at home.

I'm still carrying my bamboo stick for night time trail running.

There is plenty of case law that has ruled that you can not carry a baton.

[MMac]

Canes are cool because they are perfectly legal, even to carry though an airport and onto a plane. I still need to get me one, have virtually every other weapon including multiple short canes (Arnis/Escrima sticks). Great weapon if you know how to use one.

[speedsix]

...I hadda do away with a young crepe myrtle after the freeze/ice storm last year...got two good sticks outa it...free...not fancy but light and tough...dries well ...my bark's not cracking at all...3/4-7/8" and about 36"...

[KD5NRH]

So...if I can get my hands on a Peel P50, would I technically be in violation of anything while carrying the car if there's a club inside it?

Could I drag it into a college classroom while my handgun is under the seat?

100MPG sounds really good right about now, especially since most of my driving is in town and 40MPH would be plenty of speed for that.

[speedsix]

...yup...if you're bringing it into the classroom, and keeping your personal stuff in it...it's become a designer purse...and you can't carry in your purse, either...neat little critter, but I'd hate to see one after Granny Smith didn't...with her Ford 250...

[HotLeadSolutions]

...yup...if you're bringing it into the classroom, and keeping your personal stuff in it...it's become a designer purse...and you can't carry in your purse, either...neat little critter, but I'd hate to see one after Granny Smith didn't...with her Ford 250...

THATS where we NEED legislation! Old drivers are becoming a pandemic!
I can read the bumber sticker now...

Guns don't kill people Granny Smith does. (not to be confused with Granny Smith pies..they just taste good )

[speedsix]

...blueberry and peach...