Story on Glock legal problems

[TDDude]

Mr. 72,

We are in 100 percent agreement.

The article is loaded with mounds of "He-Said-She-Saids". Who knows what happened and it will probably take years to figure it out.

Also, it is my non-provable belief that ALL white collar federal prosecutions are politically motivated to some degree. I firmly believe that had Mr. Glock funnelled a bunch of that "Monopoly Money" into the Obama campaign, this case would not have seen the light of day. Do I agree with it? NOPE!! Do I like it?? NOPE!! That's just the way it is.

If Glock fiddled the books like what's implied, then they need to take a bath on this.

[seamusTX]

Also, it is my non-provable belief that ALL white collar federal prosecutions are politically motivated to some degree.

It's not provable.

Look at the number of campaign contributors like Enron executives and Madoff that were prosecuted during the George W. Bush administration, or Republican politicians who were prosecuted either by the U.S.D.O.J. or U.S. district attorneys appointed by the President.

Probably every administration has had some lower-level appointees prosecuted by people working for the same president that appointed them.

The majority of federal prosecutions are against drug dealers, embezzlers, mobsters, counterfeiters, and the like with no political aspect.

Sure, sometimes they are politically motivated.

- Jim

[CHL/LEO]

Texas traffic laws are the same way. If an officer wants to pull over a car, it only would take a couple minutes before the officer would observe some sort of infraction and the lights can come on.

We were taught that if you follow someone for a mile (not on the hwy but in town) and can't find some violation of the Transportation Code then you are either ignorant of the code or just not observant.

We once had a DPS trooper share with us some nuances of the code and how it was written so that just about no one could ever obey it all the time. He was the primary TC instructor for DPS and said that there was no one in Texas that he couldn't follow for a short distance and then legally pull over for violating one of the traffic laws.

The bottom line - the TC gives plenty of PC opportunities to stop just about anyone driving in Texas. Now, what you "can do" and what you "should do" are two different matters.

[surprise_i'm_armed]

Purplehood:

Thank you for the correction. I said Glock donated $50,000, but I guess there was
an additional 65K for something else.

I didn't have my copy of the magazine available for fact-checking.

After I read it I give it to my friend who carries his XD .40 24/7, but still won't join
the NRA to protect his 2A rights. Sheesh!

SIA

[mr.72]

After I read it I give it to my friend who carries his XD .40 24/7, but still won't join
the NRA to protect his 2A rights. Sheesh!

Perhaps there are other reasons people who support 2A rights don't join the NRA.

And FWIW the $115K Glock gave to the NRA is chump change for a company awash in profits giving to an organization that clearly is supporting the very market upon which the company relies. But maybe Glock, a maker of defensive handguns, is reluctant to throw much more support towards an outfit who has the appearance to only be supported by a tiny fringe of gun owners in the USA, is easily politically demonized, and often falls into the trap of being seen as an organization supporting hunters and not much else.

Sorry this is OT...

There are probably gun manufacturers out there who are in the USA to begin with, not committing or even accused of committing a whole host of crimes, and also even support your favorite 2A organization with a higher percentage of their profits, from whom you could be buying your guns. Maybe I am only saying this so the demand for Glock pistols will go down and their prices will come down a little so I can buy one for myself

[A-R]

Maybe I am only saying this so the demand for Glock pistols will go down and their prices will come down a little so I can buy one for myself

taking this a bit further OT ... You can afford a Kahr but not a Glock? Or you just can't afford both? Just curious because my long-gone Kahr is still the most expensive pistol I ever purchased - more even than my Walther PPS and much more expensive than my Glock 23.

[seamusTX]

Gee, Mr.72, I thought you didn't take the politics or ideology of manufacturers into account.

If we don't buy from Ruger because of statements made decades ago by their deceased former owner, and don't buy from Smith and Wesson because of their former management's acceptance of trigger locks, and don't buy from Kahr because they are linked to the moonies, we're going to run out of politically acceptable vendors pretty soon.

You can still get nice Single Action Army replicas made in Italy.

Glock reportedly has better than 50% profit margin (which is huge for a hardware manufacturer). They can comfortably adjust their prices to be competitive with other vendors. Part of the reason that they dominate the police market is that they can undercut everyone else.

- Jim

[Keith B]

Maybe I am only saying this so the demand for Glock pistols will go down and their prices will come down a little so I can buy one for myself

taking this a bit further OT ... You can afford a Kahr but not a Glock? Or you just can't afford both? Just curious because my long-gone Kahr is still the most expensive pistol I ever purchased - more even than my Walther PPS and much more expensive than my Glock 23.

The Kahr CW series guns are running mid-$300 range. If you move to the PM series, then you are looking at around $600+.

[A-R]

Really? Mid $300s for a Kahr CW? I thought those were $425 - $475 range?

[mr.72]

Maybe I am only saying this so the demand for Glock pistols will go down and their prices will come down a little so I can buy one for myself

taking this a bit further OT ... You can afford a Kahr but not a Glock? Or you just can't afford both? Just curious because my long-gone Kahr is still the most expensive pistol I ever purchased - more even than my Walther PPS and much more expensive than my Glock 23.

The Kahr CW series guns are running mid-$300 range. If you move to the PM series, then you are looking at around $600+.

I would love to find a CW Kahr in the mid-$300 range. They are running about $410 at the extreme low end, which is close to competitive with a Glock. Kahr P-series compete more on price with Glock or even cost a little more, but they are a niche market and do not compete directly with Glock.

But yeah, I can't afford a Glock unless I sell my Kahr. I just don't have a ton of money I available to spend on guns that I don't absolutely need. But I certainly wouldn't mind having a G26 and a G19. I almost think they are worth their $500ish price tags. $400/ea for a new gun with a warranty and 2 mags and I'd be in.

And no, Jim, I don't really care about the politics, history, or ethics claims of a manufacturer or supplier of goods or services. If I went down that road, I'd not have water to drink or a house to live in or shoes on my feet or a car to drive etc. And I certainly wouldn't be paying taxes. So once you let the camel's nose under the tent then you might as well just buy things based on the value of the actual product or service and leave the moral or political judging out of it.

[DoubleJ]

Gee, Mr.72, I thought you didn't take the politics or ideology of manufacturers into account.

If we don't buy from Ruger because of statements made decades ago by their deceased former owner, and don't buy from Smith and Wesson because of their former management's acceptance of trigger locks, and don't buy from Kahr because they are linked to the moonies, we're going to run out of politically acceptable vendors pretty soon.

You can still get nice Single Action Army replicas made in Italy.

Glock reportedly has better than 50% profit margin (which is huge for a hardware manufacturer). They can comfortably adjust their prices to be competitive with other vendors. Part of the reason that they dominate the police market is that they can undercut everyone else.

- Jim

It's one reason I bought a Kimber. American Made and they're on the back cover of every American Rifleman, so they're obviously an NRA supporter....





(tongue removed from cheek, now.)

[Keith B]

Really? Mid $300s for a Kahr CW? I thought those were $425 - $475 range?

Have seen them at shows for $350 - $375, but that may have been used.

To stay on topic, I personally don't care who owns a business, and if I want their product, I will buy from them as long as the funds are not used to finance illegal activities. If you start trying to dig into every corporate background out there to determine if they are doing something in the gray, they you will either waste a ton of time and energy to not uncover anything, or never end up getting to buy it because you can't find a company that is not questionable.

I own both Kahr and Glock firearms. Justin Moon (son of Sun Myung Moon) is the CEO of Kahr and the lead design engineer. Rev. Moon helped finance the business initially. He probably felt it was a good investment, and from the fact they are still in a profitable business, apparently he was right.

Glock is VERY large International company and have been around for quite a few years. I can tell you that any time you do business with large companies, especially International ones, unless they have extreme oversight processes in place, there may be areas things that don't get handled properly, especially in finance. Many times these are just mistakes made accidentally with no intent of fraud or scrupulous practices. The companies scramble to correct them and move on. No harm no foul.

GM had issues and had to be bailed out. The banks had to bailed out. Am I gonna drop them like a hot potato? Probably not. If they meet my needs and have a quality product I want at a reasonable price, then I will buy from them.

Bottom line, I buy what I want, try to be a good citizen (go green, eco-friendly, buy American made, etc.), and let the rest fall as it may.

[surprise_i'm_armed]

Should Plaxico Burress sue Glock for his case of Glockleg?

***********************************

By the way, for anyone who read the link about the hitman who tried to kill
Mr. Glock, it appears that Mr. Glock fought back with fists.

I'm surprised he didn't have an example of his Austrian hardware on him to shoot
the hit man.

SIA

[seamusTX]

The assassination attempt occurred in Luxembourg. Herr Glock is a resident of Austria. It is illegal and practically impossible to travel internationally with a handgun.

- Jim

[aardwolf]

I've always felt that this complicating if laws is intentional. It is a tool that government uses it "legally" go after whoever they want to go after.

"Did you really think we want those laws observed?" said Dr. Ferris. "We want them to be broken. You'd better get it straight that it's not a bunch of boy scouts you're up against... We're after power and we mean it... There's no way to rule innocent men. The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws. Who wants a nation of law-abiding citizens? What's there in that for anyone? But just pass the kind of laws that can neither be observed nor enforced or objectively interpreted – and you create a nation of law-breakers – and then you cash in on guilt. Now that's the system, Mr. Reardon, that's the game, and once you understand it, you'll be much easier to deal with."
Atlas Shrugged, 1957