Scenario: So someone IS following you in your car

[gigag04]

How ready do you get your gun - take it out and keep it handy? Just make it easy to draw?

What level of response do you feel is warranted? For example's sake lets say its at midnight.

Steyr's post got me thinking.

-nick

[txinvestigator]

Following you where? Are you in your car, walking, etc?

[Chris]

you turn around and ask them if you can help them with something. criminals prey on fear. if you keep walking, they'll keep following. if you confront them, you screw up their plans and they'll move on.

the funniest thing i ever saw was when i walked into a convenient store just as this clown was getting ready to rob it. he had absolutely no idea what to do next. i helped him out with that part.

this one guy was standing by the dumpster at a mcdonald's for about 20 minutes, apparently planning his robbery. he finally worked it out and went up to the drive thru window, pointed his gun at the clerk, and demanded money. she told him to get lost, and he did. she screwed his plans all up.

[stevie_d_64]

One thing I remember that comes to mind...

"Hey homey? Is that my briefcase?"

[Charles L. Cotton]

"Hey homey? Is that my briefcase?"

Marc and I actually practice a drill very similar to that one. We don't teach it, but we do practice it!

Chas.

[Charles L. Cotton]

How ready do you get your gun - take it out and keep it handy? Just make it easy to draw?

What level of response do you feel is warranted? For example's sake lets say its at midnight.

Steyr's post got me thinking.

-nick

If you are talking about being followed in your car, then I wouldn't draw until I am ready to engage, or have the car stopped and configured for whatever may be necessary. As soon as you draw in your car, you're now doing everything one-handed. Steering, shifting, lowering the window(s), removing the seatbelt, opening the door - everything. Also, as others have mentioned, a gun between the legs or laying on the seat is only one quick stop from being on the floor.

Regards,
Chas.

[gigag04]

Yeah - i meant in a car. Although both scenarios are discussion worthy

[sparx]

How ready do you get your gun - take it out and keep it handy? Just make it easy to draw?

What level of response do you feel is warranted? For example's sake lets say its at midnight.

Steyr's post got me thinking.

-nick

Taking Steyr's message in consideration with regards to being followed down a street I lived on late at night by a car that had its headlights off, and using that case as an example along with the fact that he had pulled into his driveway (versus continuing on as others had suggested [good point I will remember to do if found in like situation]), I would have actually pulled my weapon from its holster and have it ready in-hand but out-of-site, as well as leaving the car running and in Reverse with the breaks on (in case I need to use IT as a weapon as well).

When they passed by with no incident and I turned off and exited the car (with the gun reholstered), but while walking to the house I detected that they had turned around and were coming back (and not knowing how many were actually inside the car, nor if or what they were armed with), being married but with no children I think I would have bolted inside to alert my wife, lock the doors and turn off any inside lights (our driveway has motion-detected bright lights, so that would have lit up the driveway/entryway and front yard area to my advantage). Once inside and with both of us armed and on alert (and in our places), a knock on the door would be answered with extreme caution (without opening it) and three loud barking dogs. Any barge-in would be greeted accordingly to the best of our abilities.

With regards to how ready I would keep my gun, that depends on so many variables. In short, I would keep it as ready as I could, based on the threat or possible threat situation. If I felt there was a possible threat, and had adequate cover for it to prevent someone from screaming "Man with a GUN!!!" (late at night, dark and while in the car for example) I would have it drawn from its holster and ready-in-hand, but be able to quickly conceal it further if necessary if the threat proved to be false. If walking, and with an IWB holster, I might only stick my thumb down between my tuck, covering the grip with my palm so it's not visible, but ready to pull if needed. With OWB, I would make sure my jacket was unzipped and would have my thumb/strong-hand ready to swing it back for draw.

Of course I'm not a LEO, nor have I had any formal training in self-defence (and as you can see by my sig, don't even have my CHL yet), so I'm sure that there's plenty I don't know. But, to summarize, in a possible threat situation I would try to be as ready as I could without raising any red flags or letting anyone else know that I was readying myself for the worst.

[sparx]

If you are talking about being followed in your car, then I wouldn't draw until I am ready to engage, or have the car stopped and configured for whatever may be necessary. As soon as you draw in your car, you're now doing everything one-handed. Steering, shifting, lowering the window(s), removing the seatbelt, opening the door - everything. Also, as others have mentioned, a gun between the legs or laying on the seat is only one quick stop from being on the floor.

Excellent point I hadn't even considered! I was thinking more of shaving time for readiness than operation of the car, but as you can see in my post I had also considered prepping it for use as well, so I would have found myself in the very "one-handed" situation you described, and that would have likely made things worse (for me). Thanks!

I told you there was plenty I didn't know!! :-)

[nitrogen]

"Hey homey? Is that my briefcase?"

I'd love to practice this drill.

Back to topic, someone's following me. Here's what i try.
1) see if they are really following me. Make a circle by making 4 turns. If they are still behind me, they are following me.
2a) If you're in a fast, high performing car, and traffic allows; try and lose them. with some agressive driving. If your cellphone has handsfree, activate it and dial 911.
2b) If you are in your average econobox, or traffic is heavy, call 911. give them your location.

3)If the police cannot or will not come, find a well-lit, busy parking lot or other place to stop. DO NOT GO HOME. Find a parking spot where you can either back up or pull out and leave quickly if you have to.

Heres where things get dicey. What if the guy thinks you hit him? What if the guy is irritated at you for cutting him off in traffic? At this point, I think your standard "rules of engagement" apply. See what the situation is. and see if you can defuse it. If the guy comes out of his car, screaming and yelling, prepare to deal with that.

[AG-EE]

nitrogen,

I would not stop at all until the police were there, or maybe if I was in front of a police station, with my horn honking. I think the best thing to do would be to call police on your cell and stay on the phone with them until they show up.

If I don't absolutely have to get into a defensive situation, such as stopping at a place you mentioned and seeing what they wanted, I don't want to do so.

Regards,

[Charles L. Cotton]

I told you there was plenty I didn't know!! :-)

I admire you for that admission and rest assured, you are in good company. I have been shooting for 52 of my 56 years, but I didn’t give the first thought to tactical shooting until a few tense days in Houston in 1968. Since then, I haven’t fixated on self-defense, but I’ve learned a lot about what works and what doesn’t.

Some of that knowledge came from personal experiences, but the vast majority of it came from the experience of people who were willing to share with others. Sometimes sharing is easy, sometimes it is not. Not all “war stories� are stories of victory and gallantry; some are stark descriptions of what people can go through in a fight, or what they believe will be a fight, for their lives.

Whether it’s the experience of Clint Smith or the other instructors at Thunder Ranch, the writings of knowledgeable people in the field, or the candor of a new “kid� in this forum posting about an event that scared the snot out of him, it all becomes part of our body of knowledge, if we are willing to listen and learn. I truly believe that one of the greatest aspects of this forum is the vast experience its members have to offer, coupled with the willingness of people to ask and pose topics of discussion that are relevant to real-world issues. It takes a certain amount of courage to tell of an event you encountered, then ask for a critique of your performance. But that willingness to present one’s thought process, planning, actions and reactions to the group for discussion is invaluable not only to the one seeking opinions on their performance, it also provides an opportunity for all of us to consider and learn from a scenario we did not face ourselves. And by the way, there's still plenty I don't know either!

Regards,
Chas.

[Scott Murray]

I like to think that when I'm driving, and not blocked in traffic, the car is the most potent weapon I have. I can do more damage with the car than I can with the pistol, and it can do a lot more to seperate me from a threat.

I positively would not stop and get out without being in the presence of strong reinforcements (police).

I wouldn't start agressive escape maneuvers unless I had to (if he pulled along side and pointed a gun, or tried to run me off the road). I wouldn't want to cause an accident that could hurt myself or others. I would keep moving, drive in circles to verify they were following, and call for help on a cell phone. If I didn't have a cell phone, I might drive to a police station, and keep circling it while leaning on my horn.

The pistol would be useful if I got run off the road or blocked in traffic and he got out of his car and approached. Another scenario would be if I felt obliged to stop and intervene to protect a third party.

Scott

[Chris]

I wouldn't start agressive escape maneuvers unless I had to (if he pulled along side and pointed a gun, or tried to run me off the road). I wouldn't want to cause an accident that could hurt myself or others. I would keep moving, drive in circles to verify they were following, and call for help on a cell phone. If I didn't have a cell phone, I might drive to a police station, and keep circling it while leaning on my horn.

yep, it defeats the purpose too, if you're the one stopped and cited, not the person following. we had a guy that would wait for officers to leave then follow them home. he was a looney. after getting a ton of tickets for bull violations, he quit. he eventually went to prison for a long time on various charges, but he was stopped and cited every time he followed one of us.

no matter what you do, if you stop you're at a disadvantage when someone is behind you. they have what little cover the door affords, a better view, etc. the absolute best thing to do is to call the police. if that doesn't work, pull into a well lit gas station where the pumps are out front and there isn't any room for the car to pull directly in behind you. park directly in front, as a lot of gas stations have cameras that record out the front door. if the person can't get behind you, you can take up a position along the side of your car. just don't let them in behind you.

if worse comes to worst, put it in reverse and smash the crap out of their car. with the air bags and radiator blown on the other car, you can continue on with just a damaged rear bumper and trunk.

[seadawg221]

In the car is simple....I would have mine in my hand!