Ruger 1911 Commander .45 Problem

[Pawpaw]

I was seriously thinking about getting a 1911 but you guys are frightening me away. You have to care and feed them like pampered children. I have a Glock 21 so I feel I have met my 45 requirements and a gun that never fails. Aside from the mystique of a 1911 and what seems like at least 100 variants out there what am I missing?

Definitely don't let this thread scare you away. The U.S. Military carried this weapon for many many years, and many many of them are reliable. Typically you are going to spend more for more reliability. A 1911 is going to be an acquired taste for a guy like yourself; don't waste your money on well whiskey and expect it to taste and act like jameson. I had a citadel compact that was decent that I got fairly cheap. I never fed it a single hollowpoint but it would surely eat up some brass ball ammo. I recently acquired through a trade a Ruger CMD (as mentioned earlier). It is the same gun as the one mentioned here except it is not the "light weight" version and it runs like a champ. Another thing to keep in mind is the usual negative trend on forums. Most people will report their problems long before praising the item being presented, be it a gun, a car, or a nintendo. Have no fear with the 1911 and do yourself a favor and buy a quality gun!

I'm going to disagree with you, but only a little.

There are very good 1911s at entry-level prices. The Rock Island pistols, imported from the Philippines by Armscor, have proven themselves very reliable and have quite a following. Those pistols won't have the fit-and-finish of the Ruger, nor will they be made of stainless steel. They will be parkerized for durability and carry a lifetime warranty. That warranty is for the life of the pistol. It doesn't matter if your the 1st or 21st owner... it's covered.

In fact, Armscor provided the frames & slides that STI used to make their Spartan pistol (now discontinued).

[Excaliber]

I was seriously thinking about getting a 1911 but you guys are frightening me away. You have to care and feed them like pampered children. I have a Glock 21 so I feel I have met my 45 requirements and a gun that never fails. Aside from the mystique of a 1911 and what seems like at least 100 variants out there what am I missing?

Definitely don't let this thread scare you away. The U.S. Military carried this weapon for many many years, and many many of them are reliable. Typically you are going to spend more for more reliability. A 1911 is going to be an acquired taste for a guy like yourself; don't waste your money on well whiskey and expect it to taste and act like jameson. I had a citadel compact that was decent that I got fairly cheap. I never fed it a single hollowpoint but it would surely eat up some brass ball ammo. I recently acquired through a trade a Ruger CMD (as mentioned earlier). It is the same gun as the one mentioned here except it is not the "light weight" version and it runs like a champ. Another thing to keep in mind is the usual negative trend on forums. Most people will report their problems long before praising the item being presented, be it a gun, a car, or a nintendo. Have no fear with the 1911 and do yourself a favor and buy a quality gun!

Jb2012 is absolutely correct. I have owned (and still do own) more 1911's than any other type of handgun. Over the years I've had an old WWII Remington Rand (my second handgun), Colts, Springfields, Randalls (what - you never heard of the first CNC machined stainless 1911), Kimbers, STI's and Dan Wessons. I've probably left a couple off that list as well. Almost all of them were completely reliable and I was confident enough in them to trust my life to them both on and off duty as an LEO and as a regular citizen since. Today I carry a variety of handguns depending on the situation, but the 1911's are my go to guns, and are carried more than any other. They are so fine that I warn friends who want to try mine that they shouldn't shoot them unless they're prepared to buy one, because if they do they won't be happy again until they have one of their own. Those who didn't believe me are now 1911 owners.

My excellent experience with those guns is what makes my trouble with the Ruger LWC such a frustrating outlier. It is most certainly not typical of the breed, which is now more popular than ever even though the design is over 100 years old.

There are lots of very fine handguns to choose from, but many, including myself, consider the 1911 to be the finest defensive pistol design ever conceived for its unique combination of flat profile for easy concealment, ergonomic grip, balance, trigger action, power, and reliability.

[DocV]

I just got back from the 2nd trip to the range. Ran 100 Freedom munitions FMJ 230gr this time, i had 3 fail to feed/battery right off the bat. Same way and same damage to the cartridge, it almost seems like the bullet is popping up and to the right, possible extractor issue?

I then noticed the issue only happened with my factory ruger mags, i used the MecGar 8 round SS only for the last 80 rounds or so and didnt have a single issue.

I will email ruger about the mags but will probably order more MecGar 8 rnd SS mags.

http://1drv.ms/1SOk3hV
http://1drv.ms/1SOkada

Possibly the mags, possibly the extractor being a bit too tight. Give it a couple of hundred rounds - seriously - to loosen up. Some people will attempt to "cure" 1911 feed issues by using a heavier recoil spring. This usually ends up making any feed problem worse.

[Excaliber]

Most common issues I see again & again (for decades now) are a too-loose or too-tight extractor and crappy magazines with bad lips or weak springs.

^^^^^^^^^^^ Agreed. More often than not...this is where you will find your problem .

To those with new pistols, for what its worth: 'Going to the range' is the LAST thing I do.

Any new firearm of mine is first thoroughly inspected, cleaned, lubed, cycled by hand and function tested (except firing) before it ever gets the first round put through it.

I pretty much 'expect' that magazines will need to deburred/polished/tuned. Extractor tension is easily checked on most pistols.

In the OP's case (Excaliber), he tried everything that was reasonable for the gun owner to try...without voiding the warranty (you guys did a good job). He has a good understanding of how his firearm is supposed to work and the functions of the related parts. He just happened to get one with several problems.

Flint, you and I have a very similar breakin procedure.

I start with a field strip / thorough clean / inspection. Then I hand cycle the pistol dry (no lube) a couple hundred times to help the minute high spots on the frame and the slide mate together a bit. Then I lube it thoroughly (Weaponshield or EWG grease on the male frame rails, Weaponshield, FP10, or Froglube on the slide and frame cuts, and the underside of the slide under the rail cuts. I also lube the top of the frame around the disconnector and the disconnector itself to reduce cycling friction. Then I hand cycle it a few hundred times to work everything together. This produces very similar results to running a few hundred rounds through it without spending the money to burn ammo.

When I'm happy with how everything feels, then I take it to the range with a variety of magazines (OEM, Wilson Combat, Chip McCormick, Tripp Research, and Brownells) to make sure it works with all of them. If it doesn't like the Brownells or the OEM mags but is 100% reliable with the Wilsons and Tripps, I'm OK with that because that's all I carry with.

I'll be off to the range for the last part of this sequence for the new lightweight commander this morning - I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

[rotor]

Cycle a couple hundred times before going to the field? I want to take it out of the box and shoot it right away. I have dealt with sending a rifle (SR762) back to Ruger and it is a pain in the neck. Taurus had a gun on recall for many months before sending me a new one. Actually got back a pretty nice gun too and Ruger did fix the rifle problem. Is it asking much to have a machine work properly right out of the box? This is what scares me about 1911's. Cycle 100's of times before shooting and needing 5 different type of mags??

[Pawpaw]

Cycle a couple hundred times before going to the field? I want to take it out of the box and shoot it right away. I have dealt with sending a rifle (SR762) back to Ruger and it is a pain in the neck. Taurus had a gun on recall for many months before sending me a new one. Actually got back a pretty nice gun too and Ruger did fix the rifle problem. Is it asking much to have a machine work properly right out of the box? This is what scares me about 1911's. Cycle 100's of times before shooting and needing 5 different type of mags??

That is a result of the way 1911s are built today. Customers want tightly fitted and highly polished parts, so the manufacturers have to provide what the market demands or go out of business.

As originally designed, you could disassemble 100 pistols, scramble the parts, and then assemble 100 working pistols. Today, the slide and frame have been fitted to work together. If you try to use slide A on frame B, there is almost no chance it will work. The fire control components are now made slightly oversized so it requires gunsmithing skills to fit them to within a gnat's whisker.

You won't find anyone making them to the original standards. The public wouldn't buy enough to keep them in business. They would be buried in complaints:

"This thing is a rattle trap. It ain't worth a darn!"
"The trigger has some creep. It ain't worth a darn!"
"The best group it will do is 3" at 25 yards. It ain't worth a darn!"

You get the idea.

[Excaliber]

Here's today's range report on test firing of the replacement pistol:

I tried loading a Wilson Combat 8 round magazine and dropping the slide on the first round - and got exactly the same time of FTF I had been experiencing with the first pistol. That was an inauspicious start. However, the first gun didn't like Wilson mags either, so I tried OEM Ruger and Tripp Research cobra magazines. Both worked very well with ball ammo, with the exception of two failures to go completely into battery. These were easily fixed with a thumb nudge to the slide. This is not unusual in the first 100 rounds of a tightly fitted pistol. I'm withholding judgment because the serious failure to feed lockups didn't happen with either the Ruger orTripp Research magazines.

I'll give it a thorough cleaning, a good lube, and lots more slide cycling before I put another 100 rounds through it. I'll be more critical of any issues then.

In the meantime I'll take a closer look at the differences between the Wilson mags and the Ruger and Tripp mags to see if I can figure out why the Wilsons won't feed in this gun.

[FastCarry]

Can you take a look at the barrel throat ramp/beveling? On mine, the left side tapers off nice and smooth all the way up the left side. On the right side where my cartridges catch and damage, the beveling stops abruptly to a hard edge.

[Right2Carry]

Here's today's range report on test firing of the replacement pistol:

I tried loading a Wilson Combat 8 round magazine and dropping the slide on the first round - and got exactly the same time of FTF I had been experiencing with the first pistol. That was an inauspicious start. However, the first gun didn't like Wilson mags either, so I tried OEM Ruger and Tripp Research cobra magazines. Both worked very well with ball ammo, with the exception of two failures to go completely into battery. These were easily fixed with a thumb nudge to the slide. This is not unusual in the first 100 rounds of a tightly fitted pistol. I'm withholding judgment because the serious failure to feed lockups didn't happen with either the Ruger orTripp Research magazines.

I'll give it a thorough cleaning, a good lube, and lots more slide cycling before I put another 100 rounds through it. I'll be more critical of any issues then.

In the meantime I'll take a closer look at the differences between the Wilson mags and the Ruger and Tripp mags to see if I can figure out why the Wilsons won't feed in this gun.

I don't have the lightweight commander but I do have a Ruger commander stainless and it loves the Wilson Combat mags. It is my EDC and trust it with my life. Took it to the range today and sent one mag of Federal HSTs down range followed by 50 REMINGTON FMJ 230 Gr round nose. Never a hickup and using Wilson Combat Mags. The more I shoot this gun the more I love it. I use frog lube exclusively on all my firearms.

[Excaliber]

Can you take a look at the barrel throat ramp/beveling? On mine, the left side tapers off nice and smooth all the way up the left side. On the right side where my cartridges catch and damage, the beveling stops abruptly to a hard edge.

That sounds like a problem.

The beveling on both sides of the barrel should be mirror images of one another. They are on mine, as well as on my other 1911's.

[Excaliber]

Here's today's range report on test firing of the replacement pistol:

I tried loading a Wilson Combat 8 round magazine and dropping the slide on the first round - and got exactly the same time of FTF I had been experiencing with the first pistol. That was an inauspicious start. However, the first gun didn't like Wilson mags either, so I tried OEM Ruger and Tripp Research cobra magazines. Both worked very well with ball ammo, with the exception of two failures to go completely into battery. These were easily fixed with a thumb nudge to the slide. This is not unusual in the first 100 rounds of a tightly fitted pistol. I'm withholding judgment because the serious failure to feed lockups didn't happen with either the Ruger orTripp Research magazines.

I'll give it a thorough cleaning, a good lube, and lots more slide cycling before I put another 100 rounds through it. I'll be more critical of any issues then.

In the meantime I'll take a closer look at the differences between the Wilson mags and the Ruger and Tripp mags to see if I can figure out why the Wilsons won't feed in this gun.

I don't have the lightweight commander but I do have a Ruger commander stainless and it loves the Wilson Combat mags. It is my EDC and trust it with my life. Took it to the range today and sent one mag of Federal HSTs down range followed by 50 REMINGTON FMJ 230 Gr round nose. Never a hickup and using Wilson Combat Mags. The more I shoot this gun the more I love it. I use frog lube exclusively on all my firearms.

The differences in feed lip configurations among the Ruger, Cobra, and Wilson mags are quite subtle and one has to look hard to find them.

The left side of the Ruger mag rises to just above the follower, where the one on the Wilson comes to just below the top of the follower. The Wilson is also the slickest internally.

I'll give the Wilsons another try during the next range outing next week.

[FastCarry]

Happy to report I had no hiccups today with either mec gar or factory mags. I polished and beveled out the right side and every round feed like a champ.

[Excaliber]

Happy to report I had no hiccups today with either mec gar or factory mags. I polished and beveled out the right side and every round feed like a champ.

Sounds like you've got a winner!

Unfortunately it also sounds like Ruger has unresolved QA issues because a barrel with that obvious defect should never have been put into a gun.

[FastCarry]

I agree. It was very obvious what the issue was once I inspected the cartridges and looked at the barrel, the right side had a very hard edge with no polishing or beveling where the left side tapered off with a mirror finish all the way around.

Since it was an obvious issue, I decided to fix it myself rather than deal with sending it off and waiting.

For a model thats been around a while, and a design thats been around a century, these QA issues should not exist from a top tier manufacturer.

That being said, I love how this gun (1911) runs and will be shopping around for another, 5 inch possibly this time. Considering rock island, Remington, or a Springfield. I really like how much customization can go into one, I've already added a Wilson Combat extended slide release and MagPul grips, have a Bianchi carrylok owb holster as well. Looking to add nightsights soon.

Despite the issues with my first 1911, the 1911 bug still bit me. Ill keep a polymer or two, but 1911 just feels right.

[Excaliber]

I agree. It was very obvious what the issue was once I inspected the cartridges and looked at the barrel, the right side had a very hard edge with no polishing or beveling where the left side tapered off with a mirror finish all the way around.

Since it was an obvious issue, I decided to fix it myself rather than deal with sending it off and waiting.

For a model thats been around a while, and a design thats been around a century, these QA issues should not exist from a top tier manufacturer.

That being said, I love how this gun (1911) runs and will be shopping around for another, 5 inch possibly this time. Considering rock island, Remington, or a Springfield. I really like how much customization can go into one, I've already added a Wilson Combat extended slide release and MagPul grips, have a Bianchi carrylok owb holster as well. Looking to add nightsights soon.

Despite the issues with my first 1911, the 1911 bug still bit me. Ill keep a polymer or two, but 1911 just feels right.

They are addictive, and almost as customizable as the AR15.

Of the brands you mentioned, I think Springfield gives you the most for your money and a very wide choice of models. I recently shot one of their .45 ACP TRP versions that was a real tack driver Even a new shooter (a visitor from the UK - but that's another story) I was introducing to the sport couldn't miss with it. He did much better with it than he did with a 9mm H&K VP9, which is itself a very easy to shoot gun.