How Many Rounds for SELF DEFENSE?

[govnor]

I'm also in the minority here and I think people on this board consider me a MALL NINJA!

In every armed robbery my friends have been involved in (which is four I can think of in Dallas), they were walking into their own homes or a restaurant. Some gang banger shows a gun and demands money or whatever. My thought is that when walking to the door of your house you should have a gun in hand. That's what I do. That's what my victim friends also do now...

If I saw a gun in the gang banger's hand and I could raise mine fast enough with one in the pipe, of course...I can pretty much shoot center mass without aiming. I practice that at the range. Empty clip...run. At that time, I'm sure the accomplice, if any, will be running also... in the other direction.

I'd rather be armed with a gun with one clip or a loaded revolver than nothing at all, which is most people walking the streets. I think that's all you need for most serious situations. The examples I've seen on here where reloading comes in are with law enforcement and that is a different category than your run of the mill mugging. I've heard examples of guys only showing their gun to a gang banger and they run off. I'm not trained in law enforcement, so I doubt I would be able to handle a situation that bad. I'd probably end up dead if I was in a situation where needed to slap another clip in.

My thought is being prepared and scoping out a situation is the best thing to do. If I saw a bunch of gang bangers standing in front of a convenience store, then I would go somewhere else. If I pull up to my house and notice a threat, I'm calling 911. If they jump me, because they were hiding, I'm shooting and hoping I hit them. I'm sure an extra clip would be the last thing on my mind, even though I have taken to carrying a spare. I think a back up gun would be better in that situation.

All of that being said...if I was going to a gunfight, I'd bring my AR-15 and several clips. I don't go to gunfights.

[Xander]

Wouldn't almost all "civilian" conflicts end in seconds, not drawn out such as in a SWAT standoff?

Absolutely. And the key bit in there is "almost all" Wouldn't it just make your day if you were in the one in a hundred that turned into a protracted fight? And wouldn't it be something if you were killed because you ran out of ammunition before the BGs? It might even make you laugh at the absurdity of the coincidence, if you weren't dead.

That said, it also blows my mind that CHL holders don't feel more of a need to carry backup guns (for the reasons Carlson already mentioned) and wear body armor, particularly when in places where carrying is off-limits. So maybe I'm just overly cautious. Or paranoid, it might also be aptly put.

-Xander

[NcongruNt]

When It's just my Hi-Power, I've got a 14-round FM mag in the gun plus one chambered and then a 13-round FN mag in my pocket. This is my usual carry - 28 rounds of 9mm.

My dress-up or shorts gun is an FEG PA-63 carried IWB, The magazines are 7-rounders. I carry 7+1 in the gun and 2 spare mags in my pocket - 22 rounds of 9mm Makarov.

On the rarer occasion that I'm carrying both, I've got everything mentioned above. Hi-Power is carried OWB with the extra mag in my weak-side pocket. The PA-63 is carried either SOB with 2 mags in the pocket or in a shoulder rig with one mag in the mag carrier and the other in the weak-side pocket. That's 28 rounds of 9mm and 22 rounds of 9mm Makarov. So yeah, a box of ammo. I expect this setup to be more frequent during the winter months, when they come.

If I'm driving my van, I've also got an extra Hi-Power FN mag stashed in the GunVault bolted under my seat (which stays open when I'm driving).

Beyond all that, I carry OC on my keychain, cell phone in a belt holster, a Spyderco Native III knife clipped in my strong side front pocket, an Inova Bolt tactical light on my belt, and my wits about me.

I don't expect to be in a gunfight, but I'd rather have too much ammo than not enough when it comes down to it. Any number of scenarios involving multiple armed assailants or one well-armed lunatic can turn into a gun battle that I'd much prefer to have the extra rounds in.

[KD5NRH]

One.



As soon as I figure out which one it is, I'll cut back on the speed strips.

At any rate, it seems that the old folks in the news lately with various .38Spls or SAAs never need more than one or two shots to stop the threat. Maybe we should be getting them to teach some classes instead of guys who preach bringing tons of big-bore ammo and using all of it.

[carlson1]

As soon as I figure out which one it is, I'll cut back on the speed strips.

I believe someone named those wrong - it should be "slow strips."

[fm2]

...
I just really would like to know the break down on the number of folks that consider a carry weapon for self defense or for a gun fight!

How much difference is there between the two?

... I still do not understand the need to carry 30 or more rounds.

It seems like most people responding carry 1 extra mag. with a few carrying 2. If they carry a high cap gun, then 1 spare bumps their total over your 30 round comfort ceiling.

[fm2]

In a self defense DF situation...would you really be able to reload?

Maybe, it depends on the factors, ie...# of BG's, their motivation, who is in your care & their ability to move or fight etc... . The option could prove valuable to have.

I can figure if you are in a combat zone with backup and stuff yes, but in a parkinglot trying to get in your car?

So, on your own (with no immediate back-up & possible 911 back-up) you need less rounds?

My CHL instructor said a blade is almost more effective ending a DF conflict, because EVERYONE has been cut sometime in their lives, and we know what it feels like, not everyone has been shot, so a nice shiny quick opening combat knife might actually deter a badguy better than pulling that pistol, plus it would be easier to explain to a jury that you didn't immediately go to gun to end the conflict (if the guy kept coming after you pulled a blade, he OBVIOUSLY had intent to harm)

There's a lot of assumptions there that may not pan out.
Just what kind of deadly force issue was he thinking about?

[G.C.Montgomery]

I don't know how much is enough or too much for the next guy or the next situation. It's my opinion that none of us knows. I choose to find a practical way to carry two spare magazines or speed-loaders for any gun I carry. Sometimes that means I'm carrying as many a 52-rounds of ammunition or it may mean as few 15-rounds. Will I need all of that? I certainly hope not but again, I don't get know how much ammunition I'll need ahead of time. I find it interesting that folks offer opinions that if you need to reload or need more than a certain amount of ammunition that you are incompetent or have unreliable equipment. The same folks often admit in the very next breath that they have no training or experience from which to draw those conclusion. That to me makes no sense.

I am not a police officer or soldier but I do know I've got a bit more experience and training than the average bear. Based on my short life, it's my opinion that if I find the need to reload or use 52-rounds of ammuntion from a handgun, I am simply in a VERY bad situation and it's probably not my fault. I won't say I've "screwed up" because in this day and age, I find it completely reasonable to suspect that someday I could find myself defending against a home invason, facing two or more violent, criminal actors(VCAs)...Didn't that just happen in CT? I also would not be surprised to find myself in a crowded market, restaurant area or mall the day a one or more VCAs decided to try killing me and anyone else they see.

[jbirds1210]

I don't know how much is enough or too much for the next guy or the next situation. It's my opinion that none of us knows. I choose to find a practical way to carry two spare magazines or speed-loaders for any gun I carry. Sometimes that means I'm carrying as many a 52-rounds of ammunition or it may mean as few 15-rounds. Will I need all of that? I certainly hope not but again, I don't get know how much ammunition I'll need ahead of time. I find it interesting that folks offer opinions that if you need to reload or need more than a certain amount of ammunition that you are incompetent or have unreliable equipment. The same folks often admit in the very next breath that they have no training or experience from which to draw those conclusion. That to me makes no sense.

I am not a police officer or soldier but I do know I've got a bit more experience and training than the average bear. Based on my short life, it's my opinion that if I find the need to reload or use 52-rounds of ammuntion from a handgun, I am simply in a VERY bad situation and it's probably not my fault. I won't say I've "screwed up" because in this day and age, I find it completely reasonable to suspect that someday I could find myself defending against a home invason, facing two or more violent, criminal actors(VCAs)...Didn't that just happen in CT? I also would not be surprised to find myself in a crowded market, restaurant area or mall the day a one or more VCAs decided to try killing me and anyone else they see.

Well said. Charles once told me that it is often difficult to know where a battlefield might be.....could be the Wal-Mart parking lot or your living room.

I do feel that people have a confidence in their gun that is often unrealistic.....they are mechanical and they will all fail if you shoot them often enough. This malfunction could be a 1-2 second fix or the end of your life depending on how prepared you are. At least one extra magazine for me at all times....

Someone earlier in this thread asked if one would really have time to reload....I answer that with only if they really want to live to see another day.

[Quick6]

When I'm cutting my lawn, S&W Model 60, 5 rounds .357 magnum. That's it. When I'm walking my dog, officers model 1911, 7+1 cocked and locked. Extra mags won't help much as I would have his leash in my left hand and reloading would be pretty much impossible. Him being a 75 lb. Siberian Husky should deter many would be bg's.

All other times two spare mags, regardless of what I'm carrying and if a revolver, 16 spare bullets in a double pouch.

[fm2]

GC, Excellent post.

[propellerhead]

It is no extra burden to carry spare magazines. A double mag carrier on your weak side actually helps balance the load, and makes carry more comfortable.

To me, this statement is the most convincing argument to carry extras so far.

[BoneDigger]

I carry 10 rounds most of the time. Five rounds in my 642 and five in a reloader.

Todd

[govnor]

When I'm cutting my lawn, S&W Model 60, 5 rounds .357 magnum. That's it. When I'm walking my dog, officers model 1911, 7+1 cocked and locked. Extra mags won't help much as I would have his leash in my left hand and reloading would be pretty much impossible. Him being a 75 lb. Siberian Husky should deter many would be bg's.

All other times two spare mags, regardless of what I'm carrying and if a revolver, 16 spare bullets in a double pouch.

I used to think I was the only person that carried a gun when mowing my own lawn. Seems like quite a few people do also.

[txinvestigator]

My CHL instructor said a blade is almost more effective ending a DF conflict, because EVERYONE has been cut sometime in their lives, and we know what it feels like, not everyone has been shot, so a nice shiny quick opening combat knife might actually deter a badguy better than pulling that pistol, plus it would be easier to explain to a jury that you didn't immediately go to gun to end the conflict (if the guy kept coming after you pulled a blade, he OBVIOUSLY had intent to harm)

Jeese, where do these instructors come from? Blades are contact weapons, guns are not. Blades, unless you are well trained, cause lots of bleeding but seldom incapcitate quickly. Contrary to TV, people often don't even realized they have been stabbed or cut right away.


We don't pull deadly weapons to deter, in most cases. I certainly would rather have a gun than a knife EVEN if I plan to just deter. Distance = time = good for me.

Having intent to "harm" is NEVER justification for the use of deadly force.