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RANT: This morning on the way to church, I was on I-10 heading East on the HOV lane. The car in front of me was swerving and came VERY close to hitting the concrete barriers at least 5 times. We started approaching the end of the HOV lane and we about the merge into the main lanes of I-10, so I told my wife to get out her cell phone and we called 911 and gave HPD the description, license # and current location of the vehicle. We continued to follow him from a safe distance as he was still travelling in our intended direction.

A few minutes later we were on I-45 going north and we got a call back asking for an updated location. We gave it and he began to slow down to 45 mph, then up to 75 mph, etc. I decided to follow him past my turnoff and he exited the freeway and stalled out (manual transmission). I once again called HPD and gave them his current location and I was told by this dispatcher in a very condescending tone, "you don't need to follow him anymore, let the police handle it".

By this time I'm thinking a cop would be along any minute so I continued to follow from a distance for a few more miles as he got back on the freeway, almost running into several cars. He finally got off the freeway and turned down a crossroad. I turned around and went back to church, sure that they never would catch him then.

This was very frustrating. This guy was a serious threat to the safety of others and I gave 3 accurate and timely locations of this guy, but HPD apparently doesn't have the resources available to get this guy off the road.

Arrrrgghhhh!

I know how you feel. I had a similar incident on I-45 going though Huntsville last year. I followed a driver who was obviously impaired for over 10 miles while on the phone with the DPS. The car finally exited and disappeared down a farm road. I never saw a patrol car.

Oddly enough, on my way back from conference this weekend, I called in a crazy SEMI!!!!

This guy was all over - I drive a huge truck myself, though nothing in comparison and he almost made a nick sandwitch crossing across the red river on 35.

I called Gainsville SO and gave them tags, reg'd state, and vehicle description. I passed him and went on my way, but the dispactcher I spoke with was real sweet, and I would imagine they would find the guy, being a semi, and all.

How about another vote for the failure of 911?

On Sunday afternoon (4/23), after a weekend canoe/kayaking trip on the Brazos, we were about to load kayaks on a trailer under the Hwy 180 bridge just west of Mineral Wells. Six young men, late teens to early 20's were hanging around under the bridge, swimming,etc. They looked pretty rough, with lots of tatoos, baggy clothes, etc., but were polite to my group and caused us no trouble, until two more vehicles raced down the road under the bridge, skidded across the road, blocking-in us and everyone else. The two vehicles carried 8 young men who looked just like the ones already there.

And then the fight started between the two groups. No weapons were visible, but they were slugging it out with each other about 50 feet from where we were loading kayaks.

My son(armed) moved all of our folks down between his vehicle and the river, where there was a large concrete pylon that could be used for cover, while I(also armed) moved around the fighting group and went above them to the upper level of the bridge with a cell phone. There is, of course, no cell phone service down close to the river. After being patched through two 911 operators, and waiting almost 5 minutes, I was told the deputies were on their way.

During the fighting, there was no interaction or any attempt to interact with my group, but their vehicles and their position completely blocked our avenue of exit, and had any shooting started, we would have been in close proximity with little cover beyond the bridge pylon.

While making my way back down to my group, the fight broke up with two carloads of men leaving at high speeds. Within a couple more minutes, the original van-load of young men sped away with no further incident and no harm to anyone other than the fighters.

45 minutes later, after we finished loading the kayaks and gear, we left for home, never having seen a police officer from any agency. So much for 911......

I asked a friend of mine who is a Police Officer about such call in reports and sadly from what I was told there not taken very serious because too many times a driver will get hacked off by a guy cutting him off and call it in and follow the person. When in fact the driver was not reckless but made someone mad. I am not saying thats what happened but could be why getting a response is hard to do.

I understand the frustration when 911 does not get help there as soon as would be liked by those in the emergent situation, but there are many possible reasons for the "failure" and I think it is not due to 911 operators or offices not taking the report seriously. My thoughts are that more often than not the long respnse times are due to understaffing for the call volume at the time. You have to consider how many unneccessary 911 calls there are now days from persons who need there hands held for everything. Now weather that is a normal operating condition or a shortage due to an unanticipated spike in calls will vary by location and jurisdiction. If you feel this is an ongoing issue in a jursdiction in which you live or work, I would suggest that you call your elected officials and request that the ranks of the boys in blue be increased by use of your tax dollars to help to curb this issue. Also, this is one reason some of us CCW, because 911 may not get there in time when we need them.

I agree with TxFire: Many small town PDs and SOs have small staffs. Many years ago, when I worked at a small PD, there were many times we worked with only 3 officers in the whole town. It wasn't unusual for all 3 to be busy and calls had to be stacked. Unfortunately there will be times when a LEO unit is just not going to be available in a timely manner.

I had a similar thing happen on 610 in Houston. Medium sized truck was all over the road... during heavy traffic. It was a miracle that there wasn't an accident. Truck had no license plate, and the driver looked pretty shady.

My wife called it in. About a minute later an HPD motorcycle cop drives right past the truck and keeps going...

We just don't bother to call in vehicles anymore.

under the significant probability of taking flak for this, i'm going to be very honest here. it is typical for police to go in the opposite direction when the call for a 'phone in drunk' comes in. these calls are generally not targeted to a specific officer, just to everyone in hopes that the closest one will take it. since no one specifically is called, there isn't any one to hold accountable for not responding.

before the rants come in, let me explain where that mentality comes from. i've stopped several vehicles that were called in being allegedly intoxicated. only a handful of times was the person actually intoxicated. in the few instances where they were, i ended up spending the next hour or two trying to find the person a ride for lack of a good case. the problem? to get a conviction on a DWI offense, i must have probable cause to even make the stop. DWI is not something you can stop for, it is an "after the fact" finding. in other words, you do not stop for the DWI itself, but traffic violations that you can attribute as being indicative of someone driving under the influence. a credible witness, as a private citizen would be considered, is reason enough for me to stop, BUT the only problem is that the credible witness usually refuses to stop and be the witness. even after the 'witness' follows, i still have to develop my own PC because 99% of the callers will not stick around to complete any statements, since they don't want their name on a report against this person. this does little to assist me in getting a conviction and essentially wastes my time and the taxpayers time. i had one that was called in and i found. i followed to the edge of my city limits and developed no PC. the guy called and complained on me. i really appreciate it when you complain on me for trying to work with you. (the courts have ruled that an officer can no longer stop a DWI, where the stop must be from some traffic infraction, outside of his or her jurisdiction. you can thank an arlington suburb for that.)

for an officer, the average DWI takes 3-4 hours from start to finish. when you call in a drunk, don't plan on sticking around to be the witness, and i make the arrest, i get to spend 3-4 hours trying my best to make a weak charge stick. not something i'm fond of.

everyone wants to be the good citizen and make that quick and easy call, but should it require any further investment, they're done. after that handful early in my career, i honestly don't break my neck trying to find a phone in drunk anymore.

you abuse the dog long enough, he'll eventually bite back. that scenario happens all too often. if you aren't willing to follow through with your report, then you shouldn't be reporting it. leave it for someone else. i don't want this to be taken as cynical on the part of the police, just an attempt to educate those in the committment required when reporting a crime.

Chris wrote:, i honestly don't break my neck trying to find a phone in drunk anymore.

you abuse the dog long enough, he'll eventually bite back. that scenario happens all too often. if you aren't willing to follow through with your report, then you shouldn't be reporting it. leave it for someone else. i don't want this to be taken as cynical on the part of the police, just an attempt to educate those in the committment required when reporting a crime.

I understand it perfectly. It is also the reason DPS don't fight each other to get to any "serious" automobile accidents. Too many times they arrive ahead of the ambulance only to have bystanders yell at them "to do something". Aside from securing the scene and rendering basic first aid, there is really little else they can do. These are just the harsh realities of these litigious times.
I do not view your post as cynical at all.

Very interesting. Never having been in law enforcement, I had no idea of the problems you would go through to establish PC. If a concerned citizen did stay connected and close enough to observe (speeding not an option, I drive like a Granny, too) would it be helpful? Should we tell the 911 or other source we will be staying close?

flintknapper wrote:

Chris wrote:, i honestly don't break my neck trying to find a phone in drunk anymore.

you abuse the dog long enough, he'll eventually bite back. that scenario happens all too often. if you aren't willing to follow through with your report, then you shouldn't be reporting it. leave it for someone else. i don't want this to be taken as cynical on the part of the police, just an attempt to educate those in the committment required when reporting a crime.

I understand it perfectly. It is also the reason DPS don't fight each other to get to any "serious" automobile accidents. Too many times they arrive ahead of the ambulance only to have bystanders yell at them "to do something". Aside from securing the scene and rendering basic first aid, there is really little else they can do. These are just the harsh realities of these litigious times.
I do not view your post as cynical at all.

as far as serious accidents, yes, we all try to get there quickly. there could be an instance of someone trapped in a burning vehicle. otherwise, you don't want to move people in accidents without the collars, back boards, and assistance.

this has happened to me a couple of times...i'm on a serious accident scene and the only one there. the rubberneckers rear end each other. they stop in the middle of the road, get out, and request that i immediately handle their accident because they have to get to work or where ever it is they're going.

i had the highway shut down once due to a very serious accident. a lady called 911 and requested a police officer escort her through the traffic jam because she had to pick up her mother at the airport.

some people are just plain stupid and there's no excuse for it. i've had the roads shut down for accidents and people will drive by and honk, cuss, and flip me the bird.

GrannyGlock wrote:Very interesting. Never having been in law enforcement, I had no idea of the problems you would go through to establish PC. If a concerned citizen did stay connected and close enough to observe (speeding not an option, I drive like a Granny, too) would it be helpful? Should we tell the 911 or other source we will be staying close?

it would be beneficial to know that the person is willing to file a sworn complaint. i personally would put forth a little bit more effort in helping them.

herein lies another problem, people don't know how to tell a police dispatcher where they're at, or where they're going. caller says, "we're at mile marker 1." the dispatcher goes to the radio and says, "they're passing mile marker 1." what that person meant is 'we just passed mile marker 1 and are taking the next exit.' i can't tell you the number of times someone says they're going east and they're actually going west. when you ask someone where they're at, they'll tell you, "i'm near the big billboard." that does nothing for me. but since the traffic violation must be observed by me in my jurisdiction, then i have to get there with enough time to follow. we had a guy and his wife call and complain over a drunk they called in. here's how it went down.

he called initially in city #1 that he was following a drunk. already heading to city #2, he was transferred. no one in city #2 was close, so they transferred to city #3, as they were heading to and were almost in city #3. city #3 doesn't have a huge stretch of road, and with no one close, it was transferred to city #4. city #4, also not having a huge portion of the road gave it to city #5. city #5 only has about 3 miles. no one could catch up to them so they entered back into city #2. city #2 has a small portion of this highway so they transferred it back to city #1.

this sounds like a joke, but it actually happened. the same thing has happened to me in pursuits. i'm going through the metroplex and as soon as the dispatcher contacts one city to ask them for assistance, we're almost out of that city and into the next. i had to educate a dispatcher once on calling two cities ahead when i'm in a pursuit.

what you have to remember is that DWI is an offense against the public, not you personally. i like it when citizens call in things because i cannot be every where. what i don't like is when a burglar backs a moving truck up to the front door and literally moves someone out of their own house, and we get not one single call. yet when a police car shows up to take the report, every single person in the neighborhood is outside trying to see what's going on. if you do happen to see this moving truck, it's also preferred that you call when it's there, not an hour later, or you notify a police officer who happens to be driving by you and it is now convenient to notify them.

the police and the people have to work together. most of the time they're not always on the same page though. you have to look out for each other. i see people get offended when the clerk at the store asks for ID when using a credit card. me, i appreciate that and get upset when they don't.

As always Chris, thank you for your perspective!

I've had similar experiences with calling in drunks. I just don't bother anymore unless it has resulted in an accident. With the limited resources of most agencies and the time it takes to do the report for DUI, it just doesn't seem to be worth an officer's time unless a conviction can be assured or someone has gotten hurt. I've had exactly one successful call for a DUI out of may be ten times I've called them in. I'm not even sure I could say it was successful since it didn't result in a DUI citation or arrest.

I was driving east on Westheimer with what I already suspected was a DUI in a convertible Mustang a head of me. As we approached the intersection of Post Oak and Westheimer, the driver became confused, thinking she was entering the turning lane, she made an early lane change into the westbound lanes of Westheimer. At that time, she struck the concrete island in the middle of Westheimer just short of Post Oak I was right behind her at the time of impact.

The impact blew the suspension and knocked the front of the car into the air. As the airbag deployed I could see the driver's face hit the bag. Prior to this impact, I observed her failing to maintain speed and lanes. I then watched her blow the intersections at Chimey Rock and again at Sage. Her boyfriend was apparently passed out in the passenger seat as his head bobbed and rolled as if he was unconscious.

When she finally hit the island I debated calling it in or just rendering aid. Since it was a single vehicle accident, I didn't really see a need to call it in because I didn't know for sure this was DUI and wasn't really qualified to say since I don't drink and I'm not a cop. But my DUI suspicions were cemented by the fact that as I approached the vehicle from the rear and on passenger side, I saw the woman trying to stuff the airbag back into the steering wheel.

Well when she flipped me off for trying to render aid, I decided to call it in as a simple accident and drive away to let someone else deal with it. But something bugged me. Something told me she wouldn't be there by the time an unit arrived, if one arrived at all. So having already driven off and headed north on the 610-West feeder, I turned around at San Filepe and returned to the scene at Post Oak and Westheimer. Sure enough, she'd started driving away. I spotted her headed north on Post Oak, throwing sparks because she was dragging a wheel. I followed the couple to the Willie G's parking lot where I saw the lady wake her boyfriend who then tried start fixing the busted tire/wheel while she put the convertible top back up.

A few minutes had passed and I figured a responding unit should be in the area by now so I returned to Post Oak and Westheimer where sure enough, a unit blew the intersection and after not seeing anything, stopped at the Shell on the corner of Westheimer and 610 to fill out a report. I drove up next to the guy and ask if he was looking for a DUI and he said yes. So I told him where to find the DUI. He headed over and I believe cited them for PI but that's about it. I wasn't asked to be a witness even though I'd have gladly done it. My guess is, it would have been too hard to get a conviction and wasn't worth trying to push DUI. I'm sure that woman has probably beein involved in other DUI's since if she's still alive.