Disarmed

Most CHL/LEO contacts are positive, how about yours? Bloopers are fun, but no names please, if it will cause a LEO problems!

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marksiwel
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Re: Disarmed

#16

Post by marksiwel »

Keith B wrote:
marksiwel wrote: Your Pistol had a clip? :biggrinjester:

.
Possible. He didn't say what type of pistol it wa he was carrying, so it could have been an AR-15 pistol, which would have a clip.
Maybe he was carrying a Mauser C96
The only AR-15 Pistol i've seen used Magazines.
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Keith B
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Re: Disarmed

#17

Post by Keith B »

marksiwel wrote:
Keith B wrote:
marksiwel wrote: Your Pistol had a clip? :biggrinjester:

.
Possible. He didn't say what type of pistol it wa he was carrying, so it could have been an AR-15 pistol, which would have a clip.
Maybe he was carrying a Mauser C96
The only AR-15 Pistol i've seen used Magazines.
Yes, they call them mags, but when used with rifles, it can be a clip. So, to be technically correct, then it might have been an SKS pistol with a stripper clip. :cool:
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NORMAN
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Re: Disarmed

#18

Post by NORMAN »

I would be curious to see who the officer was. There is one particular HPD officer who works I-45 around the South Houston Area and he is very arrogant and acts like he can do anything , he's on a real power trip!! We know this from personal experience !!!!

Rex B
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Re: Disarmed

#19

Post by Rex B »

seems to me if he tossed the pistol in the back seat and did not cover it, you are setting up for "Failure to conceal".
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MechAg94
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Re: Disarmed

#20

Post by MechAg94 »

nedmoore wrote:Flint, I just read your post, maybe I will try to make a complaint. Funny thing is he did not check for insurance, which I have, but my inspection is out of date!
I think they have the insurance information electronically at least sometimes. When I was paying my registration, I forgot to bring my insurance slip in with me and the lady told me that she showed it on the computer so I didn't need to go get it. I'm sure the police have access to the same info.


I'm not sure there is anything big to complain about here either. I really don't like the idea of him putting it in the back seat instead of handing it back to you. It is not concealed. He could have simply put it back in the door where he got it as well.
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ELB
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Re: Disarmed

#21

Post by ELB »

flintknapper wrote: ...Here is the bottom line folks: Unless you want this to become either departmental or personal "policy" among LEO, then take the time to go the officer's superior and talk with him. Until we make every officer articulate why he disarmed the CHL, it will not stop!
yerasimos wrote: ... but I also see Flintknapper's point about CHLicensees making a collective, principled stand when firearms are seized for capricious purposes...
Regardless the the details of the nedmoore's experience, these are excellent points.

[STAND BACK: RANT APPROACHING!]

One of the big failings of the conservative/small gummint/libertarian wing of the country is follow through at all levels of government. This is where the Left excels, and why they are running the government (regardless of who is president) -- they EARNED it through sheer hard work. Conservative win an election or a court ruling and the average Joe stops thinking about it because he has a job and hates thinking about the government anyway, and goes shooting on the weekend. The Left wins a biggie, and immediately starts filing lawsuits and complaints and working on regulations and getting their people hired on to implement the regulations. Even if most of the lawsuits and complaints don't "win," it starts moving people in the desired direction just to keep from having to deal with the nuisance.

The I understand the wisdom of husbanding resources for big precedential cases, and focusing efforts on top level places like legislatures, like TSRA and the NRA do, but it is not enough. There have to be many followup actions, including administrative, legal (lawsuit) actions, and staffing of governments and schools with the right people, to make sure the precedents philosophies are followed at ALL levels.

In this case, taking it at face value, it might be that this cop -- and perhaps the HPD -- do not really respect he CHL law and CHL'ers in particular, and use the cover of the "safety of the officer" clause to make life uncomfortable for a CHL holder. Another example might the Round Rock PD and their apparently bogus "intentionllay failed to conceal" arrest and detention of {name escapes my mind right now}. It costs them nothing to do this -- they have the backing of their departments, legal powers, official immunity, they get paid for it, there is really no one to call them on incidents like these. However, if every time this happened, the police chief and the city manager and the council got 50 calls and letters, a threatened or actual lawsuit, publicity in the news paper and on the big name blogs, etc, they will start trying to figure out how not to attract such attention. Squeaky wheels get the grease. (Sudden thought: Another area of pushback might the the "banning of CHL carry on Texas government property by private leasing entities" like the American Airlines Center in Dallas.)

nedmoore complaining by himself might not budge a knotheaded police department/chief much, but a coordinated, consistent, and continuous pushback on all aspects of the CHL law, and more broadly, the 2A, would. TSRA might think such confrontations would jeopardize its relationships with LE and other branches of government, so maybe this would take a separate organization.
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Rex B
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Re: Disarmed

#22

Post by Rex B »

Good post, ELB. All politics are local.
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bayouhazard
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Re: Disarmed

#23

Post by bayouhazard »

The law requires me to display my CHL and DL but it doesn't require me to give details on ALL the guns on or about my person.

Rex B
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Re: Disarmed

#24

Post by Rex B »

that prompts another question:

Several times beings stopped, I've been asked "Do you have any guns in your vehicle?"

If I'm carrying, it's easy "Yes, here's my CHL" end of discussion.

If you are not carrying, but have a gun locked in the trunk, there are three possible answers:

1 - "Yes, I do."
2 - Lie - "No I don't"
3 - None of your business

To me, #3 is most appropriate, and I'm not going to lie to them.
If I answer in the affirmative, additional questions follow "what kind of guns?" "What do you have a gun for?" "Mind if i take a look?"

So how do others react to this question?
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“Sometimes there is no alternative to uncertainty except to await the arrival of more and better data.” C. Wunsch

Abraham
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Re: Disarmed

#25

Post by Abraham »

marksiwel ,

You missed my point, along the lines of those who live in glass houses...

Bob Landry
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Re: Disarmed

#26

Post by Bob Landry »

No one holds more disdain for power-corrupted, ego-maniacal cops that I do, but even I realize the law says they can disarm you for no reason. The law also says unless you are detained, he has to give it back. It doesn't say he has to give it back loaded, and he doesn't have to put it back in your holster for you, he just has to give it back. I've talked to DPS that doesn't disarm anyone unless given a reason, and I've talked to some that say they always disarm. It's his right under the law. As long as it goes smooth and you don't give the guy an excuse to shoot you, that's what counts. if you have to deal with a jerk, the place to go after him is with his supervisor, chief, city council, courts, etc., but just let the guy think he's protecting and serving by writing you up and nail him later when a confrontation has no chance of going south.
As long as get my piece back, I'm happy. If he doesn't want to give it back, I'll wait for his superior to show up and explain why his officer is above the law. Maybe my attorney will arrive at about the same time and we can all have a spirited discussion.. :rules:
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mymojo
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Re: Disarmed

#27

Post by mymojo »

Bob Landry wrote: but even I realize the law says they can disarm you for no reason.
No, the law says he has to have a reason:

"§ 411.207. AUTHORITY OF PEACE OFFICER TO DISARM. (a) A
peace officer who is acting in the lawful discharge of the officer's
official duties may disarm a license holder at any time the officer
reasonably believes it is necessary for the protection
of the
license holder, officer, or another individual....."


If you arent acting in a suspicious/threatening/crazy manner, he has no right to disarm you.
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hoot
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Re: Disarmed

#28

Post by hoot »

yerasimos wrote: As I see things, there is nothing good that can come from a traffic stop, so I try to observe the traffic laws as closely as I can.
My thoughts exactly. I always drive like I am carrying a bowl of goldfish. My children
all know how I drive, and laugh at me, but my children periodically get pulled over.
I have been pulled over one time in almost 20 years. -- Not part of this topic but...
After THREE motorcycle accidents, for which I was NOT at fault, I always try to
drive like the next guy cannot see me.
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TrueFlog
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Re: Disarmed

#29

Post by TrueFlog »

bayouhazard wrote:The law requires me to display my CHL and DL but it doesn't require me to give details on ALL the guns on or about my person.
An excellent point. If the officer asks if you have your gun or where you're carrying it, you can always decline to answer. If you have your gun hidden in the car, then he has no justification to search your car for a gun you are legally carrying. If he searches anyway over your objections - well, he's more likely to get in trouble for an unlawful search than for unlawful disarmament. Of course, that won't stop him from getting you out of your car and frisking you, but at least you tried. Again, if he frisks you and/or disarms you, you can always tell him that you don't consent to any search or seizure.
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OldSchool
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Re: Disarmed

#30

Post by OldSchool »

shortysboy09 wrote: It's all Symantecs.
Or NAV?
"rlol"
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IANAL, thank gosh!
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