Conversation with LEO

[jmra]

Had an interesting conversation with a LEO the other day. I work with a number of officers so these conversations are not unusual.
The conversation started off with a discussion about open carry. The LEO could not understand why it was necessary for anyone to OC and felt it would make his job much more difficult. When I suggested that he would rarely if ever see anyone OC he looked at me in shock and said, "With 40% of Texas residents having CHLs we are expecting a lot of OC".
When I tried to convince him that less than 4% of the population of Texas had a CHL he thought I was crazy. I had to pull up the population stats and the CHL stats. Once he saw the numbers he still insisted that his department and others were being told that the numbers are at 40%.
The conversation moved on to his lamenting that as a police officer he was still subject to the same Texas 3 day waiting period for handgun purchases as everyone else...

I am constantly amazed about how little many LEO seem to know about current gun laws. Maybe it's just the area where I live but I'm constantly educating officers who are either misinformed on changes in the law or simply missed law changes completely. I know they have a lot to keep up with, but I think "continuing education" should become a priority in many of our departments.
ETA: I should add that the younger officers I encounter seem to be much more up to date and informed on current gun laws. It seems to be the guys who have been around for a while that are confused.

[joe817]

That WAS an interesting conversation you had jmra! 40% eh? I wish we had those kinds of numbers!

The 3 day waiting period is almost laughable. He obviously is not interested in guns like we on the forum are. In fact, I believe a lot of LEO's aren't interested in them other than the fact they are just an additional tool in their law enforcement toolbox, like a pair of handcuffs or a flashlight. They have equal weight in importance(in their mind). My opinion only.

[harrycallahan]

Perhaps you could just agree with him and tell him that you also support a 3 day waiting period for LEO's on firearm purchases. After all, 1 in 3 are criminals hiding behind their badges so it is in the interest of public safety that you say this.
He'll choke, cough and take a deep breath, but then you can say 'Now that I have your attention' lets have a meaningful and factual discussion...

[Jago668]

Went to look, it is 3.075 percent of the population for 2014. I wish it was like 40% of the state. I've had discussions with people on other areas of law, and have heard "but an officer told me" many times. I've had to tell them many times that officers don't always know the law, pull out my phone and pull up the statute to show them. One example was that a knife couldn't be more than 4" long.

[TVGuy]

Unfortunately, it is like any other line of work. People get comfortable, don't work as hard, don't care as much. If you work in an office, look around you and think about how many of your coworkers actually do a good job and care.

[omegaman]

I know they have a lot to keep up with, but I think "continuing education" should become a priority in many of our departments.

[fickman]

I have often said that people default to ascribing "Firearm Expert" status to all LEOs because they wear one for their job. Some LEOs are firearm experts. Many use their gun 1x/year for qualifying and know just enough to keep it lubed and loaded.

This comes up because I often see people ask LEOs for their opinion on a new gun and weigh that advice heavier than a non-LEO firearm enthusiast. I've asked before if they consulted the LEO before buying a new car, which is another category of tool used by police everyday.

The same definitely goes for gun-related laws.

[hornetfan63]

This reminds me of the time when I asked a PO what sig he was carrying to start a conversation. "His response was I don't know what ever the department issues." If you carry a firearm everyday for a living you should at least know what the name of the firearm is. I am very PO friendly but this guy was a moron.

[Bolton Strid]

Had an interesting conversation with a LEO the other day. I work with a number of officers so these conversations are not unusual.
The conversation started off with a discussion about open carry. The LEO could not understand why it was necessary for anyone to OC and felt it would make his job much more difficult. When I suggested that he would rarely if ever see anyone OC he looked at me in shock and said, "With 40% of Texas residents having CHLs we are expecting a lot of OC".
When I tried to convince him that less than 4% of the population of Texas had a CHL he thought I was crazy. I had to pull up the population stats and the CHL stats. Once he saw the numbers he still insisted that his department and others were being told that the numbers are at 40%.
The conversation moved on to his lamenting that as a police officer he was still subject to the same Texas 3 day waiting period for handgun purchases as everyone else...

I am constantly amazed about how little many LEO seem to know about current gun laws. Maybe it's just the area where I live but I'm constantly educating officers who are either misinformed on changes in the law or simply missed law changes completely. I know they have a lot to keep up with, but I think "continuing education" should become a priority in many of our departments.
ETA: I should add that the younger officers I encounter seem to be much more up to date and informed on current gun laws. It seems to be the guys who have been around for a while that are confused.

Thanks for posting this - you're not the only one who has seen/heard something like this. As hard as it may seem in this day and age, there are going to be people who didn't "get the memo", had bad training - or even worse, bad leadership - or maybe doesn't give a crap one way or another since they feel they can just do 'whatever', wing it on the spot and they're good to go. Like the saying goes, it takes all kinds, and they're out there. People either don't recall or else don't know about the very early days of concealed carry in TX. It darn sure had its bumps. Had a friend who got his CHL at the very start, he got pulled over one day for a traffic stop, he did everything he was taught to do in CHL class at that time, be totally cooperative, hand over his card with his DL and also verbally notify the officer and so forth. It didn't matter. He got a gun right in his face, with the cop calling for backup on the radio, with more cops arriving to point even more guns at him. Friend knew that he had done everything correctly and was breaking no laws, it was just a matter of staying cool while it got worked out, which it did. More recently, I cannot remember the time frame exactly, 3-4 years back, maybe a little more, there was some dude in a rinky-dink town that would fly out of the margins with any CHLer he would stop. He would seize the gun, run serial numbers to see if it was stolen, search the vehicle, since he believed the presence of the gun was probable cause - we're talking like 20 to 30 minute traffic stops for those encounters. I don't know if those wacky traffic stops had anything to do with it or not but he only lasted a few months at that job before disappearing. Again, that was only about 3-4 years ago or so. Expect the unexpected.

[ShootDontTalk]

Snip......

I am constantly amazed about how little many LEO seem to know about current gun laws.

I agree....but....if you think that is bad, you should arrange to be on the range on the first day of firearms instruction for new students at the Academy. Be sure to find the quickest route to the bunker.

[OldCurlyWolf]

Snip......

I am constantly amazed about how little many LEO seem to know about current gun laws.

I agree....but....if you think that is bad, you should arrange to be on the range on the first day of firearms instruction for new students at the Academy. Be sure to find the quickest route to the bunker.

Wasn't that way in my academy, 37 years ago. The worst score fired the first session was in the mid 60's. Most of us did 80 and higher.

No stupid violations of safety rules either. We had good range officers and cadets who either already knew safety or listened well and learned.

[ShootDontTalk]

What is really surprising is that a fair percentage today have never even touched a firearm before. I thought nearly everybody in Texas, well maybe except Austin and parts of Houston, had handled a gun. I believe I have misjudged the situation.

[Jago668]

What is really surprising is that a fair percentage today have never even touched a firearm before. I thought nearly everybody in Texas, well maybe except Austin and parts of Houston, had handled a gun. I believe I have misjudged the situation.

More and more people are born and raised in an urban setting now. For a variety of reason that tends to shift things toward not having shot before. Just the way things are, which is why I don't mind taking people to the gun range. I'll happily let someone shoot a $10 box of 9mm for free to get a new person on the range. I already know ya'll shoot, so don't try to play innocent for a free box of ammo.

[Vol Texan]

What is really surprising is that a fair percentage today have never even touched a firearm before. I thought nearly everybody in Texas, well maybe except Austin and parts of Houston, had handled a gun. I believe I have misjudged the situation.

More and more people are born and raised in an urban setting now. For a variety of reason that tends to shift things toward not having shot before. Just the way things are, which is why I don't mind taking people to the gun range. I'll happily let someone shoot a $10 box of 9mm for free to get a new person on the range. I already know ya'll shoot, so don't try to play innocent for a free box of ammo.

No, not at all. I just want to know where you're getting that $10 box of 9mm!!!

[nightmare69]

This LEO isn't paying attention to his legal update we must take every 2 years through TCOLE. We have to have 40hrs of continuing education every 2yrs.