Bellaire: another police shooting error
Re: Bellaire: another police shooting error
My main point wasn't to judge the officer's actions, as I wasn't there and the post originally listed a newspaper's account of the incident. I do not believe the job of the media is to monitor governmental actions but to report fact. IMO the media reports incidents in a matter that will sell newspapers or increase viewers or listeners. Bottom line, the media needs revenue to exist. I just don't like the media thinking they are the judge and jury.
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Re: Bellaire: another police shooting error
The other shoe dropped: Sgt. Jeffrey Cotton was indicted Monday on one count of aggravated assault by a public servant.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/ap/tx/6361011.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.khou.com/news/local/crime/st ... 40744.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Please keep in mind that an indictment means only that a grand jury found probable cause that the defendant committed a felony. The defendant is presumed innocent until he pleads or is found guilty at trial.
At last report, Mr. Tolan was planning to sue the City of Bellaire.
- Jim
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/ap/tx/6361011.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.khou.com/news/local/crime/st ... 40744.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Please keep in mind that an indictment means only that a grand jury found probable cause that the defendant committed a felony. The defendant is presumed innocent until he pleads or is found guilty at trial.
At last report, Mr. Tolan was planning to sue the City of Bellaire.
- Jim
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Re: Bellaire: another police shooting error
And he'll probably prevail and won't need to go to the major league to make any $$$$, he'll make it in court or mediation.seamusTX wrote: At last report, Mr. Tolan was planning to sue the City of Bellaire.
- Jim
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Re: Bellaire: another police shooting error
A jury trial on this case in Harris County would be such a wild card for the city, I would expect them to settle. The decision may be up to the city's insurance company.
I would like to know more about the erroneous identification of the vehicle as stolen, which led to this debacle.
If I can climb on my soapbox for a minute, this incident shows how the proverbial "want of a horseshoe nail" and a moment of confusion in the dark destroyed one career and affected at least two families for the rest of their lives.
- Jim
I would like to know more about the erroneous identification of the vehicle as stolen, which led to this debacle.
If I can climb on my soapbox for a minute, this incident shows how the proverbial "want of a horseshoe nail" and a moment of confusion in the dark destroyed one career and affected at least two families for the rest of their lives.
- Jim
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Re: Bellaire: another police shooting error
The Police unions are involved also. They often want to continue to fight when its against the city's interest to continue.seamusTX wrote:A jury trial on this case in Harris County would be such a wild card for the city, I would expect them to settle. The decision may be up to the city's insurance company.
I would like to know more about the erroneous identification of the vehicle as stolen, which led to this debacle.
If I can climb on my soapbox for a minute, this incident shows how the proverbial "want of a horseshoe nail" and a moment of confusion in the dark destroyed one career and affected at least two families for the rest of their lives.
- Jim
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"Today, we need a nation of Minutemen, citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom." John F. Kennedy
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Re: Bellaire: another police shooting error
[quote="GrayHawk" I do not believe the job of the media is to monitor governmental actions but to report fact. [/quote]
The founding fathers, and many scholars of the bill of rights would disagree with you. This is one of the reasons we're guaranteed a free press.![thumbs2 :thumbs2:](./images/smilies/thumbsup2.gif)
The founding fathers, and many scholars of the bill of rights would disagree with you. This is one of the reasons we're guaranteed a free press.
![thumbs2 :thumbs2:](./images/smilies/thumbsup2.gif)
.השואה... לעולם לא עוד
Holocaust... Never Again.
Some people create their own storms and get upset when it rains.
--anonymous
Holocaust... Never Again.
Some people create their own storms and get upset when it rains.
--anonymous
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Re: Bellaire: another police shooting error
CopOnce wrote:... but the period of the investigation by the DA's office is enough to make you lose weight, lose sleep and turn a person into a bucket of bolts.
![I Agree :iagree:](./images/smilies/iagree.gif)
Nothing is 'swift' in the criminal justice system. You can be completely innocent with a half dozen eye witnesses and you'll still be plagued by doubts and fear as you await (anywhere from 30 days to a couple of years) a decision from the DA or Grand Jury and see the way the media butchers the story.
For example, a man bursts into another man's apartment brandishing a knife and charges the resident and multiple other persons in apartment.
Resident shoots intruder, fatally.
Resident, 18 years old, calls 911 and requests police and EMT, then panics and flees the scene.
Resident is transported to PD by relatives and cooperates with investigation.
Hours later, local media reports "Police are searching for a killer in [city]" and shows video of the apartment so anyone with basic research skill can find out who the resident was.
Months of anxious waiting later, DA declines to even present case to grand jury, but meanwhile the resident has been evicted, the apartment management has lied to everyone who called and asked about the resident and told them "oh, he's in jail" (resident was never arrested or even detained!). Media spreads this rumor on news sites, etc. etc. etc.
Not to mention all the wanna-be PIs who call police every time they see said resident somewhere because they think he must be wanted, since media never printed any retractions to the orginal "police searching for a killer" story.
And said resident is unable to go public because there's no statute of limitations and since there's not been a no-bill or official case filing, there is no protection under double jeopardy. He just gets to live with it hanging over his head the rest of his life.
The average mainstream reporter in this country cares nothing about facts or discretion. They only care about making the story as sensational as possible.
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Re: Bellaire: another police shooting error
A jury was seated in the trial of the police officer today. Trial is scheduled to start tomorrow.
http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?secti ... id=7421176" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
- Jim
http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?secti ... id=7421176" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
- Jim
Re: Bellaire: another police shooting error
If the police are truly innocent in this case why does everyone on the planet have to stand behind them for support?
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Re: Bellaire: another police shooting error
I have not been in the courtroom, and IANAL, but...I'm betting a round at the neighborhood bar that the officer is acquitted.
Chuckybrown
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Re: Bellaire: another police shooting error
As usual, it's difficult to figure out all the details without being in the courtroom.
It seems clear to me that the officers believed in good faith that they were arresting the occupants of a stolen vehicle.
According to testimony, the first officer entered the license plate number into his computer incorrectly. He was off by one digit. Incredibly, the response came back as a stolen vehicle of the same model and color.
The defendant, Mr. Cotton, arrived at the scene after the suspects were on the ground.
Again, according to prosecution testimony, Mr. Tolen's mother became irate and did not obey the officers' commands.
Mr. Tolen was shot when he tried to get up and intervene.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/spo ... 90937.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.myfoxhouston.com/dpp/news/lo ... r-on-trial" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/met ... 93089.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
The defense case began today:
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/met ... 95267.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
- Jim
It seems clear to me that the officers believed in good faith that they were arresting the occupants of a stolen vehicle.
According to testimony, the first officer entered the license plate number into his computer incorrectly. He was off by one digit. Incredibly, the response came back as a stolen vehicle of the same model and color.
The defendant, Mr. Cotton, arrived at the scene after the suspects were on the ground.
Again, according to prosecution testimony, Mr. Tolen's mother became irate and did not obey the officers' commands.
Mr. Tolen was shot when he tried to get up and intervene.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/spo ... 90937.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.myfoxhouston.com/dpp/news/lo ... r-on-trial" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/met ... 93089.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
The defense case began today:
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/met ... 95267.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
- Jim
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Re: Bellaire: another police shooting error
I'm wondering why he was only charged with aggravated assault instead of attempted murder. Wouldn't I, under the same set of "as reported" circumstances, likely be charged with AA just for pulling my weapon and pointing it at him? And if I gut shot him, isn't that attempted murder? I mean really, the guy wasn't armed, he didn't resist arrest, he didn't attempt to flee, he apparently did attempt to defend his mother after she was shoved around, and as it turned out he wasn't even driving a stolen vehicle much less the one who supposedly stole it. From what I've read there doesn't seem to me to be any reason to use the threat of deadly force much less justification to poke a leaded hole in the guy's liver. Is there a different set of rules for a cop who shoots an innocent person?
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Re: Bellaire: another police shooting error
Attempted murder is difficult to prove. The state has to prove that the defendant intentionally tried to cause the death of the victim.JNMAR wrote:I'm wondering why he was only charged with aggravated assault instead of attempted murder.
When the victim actually has a bullet in him, it's a lot easier to prove aggravated assault.
Either crime can draw a range of sentencing that practically makes no difference.
As to the officer's mindset, he did not know and could not have known at the time that the vehicle was not stolen. He was acting in good faith on information that came from others.
The officer testified that he saw Mr. Tolen, who he thought was a felon evading arrest, reach toward his waistband. That is pretty much the core of his defense.
I wish I could have heard the entire prosecution case, because it seems weak.
If you were a uniformed police officer on duty, I think not.Wouldn't I, under the same set of "as reported" circumstances, likely be charged with AA just for pulling my weapon and pointing it at him?
![Wink ;-)](./images/smilies/icon_wink.gif)
- Jim
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Re: Bellaire: another police shooting error
I'll second that bet.chuckybrown wrote:I have not been in the courtroom, and IANAL, but...I'm betting a round at the neighborhood bar that the officer is acquitted.
Psalm 91:2
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Re: Bellaire: another police shooting error
Unfortunately, I know you're right Jim. I'm surprised to hear that a bullet from my weapon lodged in another's liver wouldn't be considered pretty clear evidence that I intended to snuff the guys life out. It's not exactly the same as me shooting his knee cap off to keep him from running away. And the, "he reached for his waistband" defense is right up there with my son telling me the dog ate his homework...ummmm, I didn't believe that either. Seriously, if he didn't have a weapon, and he didn't, who would believe he would be reaching for his waistband? Who knows, if his family hadn't been standing there watching I'd say chances are pretty good he would have ended up having a weapon...even if it had been a recent gift.seamusTX wrote:If you were a uniformed police officer on duty, I think not.Wouldn't I, under the same set of "as reported" circumstances, likely be charged with AA just for pulling my weapon and pointing it at him?![]()
- Jim