HB 1927 on the Senate floor now

[Papa_Tiger]

There has been some discussion as to whether 30.06 and 30.07 signs will be effective as to an LTC, after Sept. 1, 2021. The issue seems to be focused on the fact that an LTC will not be required to carry a handgun in Texas, thus they will not be carrying “under the authority of” their LTC.

While some Penal Code provisions apply only when a person is carrying “under the authority” of their license (ex. TPC §46.035), this is not the case with TPC §§30.06 and 30.07.

Chas.

I'm not a lawyer, so please tell me where I'm wrong in my interpretation.

For there to be an offense of TPC30.06 and 30.07 there is a two pronged test:

Sec. 30.06. TRESPASS BY LICENSE HOLDER WITH A CONCEALED HANDGUN. (a) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder:

(1) carries a concealed handgun under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, on property of another without effective consent; and

(2) received notice that entry on the property by a license holder with a concealed handgun was forbidden.

Sec. 30.07. TRESPASS BY LICENSE HOLDER WITH AN OPENLY CARRIED HANDGUN. (a) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder:

(1) openly carries a handgun under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, on property of another without effective consent; and

(2) received notice that entry on the property by a license holder openly carrying a handgun was forbidden.

If you have a license to carry AND you have it on your person are you ALWAYS carrying under the authority of the license?

[ScottDLS]

There has been some discussion as to whether 30.06 and 30.07 signs will be effective as to an LTC, after Sept. 1, 2021. The issue seems to be focused on the fact that an LTC will not be required to carry a handgun in Texas, thus they will not be carrying “under the authority of” their LTC.

While some Penal Code provisions apply only when a person is carrying “under the authority” of their license (ex. TPC §46.035), this is not the case with TPC §§30.06 and 30.07.

Chas.

I'm not a lawyer, so please tell me where I'm wrong in my interpretation.

For there to be an offense of TPC30.06 and 30.07 there is a two pronged test:

Sec. 30.06. TRESPASS BY LICENSE HOLDER WITH A CONCEALED HANDGUN. (a) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder:

(1) carries a concealed handgun under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, on property of another without effective consent; and

(2) received notice that entry on the property by a license holder with a concealed handgun was forbidden.

Sec. 30.07. TRESPASS BY LICENSE HOLDER WITH AN OPENLY CARRIED HANDGUN. (a) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder:

(1) openly carries a handgun under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, on property of another without effective consent; and

(2) received notice that entry on the property by a license holder openly carrying a handgun was forbidden.

If you have a license to carry AND you have it on your person are you ALWAYS carrying under the authority of the license?

Given the text highlighted it seems that 30.06/7 ONLY apply when you are carrying under the authority of that license, or are we to understand that Peace Officers who happen to have a LTC may not carry (legally) past 30.06/7?

[cowhow]

OK, so let's say, as Charles suggests, that 30.05 renders both 30.06 and 30.07 moot. With the vagueness of the 30.05 signage that's almost opening the door to gunbuster signs. The scary part is I can see an overzealous DA somewhere claiming that that is in fact the proper interpretation of the law. I think there are a few details still up in the air about Constitutional Carry. I don't know if the relationship between LTC and Constitutional Carry were thoroughly hashed out.

[ScottDLS]

OK, so let's say, as Charles suggests, that 30.05 renders both 30.06 and 30.07 moot. With the vagueness of the 30.05 signage that's almost opening the door to gunbuster signs. The scary part is I can see an overzealous DA somewhere claiming that that is in fact the proper interpretation of the law. I think there are a few details still up in the air about Constitutional Carry. I don't know if the relationship between LTC and Constitutional Carry were thoroughly hashed out.

I don't think that's what he was saying, 30.05 still contains the Defense for LTC. And 30.06/7 still specify that in order to be effective you have to be carrying under the authority of your LTC. Again, the simplest example is a Peace Officer who happens to have an LTC carrying past the sign.

[RoyGBiv]

Given that 46.035 is being deleted, I'd need to check the new language to see if it keeps that 46.035 caveat.

[philip964]

So is there a thread where one could find out everything about this new constitutional carry? I saw a map and Texas was listed as a constitutional carry state.

Does it affect LTC or me at all?

Did it really pass?

What are the new rules?

I assume there are rules?

I didn't pay much attention, as I thought it probably would not happen, but I understand it really happened. So now I'm interested.

Were there any changes for LTC folks? Carry in bars? Signs are only for non LTC?

My assumption is that nothing really changed except a criminal will have to be convicted of his first crime before he can't carry a gun? So on his arrests, he isn't charged with a gun crime, until he is convicted for the first time?

Or were there some cool things I need to know?

I plan on keeping my LTC regardless as it is very helpful after boating accidents.

[ScottDLS]

So is there a thread where one could find out everything about this new constitutional carry? I saw a map and Texas was listed as a constitutional carry state.

Does it affect LTC or me at all?

Did it really pass?

What are the new rules?

I assume there are rules?

I didn't pay much attention, as I thought it probably would not happen, but I understand it really happened. So now I'm interested.

Were there any changes for LTC folks? Carry in bars? Signs are only for non LTC?

My assumption is that nothing really changed except a criminal will have to be convicted of his first crime before he can't carry a gun? So on his arrests, he isn't charged with a gun crime, until he is convicted for the first time?

Or were there some cool things I need to know?

I plan on keeping my LTC regardless as it is very helpful after boating accidents.

Well, it's still awaiting the Governors action, but likely that's just a formality. On this thread many of us have been trying to understand the new rules (aka law). I guess the best place to start is to read the enrolled version of the bill itself.

https://capitol.texas.gov/BillLookup/Te ... ll=HB1927

There is also some hearing information and legislative briefs from when the bill was being debated there as well.

[philip964]

So is there a thread where one could find out everything about this new constitutional carry? I saw a map and Texas was listed as a constitutional carry state.

Does it affect LTC or me at all?

Did it really pass?

What are the new rules?

I assume there are rules?

I didn't pay much attention, as I thought it probably would not happen, but I understand it really happened. So now I'm interested.

Were there any changes for LTC folks? Carry in bars? Signs are only for non LTC?

My assumption is that nothing really changed except a criminal will have to be convicted of his first crime before he can't carry a gun? So on his arrests, he isn't charged with a gun crime, until he is convicted for the first time?

Or were there some cool things I need to know?

I plan on keeping my LTC regardless as it is very helpful after boating accidents.

Well, it's still awaiting the Governors action, but likely that's just a formality. On this thread many of us have been trying to understand the new rules (aka law). I guess the best place to start is to read the enrolled version of the bill itself.

https://capitol.texas.gov/BillLookup/Te ... ll=HB1927

There is also some hearing information and legislative briefs from when the bill was being debated there as well.

But is this the final thing that the Governor signs, I heard it gets blended together in conference committees and stuff?

[ScottDLS]

...


But is this the final thing that the Governor signs, I heard it gets blended together in conference committees and stuff?

Yes the conference committees already concluded and the resulting bill was passed by both Houses. On to the Governor. On the linked page, go to the
final enrolled bill.

https://capitol.texas.gov/BillLookup/Te ... ill=HB1927

[safety1]

This all makes my head hurt

[K.Mooneyham]

So, again, I'm now confused. IF a business has up 30.06 and 30.07 signs, but does NOT have 30.05 signs posted, are people who do NOT have an LTC allowed to carry past the signs, but those WITH an LTC are NOT allowed to carry past the signs? That doesn't make any sense at all. Especially since there will now be THREE signs, some businesses might just conclude that the current signs keep everyone from carrying in their establishment. And, does it matter if you don't have the actual LTC on you if you carry into an establishment that has 06/07 but not 05 signs? Or, is the fact that you were ISSUED that LTC mean you are always carrying "under the authority of", even if you don't have it on your person? I'm with "safety1", this is making my head hurt.

[Tex1961]

It’s Friday the 28th. What happens if the Governor doesn’t sign by Monday.

[Mel]

It’s Friday the 28th. What happens if the Governor doesn’t sign by Monday.

It's my understanding that if the Governor doesn't VETO, it becomes law on 01 SEP 2021.

[03Lightningrocks]

It’s Friday the 28th. What happens if the Governor doesn’t sign by Monday.

It's my understanding that if the Governor doesn't VETO, it becomes law on 01 SEP 2021.

Just the same. I don't understand why he has not signed it yet. Is it some kind of political game? Let it pass and then claim he didn't sign it if confronted by leftist scum?

[Papa_Tiger]

It’s Friday the 28th. What happens if the Governor doesn’t sign by Monday.

From "The Legislative Process in Texas"

On receiving an enrolled bill, the governor has the option to sign it, veto it, or allow it to become law without a signature. The governor has 10 days in which to act unless the bill was sent to the governor within 10 days of final adjournment, in which case the governor has until 20 days after final adjournment to act.

Since HB 1927 has not yet been sent to the governor (it has been enrolled and signed in both the House and the Senate, and WILL be sent to the governor before the session is over) he will have 20 days to veto it, sign it into law or let it become law without his signature.

There will probably be a very public, press-heavy signing ceremony somewhere symbolic prior to June 20th and the law will go into effect on September 1, 2021.