Critical legislation for 2015

[Charles L. Cotton]

I was surprised at the number who selected #9 -

"Repeal TPC §42.01(a)(8) make it unlawful to display a firearm or other deadly weapon in a public place in a manner calculated to cause alarm."

Maybe Im missing something here, but why should this law be repealed?

BTW Good survey.

It's unnecessary because other charges can be filed such as assault and terroristic threat, if the person truly does something threatening. As currently written, it has been and will continue to be abused by LEOs and prosecutors because it is so vague and nonspecific as to the elements of the crime. "Calculated to cause alarm" by whom? Does it mean the person with the gun, the general public, the person who has an irrational fear of all firearms, or any or all of those people? It should be repealed regardless whether open-carry passes, but it will be a critical piece of legislation if open-carry does pass.

Chas.

Regarding this, it appears that none of the current open carry bills address this concern.

To be quite frank and honest, I doubt you will see it in an OC bill, this will probably go into it's own bill.

Correct and unfortunately counterproductive tactics is making this extremely difficult to get done.

Chas.

[E.Marquez]

Correct and unfortunately counterproductive tactics is making this extremely difficult to get done.

Chas.

Im very concerned, the antics of a few are going to torpedo ALL useful and worthy gun bill this session. Im concerned it will be seen as better idea to kick the can down the road.

Of the poll choices #2 Repeal of all off-limits areas for Texas CHLs (excluding federal laws) [HB3218 in 2013]; and #9 Repeal TPC §42.01(a)(8) make it unlawful to display a firearm or other deadly weapon in a public place in a manner calculated to cause alarm are my personal priority's, but I get that is an individual opinion thing.

[ScooterSissy]

As much as #5 is an annoyance, I'm surprised it's getting so many votes.
If I know a sign is unenforceable, I ignore it.

Would I like to see a penalty? Certainly.
Do I give it that much priority? No. I'd put it near the bottom of my list.

Getting 3218 passed obviates this problem.

5. Create a substantial civil penalty for governmental agencies and political subdivisions that post unenforceable 30.06 signs [HB508 in 2013];

I'll do my best to explain WHY it's important (to some of us - BTW, I've been asking my my reps for such a law for years now).

Let's play with a different scenario. Let's say your next door neighbor is a policeman, and you've decided to paint your house pink (we'll also pretend you're not in an HOA - another subject entirely - so you're free to paint it any color you want).

Your police officer neighbor gets wind of it, and tells you he's afraid an ugly pink house will bring his property values down, and if you do it, he's going to find some reason to haul you off to jail. You KNOW you're not really breaking any laws, but you know he's a jerk and just might keep his word and haul you off to jail, an you don't want to go to jail. Do you simply start talking up the advantages of blue paint to your wife??

I hope you see my point. I've seen a number of 30.06 signs that I knew were improperly posted. However, I have neither the desire to take a ride in a police car, not the money and time to fight the offending city or county in court. So, I sheepishly go back to my vehicle and either put my gun away, or go somewhere else.

I should not have to do that. When a city official makes a threat under color of law that they know is illegal, that's called official oppression (that's my non-legal opinion, though I would think that Texas Penal Code 39.03 would support that view). #5 would codify that, and enable me to make a simple call to the offending agency, and let them know they're subject to fine.

[nightmare69]

From my local news...

"(Open carry) has been pushed off the rails by the nut jobs," said Jerry Patterson, a former Marine, gun enthusiast and open-carry advocate who wrote the state's concealed handgun license law as a state lawmaker in the early 1990s.

http://www.news-journal.com/news/state/ ... 30d27.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Is this true?

[artx]

From my local news...

"(Open carry) has been pushed off the rails by the nut jobs," said Jerry Patterson, a former Marine, gun enthusiast and open-carry advocate who wrote the state's concealed handgun license law as a state lawmaker in the early 1990s.

http://www.news-journal.com/news/state/ ... 30d27.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Is this true?

The road has gotten much harder due to certain folks antics. Since then, Dan Patrick's staff met with the main offenders. Hopefully things will cool off and we can get something done.
http://blog.chron.com/texaspolitics/201 ... activists/

[baldeagle]

From my local news...

"(Open carry) has been pushed off the rails by the nut jobs," said Jerry Patterson, a former Marine, gun enthusiast and open-carry advocate who wrote the state's concealed handgun license law as a state lawmaker in the early 1990s.

http://www.news-journal.com/news/state/ ... 30d27.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Is this true?

I can tell you one thing. It's a clear example of opinion masquerading as news.

Republican Lt. Gov. Dan Patrick, a tea party favorite, took a surprising step back from his campaign pledge to "fight for open carry." Patrick stunned open carry advocates when he said it wasn't a Senate priority and didn't have the votes to pass.
Open Carry Tarrant County leader Kory Watkins urged open carry advocates to respond and posted "We the people are the power," and, "Get your panic buttons ready" on Facebook.
About 24 hours later, Patrick issued a statement saying he's never wavered on Second Amendment issues and promised the Senate would "focus" on an open carry bill.

First of all, Patrick has never said OC isn't a Senate priority. The media made that up out of thin air. Secondly, the way this is written makes it appear that Patrick caved in to the OC activists which is also false.

[Ruark]

Just to put my 2 cents in, I am very much against any attempts to lower the standards for who can receive their CHL. This includes shortening classroom time or especially removing some of the disqualifying criminal offenses. As it stands right now, those that have their CHL can say they are part of an "elite" group that has, for the most part, never been in trouble with the law. If we start lowering that bar we are only shooting ourselves in the foot

I STRONGLY STRONGLY agree. Amidst all of this silliness from OCTC, the public's general hysteria about guns, etc. there is one island of calm and common sense: the CHL holder, who has passed the test and has proven to be a "high quality" group. We're an island of calm and competence in this whole issue. I'm sure many legislators would support licensed carry for CHL holders, just taking the CHL privilege a step further to carrying openly. If we lower that bar, we gradually sink down into the rabble and our credibility fades.

[CleverNickname]

I disagree. The CHL class boils down to "Don't be a jerk. You're not a junior policeman now. Here's where you can carry and where you can't. Please stay awake for long enough to regurgitate this info in a multiple choice test. Shoot this 50-round test that a blind spastic monkey could complete." Passing the CHL class doesn't make someone "elite" in any sense of the word.

If you want to make the case for a required class, then you need to look at stats for other states which have no required class and show they have higher rates of licensee misconduct and/or shooting at things in self-defense and missing them than we have in Texas (or other states with required classes).

[Charles L. Cotton]

I disagree. The CHL class boils down to "Don't be a jerk. You're not a junior policeman now. Here's where you can carry and where you can't. Please stay awake for long enough to regurgitate this info in a multiple choice test. Shoot this 50-round test that a blind spastic monkey could complete." Passing the CHL class doesn't make someone "elite" in any sense of the word.

If you want to make the case for a required class, then you need to look at stats for other states which have no required class and show they have higher rates of licensee misconduct and/or shooting at things in self-defense and missing them than we have in Texas (or other states with required classes).

If that's all you got from your CHL class, then I'm sorry you missed so much. I wish statistics like those published in Texas were available for other states so I could track them like I do for Texas. If the numbers are as good as we see in Texas, then that would be valuable information to use when promoting unlicensed carry.

Chas.

[Ruark]

I disagree. The CHL class boils down to "Don't be a jerk. You're not a junior policeman now. Here's where you can carry and where you can't. Please stay awake for long enough to regurgitate this info in a multiple choice test. Shoot this 50-round test that a blind spastic monkey could complete." Passing the CHL class doesn't make someone "elite" in any sense of the word.

Perhaps "elite" is too strong a word. But compared to some of the OC loonies, a CHL holder has at least a minimal status as being a law abiding, reasonable person. I guess it depends on what kind of CHL class you had. Mine was extremely thorough and detailed, and the teacher had 30 years of law enforcement (police, DEA, Blackwater) experience. Granted, it's not commando training, and it's not supposed to be. But having the exhaustive background check, etc. stands for something.

Let's not allow this discussion to be sidetracked into an argument on the content and value of CHL classes.

[Ruark]

I disagree. The CHL class boils down to "Don't be a jerk. You're not a junior policeman now. Here's where you can carry and where you can't. Please stay awake for long enough to regurgitate this info in a multiple choice test. Shoot this 50-round test that a blind spastic monkey could complete." Passing the CHL class doesn't make someone "elite" in any sense of the word.

Perhaps "elite" is too strong a word. But compared to some of the OC loonies, a CHL holder has at least a minimal status as being a law abiding, reasonable person. I guess it depends on what kind of CHL class you had. Mine was extremely thorough and detailed, and the teacher had 30 years of law enforcement (police, DEA, Blackwater) experience. Granted, it's not commando training, and it's not supposed to be. But having the exhaustive background check, etc. stands for something when it comes to credibility.

Let's not allow this discussion to be sidetracked into an argument on the content and value of CHL classes.

[ScooterSissy]

I disagree. The CHL class boils down to "Don't be a jerk. You're not a junior policeman now. Here's where you can carry and where you can't. Please stay awake for long enough to regurgitate this info in a multiple choice test. Shoot this 50-round test that a blind spastic monkey could complete." Passing the CHL class doesn't make someone "elite" in any sense of the word.

If you want to make the case for a required class, then you need to look at stats for other states which have no required class and show they have higher rates of licensee misconduct and/or shooting at things in self-defense and missing them than we have in Texas (or other states with required classes).

If that's all you got from your CHL class, then I'm sorry you missed so much. I wish statistics like those published in Texas were available for other states so I could track them like I do for Texas. If the numbers are as good as we see in Texas, then that would be valuable information to use when promoting unlicensed carry.

Chas.

With all due respect to the courses, I think the legal requirements do more to weed out folks for Texas CHL than the difficulty of the classroom requirements. I learned some interesting information from my CHL class, but I've learned far more in other places (including this forum you provide for us).

I'm about 95% sure I could have passed the written test requirement (that's not to say I didn't get anything out of the lecture portion beyond passing the test); and I know for sure I could have passed the "proficiency" testing on the range. That was my first time ever to shoot a handgun, and I outshot the deputy sheriff that shared my lane.