Houston: Don't bring a toy gun to a gun fight

[seamusTX]

Long story short, a robber tried to hold up a "smoke shop" with a toy gun. Unfortunately, the clerk had some real hardware. R.I.P.

http://www.khou.com/news/local/Man-foun ... 37591.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Darwin is hard at work.

- Jim

[Middle Age Russ]

"I don't like repeat offenders. I like dead offenders. -- Ted Nugent

Sometimes bad decisions result in a full measure of consequences on the actor.

[seamusTX]

I have mixed feelings.

Dead people don't learn much, and his mommy probably will be out there testifying that he was just about to turn his life around.

- Jim

[baldeagle]

I have mixed feelings.

Dead people don't learn much, and his mommy probably will be out there testifying that he was just about to turn his life around.

- Jim

Aren't they all?

[seamusTX]

Not all.

Every now and then I read a news story about someone who was killed this way, or busted, and whoever they can find to interview says something along the lines of, "I figured that would happen."

- Jim

[JALLEN]

I really don't see a problem here. The perp was killed in the commission of a violent felony. There was no mistaken identification, no victims, there will be no trial or mistrial, or appeal, and no recidivism. The People are not going to be put to the expense of feeding and housing him. Nobody made him do it, and he won't do it again.

And, perhaps other would be wannabees will read his story in the paper and decide maybe they should stick to being a caddy, or sweeping up after the elephants, or something. Wouldn't that be something!

[seamusTX]

... read his story in the paper ...

This is the obstacle. They can't read, or don't want to try. They don't watch TV channels like KHOU (the CBS affiliate in Houston).

Probably they are running around trying to figure out the next hustle when they're not looking for you-know-what.

- Jim

[jmra]

... read his story in the paper ...

This is the obstacle. They can't read, or don't want to try. They don't watch TV channels like KHOU (the CBS affiliate in Houston).

Probably they are running around trying to figure out the next hustle when they're not looking for you-know-what.

- Jim

[misterlarry]

I really don't see a problem here. The perp was killed in the commission of a violent felony. There was no mistaken identification, no victims, there will be no trial or mistrial, or appeal, and no recidivism. The People are not going to be put to the expense of feeding and housing him. Nobody made him do it, and he won't do it again.

And, perhaps other would be wannabees will read his story in the paper and decide maybe they should stick to being a caddy, or sweeping up after the elephants, or something. Wouldn't that be something!

Exactly. No problem here.

[Bob in Big D]

Based on the news article this really seems like a waste of time and money to present this to a grand jury. I realize it is sop but I would think the DA would know, based on the evidence that this will be no-billed.
Does the clerk need to lawyer up when his case is presented to a Grand Jury?

[chasfm11]

I really don't see a problem here. The perp was killed in the commission of a violent felony. There was no mistaken identification, no victims, there will be no trial or mistrial, or appeal, and no recidivism. The People are not going to be put to the expense of feeding and housing him. Nobody made him do it, and he won't do it again.

And, perhaps other would be wannabees will read his story in the paper and decide maybe they should stick to being a caddy, or sweeping up after the elephants, or something. Wouldn't that be something!

For every one of those, there seem to be 10 more who are convinced that THEY can beat the odds. Teen-age mentality doesn't end when your birthday starts with "2" or more.

[seamusTX]

Based on the news article this really seems like a waste of time and money to present this to a grand jury. I realize it is sop but I would think the DA would know, based on the evidence that this will be no-billed.

I think you answered your own question. It is S.O.P.

I don't know that it's so much a waste of money. The cops and prosecutors are on salary, and the grand jurors are paid a pittance.

OTOH, when a man is killed, maybe it's better to have uninvolved citizens look at the event. In the bad old days, there were people who got a free pass to commit crimes because the sheriff, police chief, or DA would look the other way. This happened a lot with drunk driving, including DWI fatalities. Also bar fights and romantic triangles.

Does the clerk need to lawyer up when his case is presented to a Grand Jury?

I don't know.

If I were involved, I wouldn't need Ex-Lax—that's for sure. But a defense attorney can't do much until you are actually accused of a crime. Attorneys are not allowed when witnesses are called to answer questions in front of a grand jury, though as I understand it, a witness can leave the room to consult with his lawyer before answering a specific question.

- Jim

[JALLEN]

If I were involved, I wouldn't need Ex-Lax—that's for sure. But a defense attorney can't do much until you are actually accused of a crime. Attorneys are not allowed when witnesses are called to answer questions in front of a grand jury, though as I understand it, a witness can leave the room to consult with his lawyer before answering a specific question.

- Jim

I think a defense attorney would be helpful, pre-indictment, in making sure the DA knew his client's version of the story, to help with corroboration by other witnesses/evidence, avenues of inquiry. A prospective defendant can always claim the 5th even in Grand Jury proceedings, if there is need. And of course, you need to prepare your client for the examination by Grand Jury, to make sure he/she understands the impact of various areas that might be asked about.

[misterlarry]

All you need is one witness to say the perp was a fine outstanding member of the community and you could find yourself going to trial. That's why I'm a [Pre-paid legal service] member.

[seamusTX]

I think a defense attorney would be helpful, pre-indictment, in making sure the DA knew his client's version of the story, to help with corroboration by other witnesses/evidence, avenues of inquiry.... And of course, you need to prepare your client for the examination by Grand Jury, to make sure he/she understands the impact of various areas that might be asked about.

This is all true, especially if there's an initial impression that prosecutors are going for an indictment.

Of course pre-emptive legal defense is difficult to afford for someone making minimum wage.

I have to say that grand juries in Texas, on the whole, seem reasonable about self-defense cases.

- Jim