Pawpaw wrote:srothstein wrote:OK,we have a real answer that i thought would be obvious. If you are stopped by anyone who is not a peace officer as defined in Texas Code of Criminal Procedure section 2.12, whether you are carrying or not, or by a Texas peace officer when you are not armed, you are not legally required to produce your CHL. You are not even required to produce it when they specifically ask you about it because you are not required to have it in your possession.
But for an opposing point of view, what is the advice we give about being unarmed and letting the Texas peace officer know anyway? Why would you change that attitude? The MP, or the federal agent off base, is going to run you through the exact same database that the peace officer will, with the exact same results. If the peace officer is going to want to know more, why would the other LEO not act the same way? I would recommend letting the MP know you have a CHL but are not armed. The rules for detaining you, cuffing you, and searching your car are only very slightly modified when you are on base if you are not in the military and subject to the UCMJ. The 4th Amendment still applies. There is the question of the implied consent sign when you come on base and it is my understanding that the court rulings on this are sort of mixed. I have not kept up with them since 2001 so I could be wrong on this, but that was my understanding the last time I worked near a base.
My recommendation would be to treat the MP, FBI agent, US Marshal, or Border Patrol Agent as exactly the same as you would a peace officer.
But do not forget that you are not allowed to haev the gun on base in most cases, even in the trunk. That part is still way different from the rest of Texas.
I don't think the MP or Federal Agent has access to TCIC, do they? I thought that was limited to Texas peace officers.
When you're on a military installation, the best advice is, "Don't poke the bear with a stick." Telling the MP or USAF SP you have a CHL will make them suspicious that you are carrying and cause a hassle for you.
Yes we have access to TLETS (TCIC/NCIC), we use and are bound by the same rules established by Austin/FBI. Its an inspection policy, not a search. For the inspection to be valid it has to be random and normally there is no PC/RAS. If there is no randomness and I suspect you of a crime I must have consent or search authorization (USAF equivalent to a search warrant) or an exemption recognized in law (i.e. exigent circumstances).
I am an USAF SP and I do not hassle people for things I do not have PC/RAS for. If I find out you have a CHL, I might ask you if you are carrying but that is the same thing any other LEO will do in Texas. Having a CHL is not PC/RAS to believe a crime is being committed (i.e. loaded gun on base) therefore there would be no legal basis outside the scope of the traffic stop given a very limited scenario.
I personally find your comment slightly offensive and speculative. It might make them yes, but to make it sound diffinitive is mean.