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The Mad Moderate

Peace out folks. Im done with this one.

The Mad Moderate

baldeagle wrote:
BrianSW99 wrote:
baldeagle wrote: Frankly, I don't understand how the issue got started to begin with. His mother was an American. I would think that would make him an American regardless of where he was born.
The issue is not whether he's an American citizen. I don't think most people doubt that. The question is about whether he's Natural Born on American soil, which is what the requirement is for being president.
That's not how I read the Constitution. To me Natural Born means born to American citizens, whereever they may reside.

"natural Born" has never been defined in a court as far as i know

The Mad Moderate

boba wrote:
baldeagle wrote:
loadedliberal wrote:Name one President in the past 100 years who has had to deal with something like this for 2 1/2 years after it was legally settled.
You're misrepresenting the issue. It has never been legally settled (meaning in a court of law.)
On the other hand, the Supreme Court did settle the 2000 election but that didn't stop the whining from the tin foil brigade.

I have to give you that one.

Beiruty wrote:Please, please drop the birth certificate issue.
It is becoming tail chasing exercise.

2012 election is on the door step.

What is of more concern is:
1) Economy
2) Deficit and spending.

KD5NRH wrote:
74novaman wrote:Can anyone think of another President in the last 100 years that spent their formative years in another country?
Well, I can think of a few that spent their late teens/early twenties overseas, but they all had a better excuse.

So whats the problem, Obama spent some time in his youth as a child in other countries =. he didnt have much of a choice in the matter and I doubt his mother knew this would become an issue 40 plus years later when he became president. I personally do not have an issue where the President has lived in his past so long as he is eligible to be President as is Obama, where he grew up means nothing, the constitution states he must be a natural born citizen which he has proved, why is where he grew up an issue for you, do you doubt his love of country?

The Mad Moderate

baldeagle wrote:
loadedliberal wrote:Come on folks I said if the birth certificate/ eligibly issues is an issue for you its because you're an idiot or racist. I stand by that. I said earlier there are many good and valid reason to criticize this President and this is not one of the. if you want to call him out on his economic policy or foreign policy I would be inclined to agree. I did not suggest any criticism of the president is race related, just on this particular issue I think it plays a large role. Name one President in the past 100 years who has had to deal with something like this for 2 1/2 years after it was legally settled.
You're misrepresenting the issue. It has never been legally settled (meaning in a court of law.) It may have been settled in your mind, but it obviously hasn't been settled in others'. And to attribute that to racism is the worst kind of racism. You really should be ashamed of yourself for repeatedly making that statement and insisting it's one of the only two possibilities.

Some simple examples will suffice to disprove your allegation.

Some people believe (I believe rightly) that Obama is a marxist. Some of those that believe this are desperate to find any issue they can use to discredit him. It wouldn't matter if his skin was green. They would still push the birth certificate issue, because they honestly believe that's a way to defeat him politically. Remember there were people on the left who did the exact same thing to George Bush regarding the 9/11 conspiracy issue. Yet you would never accuse those people of racism simply because Bush is white, yet that's the worst form of racism there is - to assume simply based on the color of man's skin what the motives of his opponents might be.

Some people push the birth certificate issue because they hate Democrats and will believe anything bad said about them. Obama is a Democrat, so he qualifies for their hatred list. It has absolutely nothing to do with the color of his skin.

You claim the proof was provided (you claim "legally settled") two and a half years ago. Bush supporters claimed the exact same thing about the National Guard records. Yet that didn't stop his opponents from trying to use the issue against him. They too insisted that he had lied, that he hadn't released the official documents, that he was covering up something dark and sinister. That you can't see the parallels in those two clearly political issues says a great deal about your inability to look at issues dispassionately and with an open mind.

If you recall the coverage of the 2008 election, the media speculated openly about whether white voters could find it within themselves to vote for a black man. They actually were shocked when white independents and some conservatives voted for Obama. I found that speculation rather amusing. George Bush had more black people in important positions of authority than Bill Clinton did. Yet the media simply believe that conservatives cannot find it within themselves to treat black people as humans. Personally I would vote for Herman Cain in a heartbeat. Not because he's black (because I don't care about that) but because he "gets it".

Your distorted view of racism is a product of hanging out in places like Huffington Post where that sort of thing is believed and spouted as fact without the slightest bit of supporting evidence.

That is not true, ask Orly Taitz she fled numerous lawsuits in the matter and all were dismissed due to lack of evidence and she was even bared from filing further lawsuits in the matter.

(edited to include proper spelling of name)

The Mad Moderate

baldeagle wrote:
loadedliberal wrote:Come on folks I said if the birth certificate/ eligibly issues is an issue for you its because you're an idiot or racist. I stand by that. I said earlier there are many good and valid reason to criticize this President and this is not one of the. if you want to call him out on his economic policy or foreign policy I would be inclined to agree. I did not suggest any criticism of the president is race related, just on this particular issue I think it plays a large role. Name one President in the past 100 years who has had to deal with something like this for 2 1/2 years after it was legally settled.
Grover Cleveland.

Next question.

ok now I'm just being dramatic. Yes I see that another President has dealt with this but as I said a few times above it should of been settled in '08 when he released his certificate of live birth.

The Mad Moderate

C-dub wrote:After hearing several folks' opinion here that it is fake I'm wondering why I haven't heard anything on the news. Surely, others are also investigating its authenticity. Have I missed the stories about this?

Yes. On Infowars.com and the national inquirer have great articles about it,and while you're at Infowars you can learn everything you wanted to know about the 9/11 "conspiracy".

The Mad Moderate

Come on folks I said if the birth certificate/ eligibly issues is an issue for you its because you're an idiot or racist. I stand by that. I said earlier there are many good and valid reason to criticize this President and this is not one of the. if you want to call him out on his economic policy or foreign policy I would be inclined to agree. I did not suggest any criticism of the president is race related, just on this particular issue I think it plays a large role. Name one President in the past 100 years who has had to deal with something like this for 2 1/2 years after it was legally settled.

The Mad Moderate

OldSchool wrote:
loadedliberal wrote:
OldSchool wrote:
loadedliberal wrote:THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE SHOULD NOT AND HAS NOT BEEN AND ISSUE FOR ANY OTHER PRESIDENT I DO NOT REMEMBER PEOPLE DEMANDING GEORGE BUSH RELESE HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE I DID NOT "PLAY THE RACE CARD" I SIMPLY STATED THAT IF THIS IS YOUR MAIN ISSUE WITH THE PRESIDENT IS HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE ITS EITHER RACE OR IDIOCY TAKE YOUR PICK.
Ummmm - no. I think people are simply insisting that the employee (the President of the US, who is hired by the electorate) provide his/her credentials before being officially given the job. Every time I apply for a job, I must provide all requested materials (proof of citizenship, proof of education, proof of qualifications for the job, etc.). Saying that "it's not fair" is missing the entire point of qualifying for any position.

In particular, that he will not provide the required documentation is a sign of total disrespect for the laws of this country, as if he were somehow above all that. It does not matter anymore, since he was instated without his qualifications being ensured (sorta like getting into college without your SAT score ever being looked at). However, this lack of respect for the law (as if it did not apply to him, and is an insult) stinks to high heaven.

Can anyone here get away with doing something like this?
The "Certificate of live birth" he released in 2008 is enough to get a passport, what more proof did you need, and as to his educational records there is not law or amendment that says a President needs to be smart. I think we have proved that with our past few Presidents.
I repeat and rephrase the question: Could anyone here hold a job showing the disrespect for the hiring authority that he has? Just as I have in the past, were I in his position, I would have gladly offered any proof required that I was qualified for the job. Contrary to your previous post, it is not racist (I have proven my lack of blame in that respect throughout my life, so please don't insult me with that again), but a frustration with the demonstrated arrogance of someone who we must be able to trust with the (written) duty to protect the very existence of our society.

He did turn over the proof required, TWO YEARS AGO! When he released the "short form" birth certificate that is more than enough to get a passport. I WILL SAY AGAING HE RELEASED PROOF OF CITIZENSHIP TWO YEARS AGO. Why was it still an issue this long Why was this an issue and why does it continue to be an issue, there are still many saying that they don't think he was born here. The only constitutional requirements to be President is one be at lest 35, and be born here. The form he released two years ago should of been plenty. I will not back off my earlier accretion that anyone still making an issue of this either holds some level of resentment because the President is black or they are a tin-foil hat conspiracy theorist. I understand that people wanted to be sure he was eligible, but the question was settled two and a half years ago.

The Mad Moderate

OldSchool wrote:
loadedliberal wrote:THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE SHOULD NOT AND HAS NOT BEEN AND ISSUE FOR ANY OTHER PRESIDENT I DO NOT REMEMBER PEOPLE DEMANDING GEORGE BUSH RELESE HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE I DID NOT "PLAY THE RACE CARD" I SIMPLY STATED THAT IF THIS IS YOUR MAIN ISSUE WITH THE PRESIDENT IS HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE ITS EITHER RACE OR IDIOCY TAKE YOUR PICK.
Ummmm - no. I think people are simply insisting that the employee (the President of the US, who is hired by the electorate) provide his/her credentials before being officially given the job. Every time I apply for a job, I must provide all requested materials (proof of citizenship, proof of education, proof of qualifications for the job, etc.). Saying that "it's not fair" is missing the entire point of qualifying for any position.

In particular, that he will not provide the required documentation is a sign of total disrespect for the laws of this country, as if he were somehow above all that. It does not matter anymore, since he was instated without his qualifications being ensured (sorta like getting into college without your SAT score ever being looked at). However, this lack of respect for the law (as if it did not apply to him, and is an insult) stinks to high heaven.

Can anyone here get away with doing something like this?

The "Certificate of live birth" he released in 2008 is enough to get a passport, what more proof did you need, and as to his educational records there is not law or amendment that says a President needs to be smart. I think we have proved that with our past few Presidents.

The Mad Moderate

I am very dissapointed in President Obama so far, to the extent I could see voting agenst him if a strong primary challenger was on the ballot or god forbid

a truely moderate republican. The reason I feel many of your fears of this mans policies and intents are not justified because I don't think he has the backbone to do any of it.

The Mad Moderate

AndyC wrote:
loadedliberal wrote:I saw no evidence anywhere that said he was born elsewhere.
Better tell his grandma - she says he was born in Kenya. How racist of her.

listen to the whole tape not a cut and cropped version on infowars or thebalze

The Mad Moderate

sugar land dave wrote:
loadedliberal wrote:THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE SHOULD NOT AND HAS NOT BEEN AND ISSUE FOR ANY OTHER PRESIDENT I DO NOT REMEMBER PEOPLE DEMANDING GEORGE BUSH RELESE HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE I DID NOT "PLAY THE RACE CARD" I SIMPLY STATED THAT IF THIS IS YOUR MAIN ISSUE WITH THE PRESIDENT IS HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE ITS EITHER RACE OR IDIOCY TAKE YOUR PICK.
Instead of shouting, pick up the Constitution. It really is quite a good read.

Don't insult me by suggesting that I have not read The Constitution. It should have never been an issue this long. With the Certificate of Live Birth that was released in '08 along with the birth announcement in the Hawaii newspaper that at the time was only done by the department of health. The republican Governor of Hawaii saying he had seen the long form certificate personally, among many many other that "claimed" he was indeed born in the united states. Also the burden of proof lies with the accuser, I saw no evidence anywhere that said he was born elsewhere. And as to the John Mccain not being born on U.S. soil, yes I do remember that being an issue for about 2 days until a court ruling settled the matter. There are still lawsuits regarding Obama eligibility for President.

The Mad Moderate

THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE SHOULD NOT AND HAS NOT BEEN AND ISSUE FOR ANY OTHER PRESIDENT I DO NOT REMEMBER PEOPLE DEMANDING GEORGE BUSH RELESE HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE I DID NOT "PLAY THE RACE CARD" I SIMPLY STATED THAT IF THIS IS YOUR MAIN ISSUE WITH THE PRESIDENT IS HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE ITS EITHER RACE OR IDIOCY TAKE YOUR PICK.

The Mad Moderate

The most important thing to note is the birth certificate should never of been an issue, I would like anyone to point out another president that had to deal with an issue like this. I hate to say it and I do not take the words lightly but the only reason I see that could explain it is that he is black. Like I said there are many valid reasons not to like Obama, choosing this one makes you look like an idiot.

The Mad Moderate

I said nothing that should of made anyone think I had something agents companies making billions in profit, I applaud them,their success means they are doing something right. While I have heard a few on the left accuse them of price gouging and to a more extreme extent I have head a few call for the nationalization of the oil companies, I just want to get rid of wasteful spending. And the billions the oil companies get some not even American owned, is a huge wast in a time like this where cuts need to be made.I simply made the point that while raking in those billions they also had their hand in OUR collective pocket courtesy of Uncle Sam.

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