TexasCHLforum.com

txinvestigator wrote:

Paladin wrote:txinvestigator,

You said you have law enforcement experience?

That surprises me.

So you resort to denigrating those who disagree?

I think you denigrated yourself. Your former comment sounded really naive. I'm personnally surprised that someone with law enforcement experience would be that naive.

If a bad guy breaks into my home and they don't run when confronted, and I just wait for him to cover me with his gun, stab me with a knife from my own kitchen, or for his buddy to sneak up behind me... I'm dead. And my family and my pets are dead. Maybe the badguys will go out an kill some more people with the firepower they lifted from my house...

All cause I waited for some explaination for evil?

Like: Excuse me Mr. Burglar... Do you plan on stealing something or just committing some other felony? I can legally shoot you for either one, but I need to know the exact one for my checklist?

Sorry, but I just think your advice would get me and other people killed, and that's why I say it sounds naive.

txinvestigator wrote:
Is he in the imminent commission of Aggravated Robbery, kidnapping, murder, sexual assault, aggravated sexual assault, robbery, or aggravated robbery?

I don't know. do you know what the elements of Agg Robbery are? In the scenario, as you see it in your mind, is the BG doing something that would meet the definition of Agg Robbery?

Actually I know a number of people who were victims of aggravated robbery, aggravated kidnapping, and capital murder.

I've personally witnessed a murder trial and a capital murder trial. Have you?

I've personally witnessed 6 victims of aggravated robbery (2 of whom were shot) testify in court.

You think I might be a bit familure with it?

txinvestigator wrote: For the example I mentioned earlier. If a teenager is stealing the wheels from you car at 2:00 am, thats Theft during the nighttime, right?

So you could just blast them, right?

We talked about just that at the seminar. While it's not at all advisable to do so, because it would be a harsh thing to do and a jury would likely be unsymathetic, you are quoting Texas law. I certainly wouldn't shoot somebody for stealing my hubcaps.

I can quote to you examples of Theft during the nighttime and malicous mischief during the nightime where people were legally killed in Texas.

txinvestigator,

You said you have law enforcement experience?

That surprises me.

being in fear for your life doesn't matter? Maybe you should have made the seminar.

I have studied hundreds, if not thousands of self defense cases. You think the badguys are going to tell you why they are doing what they're doing? You think the badguys are going to tell you they're going to rape or murder while you still have a chance at doing something about it?

txinvestigator wrote:A bad guy entering your home, in an of itself, is not always justification for using deadly force.

I'll say that a bad guy breaking into my home with me or my family home would certainly put me in fear. If they just wanted to steal my stuff they'd most likely do it when no one was home.

Even if the badguy's think that nobodies home, who knows how they would react to finding somebody home? Who knows what they might do? If they run without a fight, well probably they're not a threat. Otherwise I would consider them a threat to my life and the life of my family.

Sec. 9.32. DEADLY FORCE IN DEFENSE OF PERSON. (a) A person is justified in using deadly force against another:
~ ~ (1) if he would be justified in using force against the other under Section 9.31;
~ ~ (2) if a reasonable person in the actor's situation would not have retreated; and
~ ~ (3) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force is immediately necessary:
~ ~ ~ (A) to protect himself against the other's use or attempted use of unlawful deadly force; or
~ ~ ~ (B) to prevent the other's imminent commission of aggravated kidnapping, murder, sexual assault, aggravated sexual assault, robbery, or aggravated robbery.
~ (b) [added 9/1/95] The requirement imposed by Subsection (a)(2) does not apply to an actor who uses force against a person who is at the time of the use of force committing an offense of unlawful entry in the habitation of the actor.

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Looks like there's no requirement to retreat if the badguys are breaking into your house, even if you're outside the house.

I have to say that I'd be in fear if I came home and saw four thugs breaking into my house at 1AM. We don't know if he had family inside the house.

Could be that the homeowner had a longgun or the handgun was in his trunk(maybe )

"June 27, 2005, 8:30AM

Homeowner kills 1, critically wounds another
By S.K. BARDWELL
Copyright 2005 Houston Chronicle

A northeast Houston resident shot and killed one man and critically wounded another after reportedly catching them breaking into his house early today.

The man told police he returned to his house on Lakewood near Jensen just after 1 a.m. today and found four men trying to break in.

He opened fire on the would-be burglars, who fired back before fleeing to a house on Willie near Terrell, about a mile a way, authorities said.

One man died at the house on Willie and another man with gunshot wounds was taken to Ben Taub Hospital, where he is listed in critical condition. Neither of the victim's names has been released yet.

Police are still questioning the man who shot them."

http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mp ... an/3242360

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Sounds like the Homeowner may have been a CHL