Good point. The news articles weren't clear, but he might have had a good view of the BG.Jacob Staff wrote:I wonder if they had a door with a window or a solid door with a glass door in front of it.Paladin wrote:Hours after the shooting, shards of glass from the front-door windows still were heaped at the entrance to the house.
Also, shooting from the top of the stairs lowers the chance of hitting a bystander because of the downward angle.
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Return to “San Antonio: Young Man Shoots and Kills Would-Be Robber”
- Thu Jul 20, 2006 3:12 pm
- Forum: General Gun, Shooting & Equipment Discussion
- Topic: San Antonio: Young Man Shoots and Kills Would-Be Robber
- Replies: 20
- Views: 3532
- Thu Jul 13, 2006 9:56 am
- Forum: General Gun, Shooting & Equipment Discussion
- Topic: San Antonio: Young Man Shoots and Kills Would-Be Robber
- Replies: 20
- Views: 3532
Some other thoughts:
I know a lot of people favor the 'saferoom' home defense plan, but I think everyone should be aware that that plan has some shortcomings. First of all, if you don't have early warning/situational awareness... the badguys may make it in the saferoom before you have the chance to set up.
Secondly, if the badguys know your plan they can exploit it.
When you go up against a human adversary things aren't simple. If the badguys know your plan... even if your plan is the "best" plan... with their knowledge they can exploit the "best" plan and make it the worst plan for you.
I think everybody should have a saferoom plan and a home evacuation plan, but I believe you're better off with a bit more sophistication. Plans like ambushing the badguys at the point of entry and tactical searches are useful and have their place.
I know a lot of people favor the 'saferoom' home defense plan, but I think everyone should be aware that that plan has some shortcomings. First of all, if you don't have early warning/situational awareness... the badguys may make it in the saferoom before you have the chance to set up.
Secondly, if the badguys know your plan they can exploit it.
When you go up against a human adversary things aren't simple. If the badguys know your plan... even if your plan is the "best" plan... with their knowledge they can exploit the "best" plan and make it the worst plan for you.
I think everybody should have a saferoom plan and a home evacuation plan, but I believe you're better off with a bit more sophistication. Plans like ambushing the badguys at the point of entry and tactical searches are useful and have their place.
- Thu Jul 13, 2006 9:55 am
- Forum: General Gun, Shooting & Equipment Discussion
- Topic: San Antonio: Young Man Shoots and Kills Would-Be Robber
- Replies: 20
- Views: 3532
We've talked a about some of the legal aspects of this shoot, but I've been thinking about the tactical aspects.
Overall, from a tactical perspective, I very much think that the residents handled things well. Not perfect, but well.
First of all, Packham was alert. He heard noise outside and checked it at 2:30AM. He saw what was going on early. Situational awareness is a HUGE advantage and Packham had it. Can't emphasize this enough.
Packham's actions were to #1- call 911, #2 get a gun, #3 wake other resident to get his gun. Personally I'd get my gun first, before calling 911, but whatever order IMHO Packham did all the right things here.
Packham and the other resident waited in ambush at the point where the badguys were attempting to make entry. I like this plan. It's an excellent plan. The entry point into the house (i.e. door) is a 'fatal funnel' for the badguys.
Packham shot thru the door, hitting one badguy. This is where I see some potential issues. Surprising the badguys and not letting them rush through the door is great from a tactical perspective. Shooting blindly is not great. One should ID a target before shooting. I don't know if the front door had glass or was solid... but shooting blindly through a solid door is risky.
Packham did a lot of things right, but it appears that he did take a serious life and death chance shooting through the door.
Overall, from a tactical perspective, I very much think that the residents handled things well. Not perfect, but well.
First of all, Packham was alert. He heard noise outside and checked it at 2:30AM. He saw what was going on early. Situational awareness is a HUGE advantage and Packham had it. Can't emphasize this enough.
Packham's actions were to #1- call 911, #2 get a gun, #3 wake other resident to get his gun. Personally I'd get my gun first, before calling 911, but whatever order IMHO Packham did all the right things here.
Packham and the other resident waited in ambush at the point where the badguys were attempting to make entry. I like this plan. It's an excellent plan. The entry point into the house (i.e. door) is a 'fatal funnel' for the badguys.
Packham shot thru the door, hitting one badguy. This is where I see some potential issues. Surprising the badguys and not letting them rush through the door is great from a tactical perspective. Shooting blindly is not great. One should ID a target before shooting. I don't know if the front door had glass or was solid... but shooting blindly through a solid door is risky.
Packham did a lot of things right, but it appears that he did take a serious life and death chance shooting through the door.
- Wed Jul 12, 2006 9:52 am
- Forum: General Gun, Shooting & Equipment Discussion
- Topic: San Antonio: Young Man Shoots and Kills Would-Be Robber
- Replies: 20
- Views: 3532
Some more details here:
http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/metro/ ... 60a52.html
"Police say resident shot would-be intruder to death
Web Posted: 07/11/2006 12:00 AM CDT
Vianna Davila
San Antonio Express-News
A suspected burglar was killed early Monday as he tried to break into a North Side home and a resident shot him through the front door, police said.
Preliminary investigations indicate the resident, Leonard Packham, was justified in firing at the would-be intruder because he was in fear for his life. Police are continuing to investigate the case as an attempted burglary, said San Antonio police Sgt. Gabe Trevino.
Texas law allows a person to use deadly force in self-defense or to defend someone else if the action is what "a reasonable person" would do in the particular situation.
The case will be sent to the Bexar County district attorney's office for a final ruling.
The sound of a pickup door slamming woke Packham, 23, as he slept in his second-floor bedroom inside the house in the 25100 block of Summit Creek around 2:30 a.m. Monday, a police report said.
He looked out the window and saw at least three males get out of two Ford Ranger pickups and walk toward his driveway, the report said.
Then one of them rang the doorbell as the others ran toward the side of the house and in the direction of Packham's backyard.
At some point, Packham called 911. He ran for his handgun and then to the bedroom of another man who lives in the house. That man ran for his gun, and the two waited at the top of the stairs, the report continued. [nice! ]
The would-be burglars then returned to the front door, but this time they tried to kick it in.
The next sound was that of Packham's gun as he fired several shots toward the door from the top of the stairs. Then he heard nothing, the report said.
Police later found a male they believe to be one of the suspected burglars sprawled on the ground in the 3100 block of Summit Crest, around the corner from Packham's home. He died from apparent gunshot wounds, the report said.
The Bexar County medical examiner's office had not identified him Monday. The other two males were at large.
Hours after the shooting, shards of glass from the front-door windows still were heaped at the entrance to the house. Small blood spots dotted the walkway to the door and trailed down to the street.
Neighbors said incidents such as Monday's shooting were anomalies on their quiet street.
From Jan. 1 through the end of May, police were called to the street nine times, according to the most available crime statistics on the Police Department's Web site. Of those, five were to report vehicle burglaries in January.
"This is a good neighborhood," said J.D. Lowrie, 22, who was visiting his mother, Packham's next-door neighbor.
"Look at this neighborhood," said Summit Creek resident Dennis Glaser, as he gestured to his left and then his right. "It's the first time this kind of thing has happened (here)." "
http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/metro/ ... 60a52.html
"Police say resident shot would-be intruder to death
Web Posted: 07/11/2006 12:00 AM CDT
Vianna Davila
San Antonio Express-News
A suspected burglar was killed early Monday as he tried to break into a North Side home and a resident shot him through the front door, police said.
Preliminary investigations indicate the resident, Leonard Packham, was justified in firing at the would-be intruder because he was in fear for his life. Police are continuing to investigate the case as an attempted burglary, said San Antonio police Sgt. Gabe Trevino.
Texas law allows a person to use deadly force in self-defense or to defend someone else if the action is what "a reasonable person" would do in the particular situation.
The case will be sent to the Bexar County district attorney's office for a final ruling.
The sound of a pickup door slamming woke Packham, 23, as he slept in his second-floor bedroom inside the house in the 25100 block of Summit Creek around 2:30 a.m. Monday, a police report said.
He looked out the window and saw at least three males get out of two Ford Ranger pickups and walk toward his driveway, the report said.
Then one of them rang the doorbell as the others ran toward the side of the house and in the direction of Packham's backyard.
At some point, Packham called 911. He ran for his handgun and then to the bedroom of another man who lives in the house. That man ran for his gun, and the two waited at the top of the stairs, the report continued. [nice! ]
The would-be burglars then returned to the front door, but this time they tried to kick it in.
The next sound was that of Packham's gun as he fired several shots toward the door from the top of the stairs. Then he heard nothing, the report said.
Police later found a male they believe to be one of the suspected burglars sprawled on the ground in the 3100 block of Summit Crest, around the corner from Packham's home. He died from apparent gunshot wounds, the report said.
The Bexar County medical examiner's office had not identified him Monday. The other two males were at large.
Hours after the shooting, shards of glass from the front-door windows still were heaped at the entrance to the house. Small blood spots dotted the walkway to the door and trailed down to the street.
Neighbors said incidents such as Monday's shooting were anomalies on their quiet street.
From Jan. 1 through the end of May, police were called to the street nine times, according to the most available crime statistics on the Police Department's Web site. Of those, five were to report vehicle burglaries in January.
"This is a good neighborhood," said J.D. Lowrie, 22, who was visiting his mother, Packham's next-door neighbor.
"Look at this neighborhood," said Summit Creek resident Dennis Glaser, as he gestured to his left and then his right. "It's the first time this kind of thing has happened (here)." "
- Tue Jul 11, 2006 1:32 pm
- Forum: General Gun, Shooting & Equipment Discussion
- Topic: San Antonio: Young Man Shoots and Kills Would-Be Robber
- Replies: 20
- Views: 3532
My understanding is that it is not burglary if they are entirely outside your house.spud wrote:Correct me if im wrong, But I thought that in TX you coudent shoot though your front door at someone because they are not in your house yet nor have you retreated. My instructor has been wrong twice before, just trying to clear this up.
However since the criminals were attempting to beat down the door, you could consider the situation defending your property in the night-time.
Although I know that 3 guys trying to break into my house would definitely put me in fear of my life.
- Tue Jul 11, 2006 12:58 pm
- Forum: General Gun, Shooting & Equipment Discussion
- Topic: San Antonio: Young Man Shoots and Kills Would-Be Robber
- Replies: 20
- Views: 3532
San Antonio: Young Man Shoots and Kills Would-Be Robber
http://www.woai.com/news/local/story.as ... 3F6641980F
"Young Man Shoots and Kills Would-Be Robber
LAST UPDATE: 7/11/2006 11:29:11 AM
Posted By: Laura Berryhill
A young San Antonio man shot and killed a burglar while trying to protect his home on the North Side.
The 23-year-old fired off several shots while burglars tried to kick down the front door at his home on Summit Creek in the Stone Oak area.
The home's front door was riddled with bullet holes and showed signs of the suspects' shoeprints.
Neighbors told us they don't know what they would've done if someone had tried to kick down their door. They agreed the young man who fired at the intruder must have been terrified.
Police say two of the men who live at the home woke up after hearing a door slam. One of them looked out his window and saw 3 suspects approaching the house. Two of them ran along the side of the house, the other rang the door bell.
Seconds later, one of the men started to kick down the front door. A man inside the home then grabbed a gun and started shooting at the door.
Neighbors said they heard several gunshots. Police say the suspect was hit, but managed to run from the scene.
Neighbor Paul Davis said there was a trail of blood leading from the driveway down and across the street. The burlgar collapsed and died in front of a home a few blocks away.
The young man who fired the shot is not facing any charges. The other two robbery suspects got away.
If you have any information about this crime, please call Crime Stoppers at 210-224-STOP. "
"Young Man Shoots and Kills Would-Be Robber
LAST UPDATE: 7/11/2006 11:29:11 AM
Posted By: Laura Berryhill
A young San Antonio man shot and killed a burglar while trying to protect his home on the North Side.
The 23-year-old fired off several shots while burglars tried to kick down the front door at his home on Summit Creek in the Stone Oak area.
The home's front door was riddled with bullet holes and showed signs of the suspects' shoeprints.
Neighbors told us they don't know what they would've done if someone had tried to kick down their door. They agreed the young man who fired at the intruder must have been terrified.
Police say two of the men who live at the home woke up after hearing a door slam. One of them looked out his window and saw 3 suspects approaching the house. Two of them ran along the side of the house, the other rang the door bell.
Seconds later, one of the men started to kick down the front door. A man inside the home then grabbed a gun and started shooting at the door.
Neighbors said they heard several gunshots. Police say the suspect was hit, but managed to run from the scene.
Neighbor Paul Davis said there was a trail of blood leading from the driveway down and across the street. The burlgar collapsed and died in front of a home a few blocks away.
The young man who fired the shot is not facing any charges. The other two robbery suspects got away.
If you have any information about this crime, please call Crime Stoppers at 210-224-STOP. "