TexasCHLforum.com

Excaliber wrote:The way businesses see things, courtesy officers are not expensive and competent emergency responders are. They usually don't realize that during a serious emergency, the economics of the two approaches reverse until they learn the hard way.

You would think they would have learned by now, because every incident of this sort results in lawsuits and multi-million-dollar settlements.

A company that I am familiar with uses unarmed door monitors, but they also hire at least one off-duty uniformed police officer at a time to be present in case of an emergency that requires police expertise.

The business also gets the police training for free that way.

- Jim

WildBill wrote:Some CHLs might run to the parking lot and come back to try to save the lifes of friends. When you have worked at a company for a long time you can have relationships with co-workers that are as close as family.

This has happened successfully a few times—very few.

I think they were cases where the vehicles were very close to the crime scene. People would have to use their best judgment about it.

The main point of parking lot laws is not to equip a bunch of Batman wannabees. It is to allow employees to legally transport weapons and defend themselves if need be traveling to and from work.

- Jim

At age 40 to 50, they might go through the so-called midlife crisis, get divorced, change careers, go to an ashram in India, or something.

Unless they have existing problems like depression or alcoholism, they rarely become violent. Even then, they tend to commit suicide and possibly kill family members.

It's more around age 60 to 80 that I see people who have led normal lives go off the deep end due to dementia.

If everyone there had a .44 magnum locked in their cars in the parking lot, would it have done any good?

In a plant that size, most likely not. I've worked in big plants where I could not have made it from the middle of the plant to my car in the parking lot and back in less than several minutes at my best speed.

And with the cops arriving in a high state of alert ...

- Jim

Hoi Polloi wrote:I don't understand why the guards hadn't done anything as soon as she was past them, why the building wasn't on lock-down, why no one was announcing an active shooter in the building over the intercom...

Good points

Someone wasn't trained well or panicked (which is often a result of not being trained well).

Big companies like Kraft have contingency plans for everything short of the Apocalypse. However, most have outsourced their security personnel to third parties that are mostly interested in maximizing their profit and paying as little as possible to their own employees—the guards.

I could be entirely wrong in this case, but most the places where I have worked or done business have outsourced security.

- Jim

I did not see that religious aspect mentioned.

Normally I assume someone with a name like Hiller would be American, Christian, or possibly Jewish. Maybe she was a convert.

I have to add, from reading the first article, what she seemed to have long-term mental problems and her religion had no direct relationship. The event appeared to have been triggered by her firing, which is usually the case.

You are correct about postal employees. They have a better record in terms of employee violence than the average workplace. The term was invented by the press because a series of multiple-victim post-office shoot-ups took place in a short time, years go.

I changed the subject line, as you can see.

- Jim

In Philadelphia on Thursday a 43-year-old female employee with 21 years at a Kraft Foods plant was fired after a series of disciplinary issues that included accusing other employees of spraying her with toxins and deer scent.

She returned a short time later with a .357 Magnum that she had legally bought earlier this year, and entered the plant by intimidating two unarmed security guards.

She sought out two coworkers with whom she had long-running disputes and fatally shot them. She wounded another who is in critical condition.

During the confrontation she reportedly ranted about the supposed poisoning, 9/11, and Muslims.

She fired at and missed two other employees, then barricaded herself in a room with other employees.

Police forced entry and arrested her with an empty weapon, though she had more ammunition.

She was charged with murder, attempted murder, and other felonies.

This is a well-written article with many interesting details. Note the links to other stories and video on the right.

http://www.philly.com/inquirer/front_pa ... avior.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.philly.com/dailynews/local/2 ... thers.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I normally don't recirculate this kind of lunacy, but this case is particularly bizarre. Women this age, even if mentally ill, rarely commit such acts.

The typical profile for "going postal" is younger males with a history of poor job performance, criminal history, mental illness, and substance-abuse problems.

- Jim