TexasCHLforum.com

*sigh*

03Lightningrocks, you and I are saying the same thing. You're just getting hung up on the fact that it's in the thread about kids playing war in the park, when the conversation has drifted off-topic to someone displaying a realistic toy in a threatening manner. We both agree that CHLers are much less likely to accidentally shoot children in the park. We both agree that CHLers would be justified in shooting a robber wielding a realistic toy gun in a threatening manner.

Not sure why you still think I'm talking about CHLers shooting kids in the park, I've tried to make it clear that's not what I mean. If I were saying that, then I could see how you got to thinking that I was making an anti-CHL argument. I wasn't.

Fangs wrote:I wasn't talking about the kids playing in the park where it's obviously not a deadly force situation. I was talking about something like the Taco Bell situation, before the real guns came out, but where it could still easily be mistaken for a deadly force scenario.

Fangs wrote:Now if you thought I meant that there's a higher chance of kids getting shot for playing airsoft in the park just because we have CHL in Texas, then you misunderstood my intention, quite possibly because I worded my reply poorly.

03Lightningrocks wrote:Pointing the gun at me and pulling the trigger would just make me think it misfired and I better respond quickly or die with a follow up round. BB gun would not have entered my mind.

The above quote was your response to the Taco Bell guy's original threatening toy gun actions, before he went and grabbed the real guns. At least that's how I understand it, forgive me if I'm wrong. I would be thinking the exact same thing. Angry guy who appears to have a real weapon and by chance the safety's on or it misfired, or something. I would take that opportunity to stop the perceived threat, just as you stated you would.

Forgive me for going off-topic without clearly mentioning I was jumping tracks. My belief is that someone running around with a realistic toy weapon in a threatening manner in a state that has armed citizens has greater potential for resulting in serious bodily injury. I wasn't talking about the kids playing in the park where it's obviously not a deadly force situation. I was talking about something like the Taco Bell situation, before the real guns came out, but where it could still easily be mistaken for a deadly force scenario.

I don't think Beiruty or I said anything with the intention of insulting Texas, just that robbing or threatening honest citizens with a realistic toy weapon in a state where they are disarmed is less likely to get you filled with holes than in a state that allows them to protect themselves.

03Lightningrocks wrote:I never said someone could not get shot by displaying a toy gun! I said it is NOT MORE LIKELY BECAUSE FOLKS HAVE A CHL!!!!! My point here was that some folks in this thread, seem to associate a CHL with a higher risk of an accidental shooting. I strongly disagree with you and others on that. I believe a CHL causes most of us to be more cautious about entering confrontation.

I'll have to disagree with you on that. I think it is more likely just because you have more armed citizens. Keep in mind I'm talking about someone with evil intent getting shot where his actions and apparent deadly weapon necessitate a deadly force response. Now if you thought I meant that there's a higher chance of kids getting shot for playing airsoft in the park just because we have CHL in Texas, then you misunderstood my intention, quite possibly because I worded my reply poorly. I also agree with you that having a CHL makes us more cautious.

Hope that clarified my position on the subject a bit.

To quote you from Taco Bell shooting thread: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=43376

03Lightningrocks wrote:He is lucky those cops were not better shots. I can't believe he didn't get killed by them! The world has definitely gone mad! From the story he looked to be getting ready to wage war on the place. I am afraid I would have blasted him before he could get those weapons in action. Pointing the gun at me and pulling the trigger would just make me think it misfired and I better respond quickly or die with a follow up round. BB gun would not have entered my mind. Just curious, how many of you would have fired at that guy if you were the person at the window and carrying concealed?

From your previous post in this thread I'm having a hard time understanding whether you agree with me and yourself from the other thread, or not.

I'm not trying to be confrontational, and if you'll notice I gave examples of LEOs mistaking all manner of things to be guns with fatal results. You'd think they would be even better trained to handle such situations than CHLers.

All I was saying is that I can definitely see why someone would be more weary of running around with what appears to be a gun in a state where 2% of the regular citizens carry. It's not an argument against CHL, IMHO, it's an argument against stupid behavior.

I think the OP didn't go too overboard, but based on the kid coming to apologize I believe that the OP could have gotten the same results with a friendly, "Hey guys, we're trying to eat here, could you please move the war somewhere safer?" A decent kid would apologize, and not need to be threatened about calling the cops. A punk would have seen the threat as a chance to escalate the situation (until you actually made good on your threat).

I'm just a big fan of appealing to a person's common decency first, before getting mad at them and making threats. To each his own.

As for airsoft / bb guns potentially getting kids shot... well, this happened in the Southlake / DFW area:

Linked due to some foul language:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fC6fsEyXlJ8

There have also been countless news reports of people being shot for having anything from a water nozzle to a cell phone or a wallet. Many of these times it's responding LEOs, who you'd expect to have some training in handling such situations. I can definitely see why someone would be more weary of running around with what appears to be a gun in a state where 2% of the regular citizens carry.