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Valk wrote:Where are all of the "come take it" people. Where are all the folks who can recite all the constitutional amendments? Did I miss it or has someone said you have the right to protect your property.

Your property was not under siege. If it is, those people will stand up and defend you.

The URL you wouldn't click on showed that you are only allowed to use deadly force to protect property at night with very narrow guidelines, including a reasonable expectation that the property cannot be recovered.

Texas Penal Code - Section 9.42. Deadly Force To Protect Property

Legal Research Home > Texas Laws > Penal Code > Texas Penal Code - Section 9.42. Deadly Force To Protect Property

§ 9.42. DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY. A person is justified in using deadly force against another to protect land or tangible, movable property: (1) if he would be justified in using force against the other under Section 9.41; and (2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force is immediately necessary: (A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or criminal mischief during the nighttime; or (B) to prevent the other who is fleeing immediately after committing burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, or theft during the nighttime from escaping with the property; and (3) he reasonably believes that: (A) the land or property cannot be protected or recovered by any other means; or (B) the use of force other than deadly force to protect or recover the land or property would expose the actor or another to a substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury. Acts 1973, 63rd Leg., p. 883, ch. 399, § 1, eff. Jan. 1, 1974. Amended by Acts 1993, 73rd Leg., ch. 900, § 1.01, eff. Sept. 1, 1994.

I know you've repeatedly said you weren't prepared to use deadly force unless you were backed into it, but in this case, it seemed like you were willing to be a participant in the escalation that could have lead to that need, which could remove your legal standing.

From the sounds of it, they weren't even breaching a fence line. . . but essentially preparing to cut a corner. Even if you don't allow it (which you don't have to), it's a matter for discussion and possibly law enforcement.

If you take every reasonable deescalation tactic possible (talk calmly and politely but firm, call the police if they insist on cutting your corner, etc.) and one of those guys drew a weapon on you, you could potentially have justification to act. That's an extremely unlikely outcome from the picture you painted.

I'm also not saying you were in the wrong to deny them access to your yard. Many here would've been willing to cooperate, but there's no obligation. Most likely the worst case would have been that they damage your property, refuse to pay, and you sue them in small claims court. A camera and a phone would be your best and most effective "weapons" in the scenario you described.

Please don't get defensive. You didn't get the reaction you anticipated, so maybe this was a place you had a blind spot. Embrace the feedback and move on. . . it ended up working out for you, so all we can do is break it down, analyze it, and learn any valuable lessons for the future.

Thanks for the interesting discussion; I found it worthwhile.

Here in suburbia, I have to stand a few feet in my neighbor's yard to finish mowing one of my side yards. He's never complained. . . I guess he likes that I keep my yard nice.

If I had acreage and caught people blazing a trail / shortcut through my property that they planned to use to regularly access their property, we'd have a discussion about that. In fact, you could potentially lose your property if they use it as a right of way for too long and you never challenge it.

I know all of my neighbors and I expect I'd actually help them shortcut through my yard if he needed assistance getting some project done. I have no doubt that either neighbor would look after any damage caused on my property and give me some dirt, replacement squares of St. Augustine, or help me wield a shovel to repair it.

Sounds like a neighborly cookout is in order.

I agree with others - unless you're personally being threatened (or your loved ones), operate as if you have no firearm.