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mr.72 wrote:This is a scary situation and one of those with no good answer. Even if I was having lunch with my pals on the way back from a day at the firing range, knowing good and well that I had a table full of armed and practiced CHL holders with the nerve to do something besides hide and whimper, I still think this is very dicey at best.

The table full of GG-CHLs in glock caps, even if one-for-one even numbers with the BGs, are still at a major disadvantage because we all have to draw and we also have to be concerned about hitting innocents in the cross fire. Considering panicked restaurant patrons are going to be unpredictable in their movement and reaction when the loud noises start, this is a very, very iffy situation and pretty much guarantees someone besides the BGs are going to be shot. Once the popping starts, the BGs are all going to turn towards the source of the noise and return fire. Someone's going to get hit.

So the question is, do me and my pistol-packin-pals draw and fire on the BGs and almost guarantee that someone besides the BGs gets shot (hopefully not by us), maybe even one or more of us gets shot, or do we sit on our hands and play the odds that the BGs are not really planning on shooting anyone and maybe everyone leaves with their wallets and phones gone but otherwise uninjured besides their pride?

drjoker wrote:My wife makes fun of me for doing so, but I always try to sit with my back to the wall and next to an exit. Every time I enter a room, I take stock of everyone there and try my best to "make" or identify other fellow CHL carriers (who might come to my aid). I also make a mental note of any possible perps (young guys with hoodies on a TX summer day).

In this situation, I would not try to guess whether they're "peaceful" robbers or if they'll kill someone. My wife would make a beeline for the door (she's good at that) and I'll run behind the metal door post and start shooting from that cover. Most of the young "homies" have never been to the range to practice. They are poor shots. A few are crack shots just back from Iraq (our government has been desperate for recruits, so they have been "overlooking" some criminal records). I would shoot the most confident one (best shot) or leader first. I'll save the ones who are sitting next to other CHL carriers to be shot last (they might come to my aid, but as I've read on this forum, probably not). Once one of them go down, the others will flee. Thugs are lazy. If they weren't lazy, they'd be gainfully employed, right? Shooting it out for a cash register till is hard work. Trust me, they'll flee. Faced with combat stress, people will either freeze, fight, or flee. The fighter is probably the leader, that's why he gets shot first. The ones who freeze with a gun in their hand will be shot next. Thugs who flee will be spared. So, although it seems like you're fighting enormous odds, with the proper tactical mindset, you're only fighting ONE perp. In a group of 6 perps, only the leader will probably fight, but the others will either flee or freeze. If your family is safely out the door and you have cover behind a metal door post, then you could effectively defeat a group of 6 perps.

Some poster mentioned that he was afraid that he'll accidentally hit another diner. In such a situation, most diners will be underneath their tables. Firing head shots at the only people standing upright, the perps, will place the shots far enough away from the diners so that even if you miss, you won't hit a diner.

I am a big chicken and I am not a brave man, HOWEVER sometimes a MAN has to do what a MAN has to do. A real man would defend the innocent against thugs. Plus, if they're in the open waving guns around and you have cover, YOU have the tactical advantage even though you are seemingly outnumbered (seemingly outnumbered because only the leader is the fighter in most thug gangs, so you're only fighting one person).

I once knew an elderly Chinese man who held back THOUSANDS of armed Japanese with just a musket (not even a gun!). The Japanese have a rule that they cannot allow enemy soldiers to be left alive behind their lines, so this Chinese gentleman and his buddy were going to fire a shot from old muskets then hide. While the Japanese were looking for them, their families will evacuate their village and hide in the mountains. His buddy chickened out but he fired a shot and hid. It took the Japanese hours to find his buddy and kill him (ironic, huh?). Thinking they found their shooter, they stopped looking for the shooter and left the Chinese man in hiding. Meanwhile in the hours that they took to find and kill his buddy, his village was able to run and hide in the mountains. He saved his entire family and all his neighbors. If my elderly Chinese friend can fight off thousands of armed Japanese with an antique musket, YOU might be surprised to find yourself able to fend off 6 measly "homies" !



P.S. Other villages did not do so good. The Japanese used babies instead of clay pigeons for target practice in neighboring towns. In the other thread about an armed restaurant holdup in Arizona, the thugs killed a restaurant employee for sport. Do YOU want to bet that they'll only take "stuff" and not shoot you or your family for sport? I'd rather bet that if I shoot the leader, the rest will either freeze or flee. Putting yourself at the mercy of thugs never ends well.

Keith wrote:

...I will not sit at any restuarant without facing the door. My wife thinks im nuts...