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Carry-a-Kimber wrote:Very nice set-up. I really like the Spikes billet receivers and almost went with those but couldn't get over the price; went with a Wilson Combat billet set instead.

Yes, they are a little pricey....especially the lower. But, the lower comes with all those ambidextrous parts and the anti-walk pins - a fair amount in small parts. I'll have to check out the Wilson Combat receivers. I have a DMR rifle that is built on SWAT Firearms billet receiver halves (a Texas company, by the way). They are nicer than most forged receivers, but they don't lock up as tight as the Spikes receivers do.

bulletslap wrote:Personally I would memorize the come ups to any reasonable range and run the elevation knob.

I have a 1x4 SS and it is a good piece of glass, except the hash marks are too small and busy for me to use.

I thought about the SS HD...... I have the 5-20X on my Remington 700 and like it a lot........but I find the reticle on the 1-4x and 1-6x to be too busy too.

jason812 wrote: Sounds like I need to play with some low power variable scopes in person before I spend some more money.

Jason, I've been taking a hard look at both the Lucid 4 power P7 Combat Optic (a sort of very solidly built "poor-man's ACOG"), and the Lucid L7 1-6x24mm riflescope. MSRP on the L7 is $449, but I'm seeing it on Amazon for $389. The P7 MSRP is $439, but I've seen it on Amazon for $350. The problem is trying to find a local stocking distributor. I'd like a chance to handle the optic and look through one before springing the money for it.

http://www.mylucidgear.com/p74x.php
http://www.mylucidgear.com/L7riflescope.php

Both optics use the exact same illuminated reticle, which is AA battery (good for 2,500 hours) powered on the P7 and 2032 battery powered on the L7. The only difference as far as I can tell is that the P7 illuminates red, and the L7 illuminates blue. The reticle and turrets are both MOA, with 1/2 MOA clicks at 100 yards, and instead of calibrating the reticle to a particular caliber, the bullet drop compensator is measured in MOA. You have to then do your own load calculation, with an app or something, to know how much range each MOA value equals to for that particular load. For example, the image below is for a 125 grain .300 Blackout Nosler Ballistic Tip with a MV of 2,275 fps The horizontal stadia in the BDC ladder each represents an 8 MOA drop (the numbers on the right aren't actually part of the reticle):


Because the L7 is a second focal plane scope, and because the stadia are tied to the MOA value, changing the magnification level on the L7 variable power scope changes the number of MOA between stadia. The image below is for the same load as the P7 reticle above:


In any case, if you know your load, your range, and your reticle, you can be fairly assured of the holdovers for your rifle/cartridge combination - regardless of platform or caliber. I think load development is fun, so that's not a problem for me. I could be happy with this system IF I could be assured of the quality for the price. Reviewers of Lucid's products have been generally favorable, although both of these optics are new to the market so there isn't much in the way of reviews for them yet.

jason812 wrote:TAM that looks good and I don't think you will be disappointed with the Law Tactical folding stock adapter. You're going to almost make me want to pay the government to build a SBR that and to carry it past.... that's a different conversation.

From research, no first hand experience, you won't really notice the difference between a variable scope with a 1x bottom vs a 1.5x bottom. What you will notice is a difference between the Aim Point and a 1x variable scope. Has to do with the lenses and what not. I'm looking at Leupold's VX-R 1.5x4 to put on my M4 clone seeing how I robbed the Aim Point Pro off if it for the pistol I just built. But the Leupold with the Blackout reticle is 3 times more than the scope I was looking at. I thought of the Nikon as soon as I read your post and it should be a good scope based off their other models I have used.

I would really like to play with an Aim Point and an external magnifier on a flip over mount to see how that setup works. One magnifier could be used on several firearms if you wanted to take one hunting.

I've used a 4x Trijicon on my dad's M4 clone to shoot a running hog around 75-100 yards or so. They are fast to get on target but for close range moving targets, I would have preferred little less magnification. I think a 3x or 2x would have been about perfect.

I have a 1.5-5x Leupold Scout scope on my Gunsite Scout, and it's OK as far as it goes for a scout scope, but I also have a 1-6.5x Bushnell Elite Tactical SMRS on my DMR, and I do prefer having a true 1x to having 1.5x. I'd even be happy with another one of those Bushnells if they made one for .300 blackout. But even those are $1,000+.

I already have a 4x32 ACOG (TA31F) for the carbine upper that matches this lower (same upper that is in the top picture in the OP), and I really like them. One of the optics I've looked at is the Trijicon 3x30 ACOG (TA33) with a reticle regulated to .300 BLK for both supers and subs.......but even SWFA/OpticsPlanet.com pricing is $1,196.00.

I'm not against $1,000+ scopes, but I just can't afford that right now.

maverick2076 wrote:Primary Arms has their 1-6 scope with an ACSS reticle for .300 BLK, and I believe it is under $300

Thanks for the tip. I'll check it out.

SigM4 wrote:

The Annoyed Man wrote:The problem is that I know of no low-variable-power scope with a BDC reticle calibrated to the .300 BLK cartridge, so I'm going to have to get one with a MRAD or MOA type reticle.

Edited to add: Ok, I now know of such scopes, and YOWZA!!! That hurts, if you want a decent one.

Now, how to convince SWSBO.......

I've contemplated this Nikon M-300 for my SBR'd 300 upper, but as you said, they're pricey. That said the combination of my upper, suppressor, and one of these scopes would be a fun hog gun.

$699.95 isn't actually too bad. The items I was looking at were in the $1000-$1800 range........ more than I wanted to spend. The thing is, I don't know if I want an optic that starts at 1.5x. I think I'd either prefer a true 1x at the low end, or get something like the Trijicon 3x for 300 blk.

Pawpaw wrote:

The Annoyed Man wrote:Now, how to convince SWSBO.......

How did she get downgraded from "She Who MUST Be Obeyed" to "She Who SHOULD Be Obeyed"?

Easy...... I know the difference between "must" and "should".

mrvmax wrote:Not sure if you hand load, if you do try some Hornady 220 grain for subsonic. They function well and are fairly accurate suppressed.

I do handload, and am about to trade AndyC a spare shooting mat for a set of .300 BLK dies. In the above video, the first 5 shots were supersonic 125 grain Hornady SSTs. The second 5 shots were 220 grain Hornady A-MAXs. Both loads were purchased from Stand 1 Armory in Dallas. As far as accuracy goes, it was so-so for both cartridges, but mainly because I was shooting at unmagnified Aimpoint Micro at 50 yards, and I have crappy eyesight. I'm sure it would be better if I either added a magnifier or mounted a variable power optic appropriate to the cartridge.

Speaking of optics, I absolutely love the Aimpoint for close-in stuff, but I'm going to have to pick up a magnified optic if I want to use this SBR for hunting, 'cause it's not fair to the game otherwise. The problem is that I know of no low-variable-power scope with a BDC reticle calibrated to the .300 BLK cartridge, so I'm going to have to get one with a MRAD or MOA type reticle.

Edited to add: Ok, I now know of such scopes, and YOWZA!!! That hurts, if you want a decent one.

Now, how to convince SWSBO.......

My son and I built my SBR this afternoon and took it to Elm Fork for testing, along with another rifle and a new suppressor. The new suppressor to be covered in a separate thread.

Here are the ingredients:

• — Spikes Tactical Gen II Upper and Lower Receivers
  — Spikes Tactical Carbine Buffer and Spring
  — MFT Minimalist Stock
  — Smith Enterprises Chrome National Match Bolt Carrier
  — Leitner-Wise Mfg NiB Bolt
  — Timney 3 lb Competition Trigger
  — Rainier Arms Select 300AAC 10.5" Black Nitrided Stainless Steel Barrel
  — Bravo Company 9" KMR Alpha Rail
  — Aimpoint Micro T2 Red Dot
  — AAC Flashhider
  — AAC 762-SDN-6 Suppressor

Weight:

• 6 lb 3 oz unsuppressed
  7 lb 8 oz suppressed

It actually feels considerably lighter than it is because it is so nice and compact. I LOVE this configuration! You can very easily straight arm it like a pistol, even with the suppressor mounted.

This SBR uses the lower receiver and stock from this carbine:


This is the 10.5" SBR barrel:


Here is the barrel mounted in the upper receiver:


The 9" BCM KMR rail has been mounted:


The fully assembled upper, with AAC flashhider:


My son holding the completed SBR:


So, we ran it over to Elm Fork. This video is of 10 rounds fired, all 10 are suppressed. The first 5 rounds are Stand 1 Armory 125 Grain SST supersonics; and the second 5 rounds are Stand 1 Armory 208 Grain A-MAX subsonics. The 125s are quieter than supersonic 5.56 through the carbine barrel.....probably because they're only going about 1700 fps and it's a smaller powder charge than a 5.56 load. But the 208s are amazingly quiet. You'll hear a guy coughing in the background at one point, and his cough is louder than the subsonics:



The cost of .300 Blackout ammo aside, this SBR is my favorite AR ever. It's going to get one more mod down the road, which will benefit the carbine upper too, and that is one of those Law Tactical Folding AR-15 Stock Adapters. Right now, the SBR with the suppressor attached is actually a little shorter than the carbine upper, by maybe an 3/4" or so. With a folded stock and the suppressor removed, it will fit in a pretty small carrying device.

You can have your Sub-2000. I'll take this SBR.