TexasCHLforum.com

Texas10X wrote:Interesting related article: http://www.chuckhawks.com/ammo_by_anonymous.htm

Don't show AndyC this part:

Hollowpoint ammunition is NOT more lethal than ball (full metal jacket) ammunition. You may have seen media hype about "killer dum-dum bullets" but this is nonsense. Hollowpoint bullets usually expand and stop in the human body, and thus the attacker absorbs much more of the bullet's kinetic energy than if the bullet had merely zipped through him and left two small holes. Hollowpoint ammunition is also safer for all parties concerned.

Sorry, I couldn't help myself. Now Andy, don't say anything mean to Texas10X.

v-rog wrote:My CHL instructor emphasized that we should use the amount of ammo it takes to STOP the aggressor given the 10-second rule (the amount of air a person has even when shot).

I don't think of it in terms of how much ammo. I think of it in terms of pulling the trigger until the threat stops. That might mean a single shot. It might mean a magazine swap. Knowing my own skill level, I think that a COM hit is realistic. I'm not certain I could count on much better than that. For me, COM means the chest, not the entire torso. I think that most GSW recipients, unless they were just completely cranking on something, would be stopped by 3 or 4 to the chest. Most would. Certainly not all. The reason that caliber is important, and also good bullet design, is not because a .45 is a better death ray than a 9mm, but because it will likely expand to a larger diameter than the 9mm, making a bigger hole. A bigger hole means a better chance of taking out something vital that a smaller hole might miss. That's all it means. Although I am no fan of the .380 ACP cartridge, one of those through a brain will end the fight faster than a .45 through the chest. But, I'm not going to count on making a shot to the head under that kind of pressure. That's called being a realist.

That said, even though I prefer the .45 ACP cartridge above all others, my EDC lately has been a Kahr PM9. So, to compensate, I've tried to load it with bullets that have a reputation for significant expansion with decent penetration for a 9mm. For now, that turns out to be the Corbon DPX.

I think that the psychology of getting hit is a HUGE factor. There are plenty of stories of people who were hit hard, perhaps even hit fatally if absent medical intervention, who continued to fight and to fight well until they are either relieved or expire. That is the danger when the shoot involves someone who is amped up on some kind of drug and is existing in a mind-altered state. They might not even know they've been shot; or they might be even further enraged by being shot. Police and military experience abounds with stories of people who absorb multiple bullet hits—even from rifles—and they keep coming. THAT is why shot placement is so important. If your shot doesn't puncture an aorta or the brain or spinal cord, or some other organ which is likely to cause immediate incapacitation, you may require multiple hits before you incapacitate your foe. Also, hits to some areas may produce gradual incapacitation. For instance, hits to the lung fields might not immediately disable someone, but a sucking chest wound will ultimately be fatal, even if the blood loss isn't too severe and no other organ has been hit.

However, the psychological factor is not to be ignored. If the GSW recipient is even moderately sentient, they may likely incapacitate themselves over the idea of having been shot. It's the insentient ones you really have to worry about.