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From what I see on the particular LE show...it is Nazi Germany.

Certainly the driver must produce, DL, proof of insurance, reg. etc., but barring any obvious criminal activity demanding the passenger produce I.D. is exactly the kind of thing done in Nazi Germany pre-war.

Many time on this show I've seen LEO, after being told 'consent to search' is NOT granted, the officer states no problem, but due to your lack of cooperation, they'll call a tow truck, impound your vehicle and it WILL be searched. In essence, you are now out your vehicle, the search will happen, except it's now really going to cost you. So, Mr.Citizen, are you certain you want to refuse consent?

Now, to be fair, often the search is granted, criminality is discovered, and you get to go to jail and the passenger is often let go. But, at times, no criminality is discovered, though your car has been completely disorganized and you inconvenienced by time and embarrassment.

O.K.

Back to the passenger in an example of say: A driver speeding. The driver's going to get the ticket and there's no element of criminality.

Why should the passenger have to produce I.D.?

He/she's done nothing wrong? Is a bit of fishing going on?

Yes, I hear those of you understanding that cops can 'ask' for I.D.and you the passenger don't have to comply, and all will remain well...maybe...but much like refusing to a search consent (when it's really just a fishing expedition) I remain skeptical of this practice.

If you've done nothing more than speed and your passenger and yourself show zero signs of impairment or dope smoke smell, just issue the ticket and we'll all be on our merry way.

Quit asking for I.D. when not warranted.

Some LEO's have the idea that even if there's no evidence of criminality, hey you COULD be guilty of something.

Won't give consent for a search, fine, I'll have your vehicle towed.

I watch a lot of "PD Live" and almost every time there's a passenger in a stopped vehicle they are asked for I.D.s

This practice irks me.

If they're not driving, why are they obligated to produce I.D. when (assuming nothing criminal is going on or obvious like the smell of mari-j being smoked or needles on the floor in plain view)

As one who thinks we don't yet live in a police state and I'm walking down the street, doing no harm, L.E. doesn't have right to arbitrarily stop me and insist I produce I.D., so why do vehicle passengers have to?

Or, can the passenger simply refuse to produce I.D. without being punished in some manner?

I did hear one LEO say/ask 'well, without your I.D., how can we tell if there's a warrant out there on you?

Hhmmm, as far as I know, he can't. (so sorry old darling, but you don't check out every person you come into contact with when they've done nothing illegal in your presence) LEO's don't have a right to check all they comes into contact with because they "might" be a criminal with a warrant out for them. "Might be" isn't justification...

Or, if they do have a right to demand passenger I.D., why not set up roadblocks everywhere so we find potential criminals who'll be checked for this, that or the other?

Or, am I being obstreperous for complaining about a practice I see no justification for?

Your thoughts?

Thanks!

P.S. Perhaps, I come across with this thread as anti-LE. I'm not. Actually, I'm very supportive of LE, but some practices need to be re-assessed.