TexasCHLforum.com

goose wrote:Letting the bad guy get away in no way implies that the only other option is to "stand by and do nothing."

Well said Goose.

speedsix wrote:...Texas theft laws are more detailed and complicated than La. laws, which are the ones I'm familiar with...

Yes they are. I hope than an LEO or lawyer can straighten this out.

I guess that Giga answered that one. I am a bit surprised that it's the same crime, felony, to steal something off a dead person.

speedsix wrote:...true...but I'm asking if the theft has to be from the person's person to be a state jail felony, or does theft from their desk, shopping cart, yard, or car count...none of which own the property ...I can't find a definition of "theft from a person"...so far...

This is what I have found

Sec. 31.03. THEFT. (a) A person commits an offense if he unlawfully appropriates property with intent to deprive the owner of property.
(4) a state jail felony if:
(A) [amended 9/1/95] the value of the property stolen is $1,500 or more but less than $20,000, or the property is less than 10 head of cattle, horses, or exotic livestock or exotic fowl as defined by Section 142.001, Agriculture Code, or any part thereof under the value of $20,000, or less than 100 head of sheep, swine, or goats or any part thereof under the value of $20,000;
(B) regardless of value, the property is stolen from the person of another or from a human corpse or grave;(C) the property stolen is a firearm, as defined by Section 46.01; or
(D) the value of the property stolen is less than $1,500 and the defendant has been previously convicted two or more times of any grade of theft;

There's got to be case law on this, but I haven't found it yet.

speedsix wrote:...the purse was grabbed out of a shopping cart while she was loading groceries into the car...I can see it being theft from person if she was pushing the cart...

I don't want to be a wise guy, but a person owned the purse, not the shopping cart.

HotLeadSolutions wrote:Well the "legal expert" I am speaking with came from Baylor Law School and the other sits on a Federal Bench....So...IANAL..But THEY are..

So do I win or lose?

austinrealtor wrote:

speedsix wrote:

WildBill wrote:

speedsix wrote:...that's great...but why do you feel that you need to announce to those of us involved a lively discussion that this thread is "out of hand" in your opinion? if you're tired of it ...why not just move on? I just met you on another thread that had 11 pages and had many tangents also...no complaint when you posted there...THAT'S my point...live and let live...

At the time I posted, that was my opinion. Sometimes threads stagnant and do not move forward with new thoughts. If you have new thoughts or do not agree, please feel free to post additional comments.

...we have reached an impasse, I believe...maybe Charles who IS a lawyer, will find the time to settle it...I think we really need to know what's right...ain't no mosquitoes in this thread...it's been real lively...

part of the problem, IMHO, here is that we're all citing things and discussing these things as absolutes, which none of them are. It all depends on circumstances of a particular case. As Keith B said a page or two back, the threat of deadly force CAN BE the use of deadly force - all depends on circumstances. I'm not saying that a threat is ALWAYS just a threat no more than I'm saying a threat can NEVER be just a threat. It's a very grey area that will be decided by prosecutors, judges, juries etc. .... which is why I counsel to avoid pulling your gun in such as situation - it's not a clear cut, black-n-white justifiable use of your weapon.

Again, I think that it boils down to "what would you do" as a tactical decision, not just what is legal.

speedsix wrote:...that's great...but why do you feel that you need to announce to those of us involved a lively discussion that this thread is "out of hand" in your opinion? if you're tired of it ...why not just move on? I just met you on another thread that had 11 pages and had many tangents also...no complaint when you posted there...THAT'S my point...live and let live...

At the time I posted, that was my opinion. Sometimes threads stagnant and do not move forward with new thoughts. If you have new thoughts or do not agree, please feel free to post additional comments.

speedsix wrote:"...What would you have done if you would have been able to do something about it?..." was the original question...prudent and not is a matter of opinion...it quickly turned into several subdivisions of why would you, should you, why shouldn't you, etc...all pertinent to giving the OP our opinions and reasons for and against...and what is legal to do is a very informative part of that...our arguments are to get at what's really right to do and not...not at all out of hand, nor even off topic...

I already answered that question.

WildBill wrote:

Mr.ViperBoa wrote:What would you have done if you would have been able to do something about it? Just curious.

Call 911 and give a description of the persons and vehicles and watch from a safe place. Under the circumstances that you described, I wouldn't intervene.

This thread is getting out of hand. IMO, the original question is what is prudent, not what is legal.

Pawpaw wrote:

Barbi Q wrote:

HotLeadSolutions wrote:2. Having criminal charges filed against you for excessive use of force. Again...Really? Justified use of force is spelled out pretty clearly in TX

You're right but Mr.ViperBoa didn't say what time of day the theft happened.

I don't think that would matter. I believe purse snatching is robbery. There is no "nighttime" restriction on robbery.

I believe that you are correct.

Sec. 9.31. SELF-DEFENSE. (a) Except as provided in Subsection (b), a person is justified in using force against another when and to the degree the actor reasonably believes the force is immediately necessary to protect the actor against the other's use or attempted use of unlawful force. The actor's belief that the force was immediately necessary as described by this subsection is presumed to be reasonable if the actor:(1) knew or had reason to believe that the person against whom the force was used:
(C) was committing or attempting to commit aggravated kidnapping, murder, sexual assault, aggravated sexual assault, robbery, or aggravated robbery;

Mr.ViperBoa wrote:Your both probably right, I just get sick and tired of hearing about and seeing the bad guy get away. Maybe if a few didnt get away so easily, less would try the same. I dont know......It just irritates me i guess.

It irritates me too, but the chances of someone getting injured or killed by intervening aren't worth the risk.

Mr.ViperBoa wrote:What would you have done if you would have been able to do something about it? Just curious.

Call 911 and give a description of the persons and vehicles and watch from a safe place. Under the circumstances that you described, I wouldn't intervene.