TexasCHLforum.com

starrbuck,

I honestly had no intention of offending you. If I did, I offer my apologies.

starrbuck wrote:

frankie_the_yankee wrote:One drink does not impair or inhebriate an adult person with a normal response to alcohol.

It might. It might not. It's different for every person. That's precisely why the law is written why it is written without a specific amount about what being impaired is.

That's why I included in my statement "an adult person with a normal response to alcohol". Some people will have a different (abnormal) response. These people should regulate their drinking behavior accordingly.

starrbuck wrote: So we are not allowed to interject personal opinion into our posts? Who appointed you the topic police anyway? Isn't this sort of thing best left up to the moderators? Why can't you just let me say, yes, I agree that the law is "x" but I choose to do "y"?

You can post whatever you want IMO. FWIW, I am much more liberal on that score than most of the mods here are. Your opinions are perfectly welcome as far as I am concerned.

But please note that it was you who asked me to not make further statements to the effect that having a drink while carrying was lawful. It's true that you are free to request that, but I am also free to ignore it.

I just pointed out that unlike my posts, yours was off topic, because is was. The OP asked what was allowed under the law. I provided that information along with a supporting quote from the DPS website. Your post strayed from this subject to inform us as to your personal practices and opinions on drinking while carrying.

range_rider13 wrote: When I took my CHL class back in April, the instructor made it very clear to the class that you could not drink and carry, period. Not even one sip. I remember a question on the test concerning this topic.

After reading this thread, it now appears to me that you can drink and carry as long as you are not intoxicated. Was my instructor wrong in teaching us, no alcohol, period?

Your instructor was wrong. I too took my renewal class in April and my instructor told the class the same (incorrect) thing. The right answer is as posted on the DPS website.

range_rider13 wrote: I never drink and carry, whether it's one beer or one sip. If it is legal to drink and carry as long as you are not intoxicated, I would think that you are asking for way more trouble than it would be worth whether you are stopped and checked by a LEO and/or involved in a self-defense incident.

Your answers and opinions would be appreciated.

Whether to drink while carrying or not is your choice so long as you do not get intoxicated.

The important thing is to always exercise good judgement in whatever you do.

starrbuck wrote: Frankie, what you are apparently not understanding from me, and I'm sure it is my fault for not explaining it properly, is that I have made the choice to choose to carry my firearm over drinking. Carrying my firearm, ie. protecting myself and my family, is more important than getting inebriated.

Please understand that no one is talking about carrying while "getting inebriated. One drink does not impair or inhebriate an adult person with a normal response to alcohol.

starrbuck wrote: I do not know how else to explain it to you that I do not feel that I would be a fully accurate shooter if I had even one drink while I am carrying, so it is my personal decision to not drink while I carry. It is not because it's the law, it's because it's my choice. I really can't say it any more plainly. Please do not explain it to me again, or point out to me that the law doesn't require that I not drink while I carry. I already know that. You've beaten the dead horse plenty.

I agree that you have explained your position just fine. I fully understand it.

I merely point out that it is off topic. Go back to the original post. The poster wasn't soliciting opinions or testimonials on whether people drink while carrying or why. I do not believe he had the slightest interest in what your choice is, or mine. He was simply confused as what the law required, as to what the legal meaning of "intoxication" was, and sought clarification.

He even repeated his request in a subsequent post.

ktusc wrote: Honestly, I may have one beer every 2 or 3 months. I would just like to know what is legal.

From the DPS website FAQ:

Q: Can I carry a handgun if I am drinking alcohol?

A: “Carrying� while drinking is not prohibited, but it is a criminal
offense to carry while intoxicated.

boomerang writes:

But a peace officer can say someone is intoxicated based on behavior, and a BAC of 0.03 wouldn't prove they're not intoxicated for the purposes of PC §46.03. So there is ambiguity as to what non-zero BAC is or isn't intoxicated.....

A peace officer can say you were intoxicated no matter what your BAC is. i.e. a peace officer can lie. But since most peace officers are honest, this is very rare.

And an honest peace officer must be able to articulate certain elements of your behavior that he observed that satisfy the legal standard of intoxication.

Also, someone could be intoxicated on something other than alcohol. So they could blow a 0.0% BAC and still be intoxicated. And the peace officer could truthfully note this and correctly arrest the person for carrying while intoxicated.

If a peace officer claims you are intoxicated based on your behavior, no BAC test is likely to be administered. So it doesn't matter if you are 0.0% BAC. No one will ever know.

Bottom line: Per DPS, drinking while carrying is legal. Carrying while intoxicated is not.

boomerang wrote:The problem is that there's no legal blood alcohol content for "intoxicated" in PC §46.035, like there is for driving. If my BAC is non-zero, I don't want to carry in public and risk becoming a test case.

True. But there are established criteria in case law that must be met to establish intoxication.

Do what you like, but understand that "zero tolerance" is not a requirement of the law. (Note also that the original question in this thread concerned what was required under the law, not what this or that person would elect to do.)

If zero tolerance was a requirement of the law, it would have been a simple matter to have written the law that way. But that's not what the legislators did.

starrbuck wrote: The same risks that I take if I drink and drive, if I drink and trust a designated driver to drive instead of myself, or if I drink and think I can shoot straight when I'm impaired by alcohol.

Most people are not impaired by having one drink. Certainly not in any legal sense of the word. If you get impaired after one drink, then I agree that you shouldn't drink at all while carrying.

starrbuck wrote: Also, if stopped on the highway, or, God forbid, if I get involved in a shooting, explaining to a LEO that I'm carrying but I've only had one drink is a conversation I'd just rather not have.

I can see your concern. You are obviously prepared to pay a high price for it, such as you or a family member getting successfully assaulted by a criminal so you won't ever need to have "that conversation".

That's too high a price for me.

starrbuck wrote: If you have to have that drink or two so bad, that's you. It's not me.

What makes you assume that I "have" to do anything? Frankly, I would say that that's "not me" either. I don't drink because I "have" to.

To be honest, I find the notion degrading, though I'm sure that's not what you meant.

starrbuck wrote: Of course it's a trade off. I said I don't carry when I drink. I didn't say with what frequency I do either. Don't assume. Did you stop to think I may be carrying more and drinking less now that I have a CHL?

It's a choice, not the law.

Correct. (Emphasis added.)

starrbuck wrote:

Molon_labe wrote:There is NO .08 limit on being intoxicated...if you are packing...DON'T touch the booze! PERIOD

I'm afraid I'm a member of this camp as well. If I am drinking, I disarm. Don't take any chances. It's not worth it.

Feel free to do that if you wish. Just understand that it is not required by law.

But I'm curious. What exactly is the "chance" you feel you would be taking?

I say this because if you go unarmed you are also taking a chance - a chance that you will be assaulted by some criminal and will lack an effective means of self defense.

So it's a trade off.

ktusc wrote:Honestly, I may have one beer every 2 or 3 months. I would just like to know what is legal.

Thx for the opinions.

What's legal is that you can drink while carrying, but DO NOT get intoxicated.

One drink will not get a normal person intoxicated.

More than one can be problematic. It depends on the person. But if you limit yourself to one, you should be OK.