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K.Mooneyham

equin wrote:
TxLobo wrote:
gringo pistolero wrote:That's an interesting citation but practically speaking I think most people would say a KA-BAR is "not commonly known as a pocketknife" even on the rare occasion it is carried in a pocket.
The definitions come from case law.. In this case, Mireles and Hernandez..

here is case law on the definitions in Texas.. as usual, in different places.. and different times.

“Illegal Knife” means a:
(A) knife with a blade over five and one half inches;
Rainer v. State, 763 S.W.2d 615 (Tex. App.-Eastland 1989, pet. ref’d) To determine
length, measure entire length of blade past handle, not just the sharpened portion of the
blade. Same result in McMurrough v. State, 995 S.W.2d 944 (Tex. App.-Ft. Worth 1999).
(B) hand instrument designed to cut or stab another by being thrown;
Albert v. State, 659 S.W.2d 41 (Tex. App.-Houston [14th Dist.] 1983, pet. ref’d) Martial
arts throwing star qualifies as “a hand instrument designed to cut or stab another by being
thrown”.
(C) dagger including but not limited to a dirk, stiletto, and poniard;
Armendariz v. State, 396 S.W.2d 132 (Tex. Crim. App. 1965) A knife slightly over seven
inches in length when open, equipped with a double guard, blade that locks open and is
sharpened on both sides of blade for over an inch meets the definition of a dagger.
(D) bowie knife;
Mireles v. State, 192 S.W. 241 (Tex. Crim. App. 1917) A knife in a scabbard with a blade
nine inches long and a handle four or five inches long described as a butcher knife was
embraced in the term “bowie knife” as defined by the Penal Code.
_________________
This is interesting. However, I'm still confused as to what constitutes a bowie knife under today's Texas Penal Code. I don't have a copy of the Mireles case, but at least based on the very brief summary above, it appears the length and measurements of the butcher knife were factors the court took into consideration to find it meets the definition of a "bowie" knife. But under today's TX Penal Code, those measurements would classify it as an illegal knife anyway because it's longer than 5.5." I'm still wondering about a Ka-Bar knife, or any kind of fixed blade with a cross guard that is less than 5.5" and whether it meets the definition of a bowie knife. I'm no criminal lawyer or knife law expert, but I'm guessing the length of a "bowie" knife doesn't matter, even if the blade is less than 5.5", otherwise the "bowie knife" provision in the penal code would be moot and useless if part of what meets the requirements of a bowie knife includes a blade longer than 5.5," right?

Oh, and although I'm a lawyer, none of what I say should be taken as legal advice. Heck, some of you non-lawyers know more about gun and knife laws than I even knew existed!

My thoughts have run in the same direction as yours on this subject. I believe it to be kind of useless to put a phrase like "bowie knife" in the Penal Code, and then not define it. And if the legislature of the time was working off the idea that pretty much everyone would just know what makes a knife a "bowie knife", then I believe that is simply no longer the case. I know what I consider a Bowie knife, but my idea isn't likely to be the one in an arresting officer's head if it came to that.

K.Mooneyham

Jumping Frog wrote:Is it too soon to start thinking about the 2015 Legislative session?

My first priority would be passing Mr. Cotton's bill that allows CHL's to carry everywhere a police officer can carry.

My second priority would be converting a CHL (Concealed Handgun License) to a CWL (Carrying Weapons License). I'd like to be able to carry other alternatives including but not limited to a knife of my own choosing or a baton. If I can be trusted to carry a handgun, why should my knife blade matter?

I like both of those ideas. Additionally, I'd like to see the state get pre-emption on knife laws, the same as it has on firearms laws. That way, the local ordinances would be a moot point. As always, the important aspect should be on how the knife is used (that is, not used in a violent or threatening manner), not on what it looks like. The Marines in WWII used their K-Bars for utility knives as much as anything else. I've read that where Army troops came into contact with Marines in the Pacific, they'd often try to trade something for a K-Bar because they were just great useful knives.

K.Mooneyham

TxLobo wrote:I don't think that carrying a knife shaped like a "bowie" is illegal so much..

case law from Mireles v State 1917 gives the definition of a bowie knife:

[ Image ]

Not quite sure how you found that, but very nice. Its still my concern that such information would be great for a defense attorney to get the charges dropped after you had taken a ride "downtown". And as we have been told several times, never argue with the arresting officer, always do what they say. So this information wouldn't be of much help as the cuffs go on.

Please don't take this as being against you, I'm just frustrated by some of these laws and how our system works sometimes.

K.Mooneyham

TBJK wrote:I intend on carrying a Ka-Bar in a sheath in the middle of my back since my company will not allow firearms. Problem is its hard for me to decide which one is like. I like the Mark 1, short Ka-bar USMC or Short Ka-bar Black.

Good luck with that. My comment above is in reference to the line in Texas Penal Code that prohibits the carry of "bowie" knives, notice the little b there. That means that if it can be construed as being shaped like a Bowie knife, then it is prohibited to carry said knife, even if the other criteria are met. You might carry it your whole life and never have a problem...or you might be stopped for something and the LEO doesn't like you carrying that and you get a weapons charge against you. And you may beat the weapons charge, but its going to cost you.

Exerpt from TPC 46.01:

6) "Illegal knife" means a:

(A) knife with a blade over five and one-half inches;

(B) hand instrument designed to cut or stab another by being thrown;

(C) dagger, including but not limited to a dirk, stiletto, and poniard;

(D) bowie knife;

(E) sword; or

(F) spear.

K.Mooneyham

Jumping Frog wrote:
jbarn wrote:As long as the blade is not double edged or over 5 and 1/2 inches in length, there is no state law prohibiting it.
.... double edged , over 5 and 1/2 inches, or shaped like a bowie knife.

Thank you. I'm still ticked that my Baby K-Bar sits in my gun cabinet because of this senseless and useless technicality of the law.

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