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But where did this "developmentally disable" kid get THOUSANDS of dollars to blow on all his guns and ammo? One police photo showed at least half a dozen guns on his bed, along with ammo, smoke bombs, a gas mask, etc. and it's confirmed that he owned at least 10 guns. It smells like somebody really screwed up here besides just Cruz and the Sheriff's department.

troglodyte wrote: ↑Thu Jan 10, 2019 1:55 pm
Your whole comment generally comes across as defeatist. It is a tough problem that is going to require a multilayered approach. There are so many factors involved that each school, even down to each building, may require a different approach.

I didn't mean to sound defeatist, just to acknowledge the complexity of the problem, when it came down to getting past slogans like "arm the teachers!" and sitting down with the proverbial blank sheet of paper and developing something that is really effective. Your and the other reply are good, and make good points.

troglodyte wrote: ↑Wed Jan 09, 2019 11:26 pm

2:21:38 - first shot
2:24:35 - first outside officer arrives, Kratz. 24 had been shot. 11 fatally.
2:25:18 - last casualty. 34 total shot, 17 fatally.
Less than 4 minutes

Kratz could not have gotten to the shooter to stop any of the deaths or injury before it was over even if he had gone straight in and not stopped to,instead, direct traffic.

This, I think, is why I think the value of armed personnel is overestimated. Yes, I think we should have some armed personnel, but it by no means will solve the problem and make everybody safe. Think of the typical classroom building. You have a LONG hallway, with classroom doors going down both sides. You hear (ASSUMING you're in that building) a gun go off down at one end. Bang, bang, bang.... and every 2 seconds, it's another kid dying. What will you do? Run down the hall with your gun and locate and skillfully engage the shooter? Easier said than done; you don't even know what classroom he's in. Meanwhile, bang-bang-bang-bang.....

Even if the teacher in that room just happens to be armed, it's unlikely that he or she is actually WEARING the weapon. More likely, it's in a desk drawer, possibly locked. If a shooter holding a cocked AR bursts into the room, it's very possible that that teacher will be dead long before a gun can be brought into reach. I'm sorry, I just can't visualize a teacher standing in front of a room full of kids with a 1911 hanging from her belt.

Additionally, most modern urban high schools have MANY buildings, including temporary buildings set up to handle student overflow. I've seen big urban high schools with over a dozen temporary buildings, plus gyms, shops, libraries, admin buildings, vocational buildings, health centers, cafeterias, auditoriums, etc. as well as several regular hallway-type classroom buildings. How is an armed officer in Building 38, going to get to Building 3 in time to save lives? It's not going to happen.

Of course, you could have an armed officer walking every hallway on the campus, but that's not going to happen, either, for many reasons.

I thing one step that needs to be taken is limiting campus access in the first place. There needs to be an entrance point where only vehicles with a current valid sticker can enter. That would help some. Of course, a current student would still be able to enter the campus in his own vehicle, carrying a weapon. So to stop him, you'd need a metal detector at every entrance to every building.

All that being said, how would you implement a really thorough, effective security program for the school in the picture below?

We talk about arming teachers and school security, but when it comes to actually implementing something, the challenge is somewhat daunting.

Every school board in the country should be required to read this report. Every police department, too.

It's hard to swallow some of the things that jump off the screen at you:

- one of the first armed officers to arrive runs toward the building, then stops and directs traffic

- LEOs pull in, put on their bulletproof vests, then stand there hiding behind their cars

- a team, guided by video security cameras showing Cruz in the building, slowly moving closer, not realizing that Cruz was drinking a coke in a Subway across the street. Nobody had shared that the video had a 20-minute delay.

....it's a long list. If I were the parent of one of those victims, I would be preparing the Mother and Father of All Lawsuits.

This came out a couple of days ago. It's a minute-by-minute account of the Parkland school shooting. It's intensely absorbing; I wanted to grab my gun and shoot the computer. The screwups here are beyond description; I can't even give a representative example. Check it out.

http://projects.sun-sentinel.com/2018/s ... Iki0sNClVQ