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KBCraig wrote:No, I'm not. "Lawful" must be based in the law, and must be Constitutional. Just because it's department SOP doesn't make it Constitutional, nor does it mean it's based in the law.

If it was department-wide SOP to pull over and search every (fill in the blank) seen, it would be neither lawful nor constitutional.

Kevin

On the second part of your response, you are making a big stretch because that has been address in case law already with "PROBABLE CAUSE." So that would NEVER be a SOP for a LEO to search anytime and everywhere. Catching at straws, now.

Then on 1st issue, a LEO is sworn in and given the authority to uphold the law and carry out his duties which is given to him by law. So how is not lawful if it is state law that he can disarm as part of carrying out his duties.

KBCraig wrote:Officers who routinely disarm CHLs, or who disarm them in order to run serial numbers, are exceeding their authority.

The authority to disarm CHLs is narrowly defined in Government Code chapter 411:

§ 411.207. AUTHORITY OF PEACE OFFICER TO DISARM. A peace
officer who is acting in the lawful discharge of the officer's
official duties may disarm a license holder at any time the officer
reasonably believes it is necessary for the protection of the
license holder, officer, or another individual. The peace officer
shall return the handgun to the license holder before discharging
the license holder from the scene if the officer determines that the
license holder is not a threat to the officer, license holder, or
another individual and if the license holder has not violated any
provision of this subchapter or committed any other violation that
results in the arrest of the license holder.


There is no authority to disarm a CHL unless the officer reasonably believes it is necessary for the protection of the license holder, officer, or another individual.

My question is are you forgetting "A peace officer who is acting in the lawful discharge of the officer's official duties." Like has said before, if that is standard procedure for his dept, then wouldn't it be part of his official duty. I don't see how it could be excessive. Personally, I think greeting a LEO walking up to your car with the fact of you having a firearm, would raise alarms in most people brains. No, Hi!!!, Hello, What's up? No hug or nothing. That would cause the LEO to fall into the necessary for protection mode which is what he did. I know some do it to preempt the discovery, but just hand over the license and let them take the lead.
I got pulled over late last year (posted in Encounter section) with 1 headlight, cop u-turned and pulled over. I turned on dome light and just sat there. When he walked up, I rolled down window and he asked for license, etc. and I gave him both cards but didn't have insurance papers. He asked where gun was, I nodded right side and he said ok and went back to car. He came back, I still had no insurance and he gave me back my cards and said just get headlight fix and said goodnight. No warning, no ticket.