Shooting at Twin Peaks in Waco

[jmra]

I have just read this entire topic and have to put in my .02.

As you may can tell from my avitar, I ride a Harley, I am a patch wearing member of the Patriot Guard Riders, The Masonic Riding Club, and Fellowship Riders. Yes I have a vest for each orginazation and wear each proudly.

I have been to more than 1 of the TXCoC meetings representing one or more of these orginizations and to get insight on new and existing laws, safety campaigns, and upcoming rallies. Untill a few months ago, there was never an issue anywhere near this magnitude but there have been some minor altercations that were quickly put to rest by the membership that was there. However, this event has been brewing for about a year. Now I am not going to put blame on any club because I wasn't there by the grace of God. I do know that the Cossacks did not want to conform to the "rules" butin my opinion, there shouldn't be "territory" anyway.

With the above statement said, I am no outlaw, I know some of you here personally and don't think you consider me an outlaw. I don't ride with outlaw clubs UNLESS it is to benifit a charity I believe in such as Toys for Tots, Scottish Rite Hospital, Shriners Burn Center and etc. So to say that because I very well could have been to this event makes me an outlaw biker gang member because I associate with them on occassion is ludicrus.

Now, I have been on this forum for a long time and one of the best things that I like about the forum is that for the most part we all believe in the constitution, at least unbtil now. I am shocked tpo see the posts that agree with arresting everyone, if you associate with these clubs you must be an outlaw too, and none of these people should have a CHL because they are all criminals. This is no less profiling than a LEO stopping you because you have a bulge that may or may not be a legally carried gun, or because you drive a 1960's muscle car, or you live in a "bad part of town". IT'S PROFILING no matter how you twist the words.

Now, I don't know who all was arrested or what clubs they belonged to. But I can tell you there are usually no more than 20-25 people from each club present at a CoC meeting, if that many. So it tells me that most likely there were some arrested that were no more a part of this than I am.

Also, if this scenario were carried out at a gun show where they arrested all that came out, everyone here would be screaming.

Remember folks, "judge not lest you be judged". I also aske for prayers for the families of those affected by this horrible incident.

When is the last time 9 people were killed at a gun show? Of course we just as soon call it a gun show given the fact that over a thousand weapons were confiscated.

Before Sunday, when was the last time 9 people were killed at a CoC meeting?
Just as a gun show, could happen
I just prefer not to have my civil rights trampled on by profiling

Spin any way you want, if the cops are wrong on this one the departments will pay dearly in civil suits. Time will tell but I'm betting the cops come out on the right side of this one.

[Winchster]

I have just read this entire topic and have to put in my .02.

As you may can tell from my avitar, I ride a Harley, I am a patch wearing member of the Patriot Guard Riders, The Masonic Riding Club, and Fellowship Riders. Yes I have a vest for each orginazation and wear each proudly.

I have been to more than 1 of the TXCoC meetings representing one or more of these orginizations and to get insight on new and existing laws, safety campaigns, and upcoming rallies. Untill a few months ago, there was never an issue anywhere near this magnitude but there have been some minor altercations that were quickly put to rest by the membership that was there. However, this event has been brewing for about a year. Now I am not going to put blame on any club because I wasn't there by the grace of God. I do know that the Cossacks did not want to conform to the "rules" butin my opinion, there shouldn't be "territory" anyway.

With the above statement said, I am no outlaw, I know some of you here personally and don't think you consider me an outlaw. I don't ride with outlaw clubs UNLESS it is to benifit a charity I believe in such as Toys for Tots, Scottish Rite Hospital, Shriners Burn Center and etc. So to say that because I very well could have been to this event makes me an outlaw biker gang member because I associate with them on occassion is ludicrus.

Now, I have been on this forum for a long time and one of the best things that I like about the forum is that for the most part we all believe in the constitution, at least unbtil now. I am shocked tpo see the posts that agree with arresting everyone, if you associate with these clubs you must be an outlaw too, and none of these people should have a CHL because they are all criminals. This is no less profiling than a LEO stopping you because you have a bulge that may or may not be a legally carried gun, or because you drive a 1960's muscle car, or you live in a "bad part of town". IT'S PROFILING no matter how you twist the words.

Now, I don't know who all was arrested or what clubs they belonged to. But I can tell you there are usually no more than 20-25 people from each club present at a CoC meeting, if that many. So it tells me that most likely there were some arrested that were no more a part of this than I am.

Also, if this scenario were carried out at a gun show where they arrested all that came out, everyone here would be screaming.

Remember folks, "judge not lest you be judged". I also aske for prayers for the families of those affected by this horrible incident.

When is the last time 9 people were killed at a gun show? Of course we just as soon call it a gun show given the fact that over a thousand weapons were confiscated.

Would have been 2000 or more if they went to the kitchen. You realize they are calling a pocket knife a weapon?

[jmra]

I have just read this entire topic and have to put in my .02.

As you may can tell from my avitar, I ride a Harley, I am a patch wearing member of the Patriot Guard Riders, The Masonic Riding Club, and Fellowship Riders. Yes I have a vest for each orginazation and wear each proudly.

I have been to more than 1 of the TXCoC meetings representing one or more of these orginizations and to get insight on new and existing laws, safety campaigns, and upcoming rallies. Untill a few months ago, there was never an issue anywhere near this magnitude but there have been some minor altercations that were quickly put to rest by the membership that was there. However, this event has been brewing for about a year. Now I am not going to put blame on any club because I wasn't there by the grace of God. I do know that the Cossacks did not want to conform to the "rules" butin my opinion, there shouldn't be "territory" anyway.

With the above statement said, I am no outlaw, I know some of you here personally and don't think you consider me an outlaw. I don't ride with outlaw clubs UNLESS it is to benifit a charity I believe in such as Toys for Tots, Scottish Rite Hospital, Shriners Burn Center and etc. So to say that because I very well could have been to this event makes me an outlaw biker gang member because I associate with them on occassion is ludicrus.

Now, I have been on this forum for a long time and one of the best things that I like about the forum is that for the most part we all believe in the constitution, at least unbtil now. I am shocked tpo see the posts that agree with arresting everyone, if you associate with these clubs you must be an outlaw too, and none of these people should have a CHL because they are all criminals. This is no less profiling than a LEO stopping you because you have a bulge that may or may not be a legally carried gun, or because you drive a 1960's muscle car, or you live in a "bad part of town". IT'S PROFILING no matter how you twist the words.

Now, I don't know who all was arrested or what clubs they belonged to. But I can tell you there are usually no more than 20-25 people from each club present at a CoC meeting, if that many. So it tells me that most likely there were some arrested that were no more a part of this than I am.

Also, if this scenario were carried out at a gun show where they arrested all that came out, everyone here would be screaming.

Remember folks, "judge not lest you be judged". I also aske for prayers for the families of those affected by this horrible incident.

When is the last time 9 people were killed at a gun show? Of course we just as soon call it a gun show given the fact that over a thousand weapons were confiscated.

Would have been 2000 or more if they went to the kitchen. You realize they are calling a pocket knife a weapon?

200 people = 1000 pocket knifes? I don't think so. Keep spinning guys.

[RPBrown]

They will come out on top as they should in a tragedy such as this.
All I am saying is there are those in law I forcemeat, in society, and on this forum that profile to the point all of us are guilty because we ride. Or all of those at this event are guilty. That is profiling.
Same thing if OC passes without the amendment that LEO cannot stop you just because you OC. Profiling.

[RPBrown]

They will come out on top as they should in a tragedy such as this.
All I am saying is there are those in law I forcemeat, in society, and on this forum that profile to the point all of us are guilty because we ride. Or all of those at this event are guilty. That is profiling.
Same thing if OC passes without the amendment that LEO cannot stop you just because you OC. Profiling.

[jmra]

They will come out on top as they should in a tragedy such as this.
All I am saying is there are those in law I forcemeat, in society, and on this forum that profile to the point all of us are guilty because we ride. Or all of those at this event are guilty. That is profiling.
Same thing if OC passes without the amendment that LEO cannot stop you just because you OC. Profiling.

And there lies the problem, everyone wants to make this about motorcyclist and it's not. These people were not arrested because they ride motorcycles. Lets wait and see the evidence before we roll the cops under the bus.

[Winchster]

200 people = 1000 pocket knifes? I don't think so. Keep spinning guys.

No, I'm saying that the police said that pocket knives are included in the total. So flip your argument, 200 people = 1000 firearms? Even less likely.

[mojo84]

RP, do any of the organizations of which you are a member claim to be an outlaw motorcycle club? Do any of them use the 1%er label or patch? Do any of them use the "Texas" or any other territory on their bottom rocker? Do any of the clubs that you ride with require you to commit a serious criminal act or vow to do so if called upon in order to earn full membership? Do any of the groups with which you claim association generate any funds from illegal activities? Do any of the organizations claim to be an affiliate or associate club of an Outlaw MC? Is claiming membership in an outlaw organization not somewhat claiming oneself as being an outlaw? Most of the five or so clubs represented there Sunday would have to answer in the affirmative to the above if being honest.

Also, are people only arrested after being convicted or are they arrested based on probable cause? Were there more people there wearing biker colors that were not part of the 5 outlaw gangs that have been reported to have been there? Is being there with weapons and patches identifying oneself as a member of an outlaw MC when all heck breaks loose and people are killed not probable cause to arrest? If they didn't do the actual shooting are they not an accessory to the crime? When several things go into a convenience store and rob it and one of them kills the clerk, aren't they all charged with murder?

Here's another scenario and idea. If these tough guys really wanted to settle their turf war, why not set up a meeting out in the country somewhere on some secluded piece of property and just go to town on each other and the let the baddest of the bad be determined by who survives instead of going to a busy shopping center restaurant where there are innocent men, women and children nearby?

Does someone have to be convicted of a crime to be considered a criminal? Just because some of those killed do jot have records doesn't mean they are not criminals or outlaws. It only means they haven't been caught and convicted.

This faithful family man just out for some brotherhood fellowship with a surrogate family of stuffed toy philanthropists is a bunch of crap. These were not your typical weekend warrior yuppie professional Christian midlife crisis motorcycle enthusiasts out for a ride and good natured fellowship stopping off for some nourishment, motorcycle law refresher and safety updates.

Just because you aren't a criminal doesn't mean the others aren't.

[mojo84]

By the way, I've been known to hang out at Lukenbach, Castell and several other places when out riding. Even though I am on a Harley, no one would ever confuse me for an outlaw motorcycle gang membereven though I've had some conversations with some.

[jmra]

200 people = 1000 pocket knifes? I don't think so. Keep spinning guys.

No, I'm saying that the police said that pocket knives are included in the total. So flip your argument, 200 people = 1000 firearms? Even less likely.

I never said firearms. I said it might as well be a gun show because over a thousand weapons were confiscated. Gun shows often have as many knives as they do firearms.

[Winchster]

200 people = 1000 pocket knifes? I don't think so. Keep spinning guys.

No, I'm saying that the police said that pocket knives are included in the total. So flip your argument, 200 people = 1000 firearms? Even less likely.

I never said firearms. I said it might as well be a gun show because over a thousand weapons were confiscated. Gun shows often have as many knives as they do firearms.

And my point was, they keep making claims about the huge number they've collected, and that number is inflated because they are counting anything as a weapon. Including pocket knives. The "real" number of actual weapons is much smaller.

[jmra]

By the way, I've been known to hang out at Lukenbach, Castell and several other places when out riding. Even though I am on a Harley, no one would ever confuse me for an outlaw motorcycle gang membereven though I've had some conversations with some.

Did they arrest every biker that was present or just those that were wearing gear that identified them as a member of one of the outlaw gangs?

[mojo84]

200 people = 1000 pocket knifes? I don't think so. Keep spinning guys.

No, I'm saying that the police said that pocket knives are included in the total. So flip your argument, 200 people = 1000 firearms? Even less likely.

I never said firearms. I said it might as well be a gun show because over a thousand weapons were confiscated. Gun shows often have as many knives as they do firearms.

And my point was, they keep making claims about the huge number they've collected, and that number is inflated because they are counting anything as a weapon. Including pocket knives. The "real" number of actual weapons is much smaller.

So? There are still 9 dead men. What does it matter how many weapons?

[jmra]

200 people = 1000 pocket knifes? I don't think so. Keep spinning guys.

No, I'm saying that the police said that pocket knives are included in the total. So flip your argument, 200 people = 1000 firearms? Even less likely.

I never said firearms. I said it might as well be a gun show because over a thousand weapons were confiscated. Gun shows often have as many knives as they do firearms.

And my point was, they keep making claims about the huge number they've collected, and that number is inflated because they are counting anything as a weapon. Including pocket knives. The "real" number of actual weapons is much smaller.

I'll give you a pocket knife for each of the 170 that were arrested. That still leaves over 800 weapons.

[mojo84]

The poor family men Cossacks have canceled their upcoming fellowship. Can't believe their Constitutional Rights are being trampled in such a manner.

http://m.chron.com/news/houston-texas/t ... 279185.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;