"Texas Gun Owners Divided on Best Aaproach to Legalizing OC

[mamabearCali]

I have a question about that picture....was someone really that stupid to go to the mall like that? Or is this just an internet picture?

Because if they did I would be afraid for myself as well and that is a terrible way to OC. What OC looks like in a state that has OC is a mom or a dad or a grandpaw with an OWB holster holding a Glock 26 or a Karh pm 9, sometimes a Glock 19. I have never EVER seen a person OCing in that manner.

[jimlongley]

Texas, Florida, New York, Illionois, South Carolina, District of Columbia and Territory of Virgin Islands seem to be the only places that don't allow open carry ( correct me if I am wrong). This alone is an argument to allow open carry. Doesn't seem to be much of a problem in Oklahoma which I think is the newest state to allow it. Would I open carry? Probably not and I don't agree with the people that are over the top about this but there might be a time that I would carry outside the waist band unconcealed. Would I want to see a bunch of guys coming into WalMart with their AR15 in swat type outfits- no way. Would it bother me to see a nice S&W 19 on someones hip while doing routine shopping- not at all.

Actually NY's Penal Law section 265, does not draw a distinction between open and concealed carry. If you have a NY carry permit, you can carry openly - it's not advised, kind of like carrying a long gun in TX, but you can.

One of my favorite parts of NY Penal Law is: S 265.03 Criminal possession of a weapon in the second degree.
A person is guilty of criminal possession of a weapon in the second degree when:
(1) with intent to use the same unlawfully against another, such person:
(a) possesses a machine-gun; or
(b) possesses a loaded firearm; or
(c) possesses a disguised gun; or
(2) such person possesses five or more firearms; or
(3) such person possesses any loaded firearm. Such possession shall
not, except as provided in subdivision one or seven of section 265.02 of
this article, constitute a violation of this subdivision if such
possession takes place in such person's home or place of business.

And buried at the end of 265.15 (Presumptions):

6. The possession of five or more firearms by any person is
presumptive evidence that such person possessed the firearms with the
intent to sell same.

[gigag04]

I have a question about that picture....was someone really that stupid to go to the mall like that? Or is this just an internet picture?

Because if they did I would be afraid for myself as well and that is a terrible way to OC. What OC looks like in a state that has OC is a mom or a dad or a grandpaw with an OWB holster holding a Glock 26 or a Karh pm 9, sometimes a Glock 19. I have never EVER seen a person OCing in that manner.

It's just an internet meme picture. I'm sure it is some AR15.com member with a high post count and an "every bit as good as a Colt" Bushmaster rifle.

[03Lightningrocks]

I have a question about that picture....was someone really that stupid to go to the mall like that? Or is this just an internet picture?

Because if they did I would be afraid for myself as well and that is a terrible way to OC. What OC looks like in a state that has OC is a mom or a dad or a grandpaw with an OWB holster holding a Glock 26 or a Karh pm 9, sometimes a Glock 19. I have never EVER seen a person OCing in that manner.

It's just an internet meme picture. I'm sure it is some AR15.com member with a high post count and an "every bit as good as a Colt" Bushmaster rifle.

I figured it was a setup when I didn't see a cup of Starbucks in his hand.

[Jaguar]

I have a question about that picture....was someone really that stupid to go to the mall like that? Or is this just an internet picture?

Because if they did I would be afraid for myself as well and that is a terrible way to OC. What OC looks like in a state that has OC is a mom or a dad or a grandpaw with an OWB holster holding a Glock 26 or a Karh pm 9, sometimes a Glock 19. I have never EVER seen a person OCing in that manner.

It's just an internet meme picture. I'm sure it is some AR15.com member with a high post count and an "every bit as good as a Colt" Bushmaster rifle.

I figured it was a setup when I didn't see a cup of Starbucks in his hand.

Of course you didn't see it, it's "tactical."

[suthdj]

I have a question about that picture....was someone really that stupid to go to the mall like that? Or is this just an internet picture?

Because if they did I would be afraid for myself as well and that is a terrible way to OC. What OC looks like in a state that has OC is a mom or a dad or a grandpaw with an OWB holster holding a Glock 26 or a Karh pm 9, sometimes a Glock 19. I have never EVER seen a person OCing in that manner.

It's just an internet meme picture. I'm sure it is some AR15.com member with a high post count and an "every bit as good as a Colt" Bushmaster rifle.

I figured it was a setup when I didn't see a cup of Starbucks in his hand.

Of course you didn't see it, it's "tactical."

The coffee is in the camelback.

[03Lightningrocks]

I have a question about that picture....was someone really that stupid to go to the mall like that? Or is this just an internet picture?

Because if they did I would be afraid for myself as well and that is a terrible way to OC. What OC looks like in a state that has OC is a mom or a dad or a grandpaw with an OWB holster holding a Glock 26 or a Karh pm 9, sometimes a Glock 19. I have never EVER seen a person OCing in that manner.

It's just an internet meme picture. I'm sure it is some AR15.com member with a high post count and an "every bit as good as a Colt" Bushmaster rifle.

I figured it was a setup when I didn't see a cup of Starbucks in his hand.

Of course you didn't see it, it's "tactical."

The coffee is in the camelback.

Ahhah!!! Then he would have gotten me. I would have shot an innocent mall ninja! I think the OC radicals should be required to wear a sign that says, "Please don't shoot me, I am trying to impress the other guys on an internet forum." No sign??? It is a good shoot!

[mamabearCali]

Ahhah!!! Then he would have gotten me. I would have shot an innocent mall ninja! I think the OC radicals should be required to wear a sign that says, "Please don't shoot me, I am trying to impress the other guys on an internet forum." No sign??? It is a good shoot!

I'd appreciate it if you come to an OC state (like VA) that you don't shoot me just cause I am carrying OWB. I don't carry signs around though.

In all seriousness....since this is apparently a meme. Yall should know this is not what open carry is or what those of us that open carry look like or act like.

I know yall are kidding around, but really it is just as annoying as when they show the militia belonging to, cammo wearing, long bearded chain smoking 60 year old man as what all gun owners are like. It is good for a laugh, but it is not the truth. Eventually it starts to wear on a person being portrayed as an idiot when we are not.

[Oldgringo]

{snip}

I know yall are kidding around, but really it is just as annoying as when they show the militia belonging to, cammo wearing, long bearded chain smoking 60 year old man as what all gun owners are like.

Perception is reality....to many.

[03Lightningrocks]

Ahhah!!! Then he would have gotten me. I would have shot an innocent mall ninja! I think the OC radicals should be required to wear a sign that says, "Please don't shoot me, I am trying to impress the other guys on an internet forum." No sign??? It is a good shoot!

I'd appreciate it if you come to an OC state (like VA) that you don't shoot me just cause I am carrying OWB. I don't carry signs around though.

In all seriousness....since this is apparently a meme. Yall should know this is not what open carry is or what those of us that open carry look like or act like.

I know yall are kidding around, but really it is just as annoying as when they show the militia belonging to, cammo wearing, long bearded chain smoking 60 year old man as what all gun owners are like. It is good for a laugh, but it is not the truth. Eventually it starts to wear on a person being portrayed as an idiot when we are not.

That is not a fair analogy at all. After reading one post after another speaking of the issue and not once has it been simply OC your handgun in an OC state, your analogy falls apart.

There is a HUGE difference in what you just said about open carrying your holstered handgun in a open carry state and a bunch of internet ninja wanna bees trying to scare crap out of a bunch of soccer moms with military style rifles in a situation where it is not even close to a normal sight.

I bet your State did not get open carry by people acting in a menacing manner to soccer moms. Open carry is not a problem for me in any way. It is the method these jug heads are using to try and ram it down our throats. I am actually wondering if they are in reality anti gun people pretending to be pro gun while acting like complete hooligan redneck retards. They are doing far more damage than good. I believe most of them are coming from internet forums where the goal is to run back to the site, post pics of themselves and get an at-a-boy from fellow net warriors. Meanwhile, their "cool points" come at my expense and give the very impression of gun owners, that you say you are tired of, to the general public.

Just for the record... I was not joking. I see anyone dressed like that while holding a firearm in a ready to fire position walking in my vicinity at a mall, restaurant, coffee shop or any other place where that kind of get up is not required or even expected, I will assume the person is a shooter and shoot him in the face. If I am at a Klan Rally, which is not gonna happen, I would assume he is just another dumb redneck and ignore it.

I really hope you can see the distinct difference in what you are talking about and what is being debated here. Your form of carry in your State is not remotely related to the topic at hand.

[jmra]

[G.A. Heath]

Ahhah!!! Then he would have gotten me. I would have shot an innocent mall ninja! I think the OC radicals should be required to wear a sign that says, "Please don't shoot me, I am trying to impress the other guys on an internet forum." No sign??? It is a good shoot!

I'd appreciate it if you come to an OC state (like VA) that you don't shoot me just cause I am carrying OWB. I don't carry signs around though.

In all seriousness....since this is apparently a meme. Yall should know this is not what open carry is or what those of us that open carry look like or act like.

I know yall are kidding around, but really it is just as annoying as when they show the militia belonging to, cammo wearing, long bearded chain smoking 60 year old man as what all gun owners are like. It is good for a laugh, but it is not the truth. Eventually it starts to wear on a person being portrayed as an idiot when we are not.

That is not a fair analogy at all. After reading one post after another speaking of the issue and not once has it been simply OC your handgun in an OC state, your analogy falls apart.

There is a HUGE difference in what you just said about open carrying your holstered handgun in a open carry state and a bunch of internet ninja wanna bees trying to scare crap out of a bunch of soccer moms with military style rifles in a situation where it is not even close to a normal sight.

I bet your State did not get open carry by people acting in a menacing manner to soccer moms. Open carry is not a problem for me in any way. It is the method these jug heads are using to try and ram it down our throats. I am actually wondering if they are in reality anti gun people pretending to be pro gun while acting like complete hooligan redneck retards. They are doing far more damage than good. I believe most of them are coming from internet forums where the goal is to run back to the site, post pics of themselves and get an at-a-boy from fellow net warriors. Meanwhile, their "cool points" come at my expense and give the very impression of gun owners, that you say you are tired of, to the general public.

Just for the record... I was not joking. I see anyone dressed like that while holding a firearm in a ready to fire position walking in my vicinity at a mall, restaurant, coffee shop or any other place where that kind of get up is not required or even expected, I will assume the person is a shooter and shoot him in the face. If I am at a Klan Rally, which is not gonna happen, I would assume he is just another dumb redneck and ignore it.

I really hope you can see the distinct difference in what you are talking about and what is being debated here. Your form of carry in your State is not remotely related to the topic at hand.

This is truly sad, I would hope that anyone with a CHL would be more mature than this. Simply shooting someone for looking like that would be bad. Statements like this are just as bad as the "My officers will simply shoot anyone they see with a weapon, (Concealed/Open) Carry of firearms is simply too dangerous for the public." You could have an individual officer responding to something, an actor going to a set from their trailer, or a number of other "innocent" scenarios. I will go a step further, statements like the above are just as ignorant as going to the state capital every weekend in order to get arrested for OCing something.

[03Lightningrocks]

Ahhah!!! Then he would have gotten me. I would have shot an innocent mall ninja! I think the OC radicals should be required to wear a sign that says, "Please don't shoot me, I am trying to impress the other guys on an internet forum." No sign??? It is a good shoot!

I'd appreciate it if you come to an OC state (like VA) that you don't shoot me just cause I am carrying OWB. I don't carry signs around though.

In all seriousness....since this is apparently a meme. Yall should know this is not what open carry is or what those of us that open carry look like or act like.

I know yall are kidding around, but really it is just as annoying as when they show the militia belonging to, cammo wearing, long bearded chain smoking 60 year old man as what all gun owners are like. It is good for a laugh, but it is not the truth. Eventually it starts to wear on a person being portrayed as an idiot when we are not.

That is not a fair analogy at all. After reading one post after another speaking of the issue and not once has it been simply OC your handgun in an OC state, your analogy falls apart.

There is a HUGE difference in what you just said about open carrying your holstered handgun in a open carry state and a bunch of internet ninja wanna bees trying to scare crap out of a bunch of soccer moms with military style rifles in a situation where it is not even close to a normal sight.

I bet your State did not get open carry by people acting in a menacing manner to soccer moms. Open carry is not a problem for me in any way. It is the method these jug heads are using to try and ram it down our throats. I am actually wondering if they are in reality anti gun people pretending to be pro gun while acting like complete hooligan redneck retards. They are doing far more damage than good. I believe most of them are coming from internet forums where the goal is to run back to the site, post pics of themselves and get an at-a-boy from fellow net warriors. Meanwhile, their "cool points" come at my expense and give the very impression of gun owners, that you say you are tired of, to the general public.

Just for the record... I was not joking. I see anyone dressed like that while holding a firearm in a ready to fire position walking in my vicinity at a mall, restaurant, coffee shop or any other place where that kind of get up is not required or even expected, I will assume the person is a shooter and shoot him in the face. If I am at a Klan Rally, which is not gonna happen, I would assume he is just another dumb redneck and ignore it.

I really hope you can see the distinct difference in what you are talking about and what is being debated here. Your form of carry in your State is not remotely related to the topic at hand.

This is truly sad, I would hope that anyone with a CHL would be more mature than this. Simply shooting someone for looking like that would be bad. Statements like this are just as bad as the "My officers will simply shoot anyone they see with a weapon, (Concealed/Open) Carry of firearms is simply too dangerous for the public." You could have an individual officer responding to something, an actor going to a set from their trailer, or a number of other "innocent" scenarios. I will go a step further, statements like the above are just as ignorant as going to the state capital every weekend in order to get arrested for OCing something.

It is just the way it is. In my opinion the ignorant one is the one who would wait until that guy opened fire on innocents before doing anything about it. I guess we can't all be sheep dogs. We need sheep as well. Putting the situation in context, because once again I have to explain that we don't live in a vacuum. If their were a movie being filmed with this kind of action, I would be well aware of the movie and the person pictured above would no longer qualify as being out of position. What I plainly stated was if this guy came walking up on me in a situation or circumstance that did not require that form of dress, I would assume he is an active shooter about to open up on people. I am not a cop so I don't pull my weapon and say halt. I cannot outgun that guy. My only choice is to shoot him down. That guy is pretty darned extreme and if you saw that guy walk into the mall like that and went up to get his autograph, you are not going to make the darwin test.

[03Lightningrocks]

Allow me to post what we are speaking of here. No movie being filmed... a movie set is real darned obvious and even if there was a movie, no actor in the world is going to stroll into the mall across the street in that outfit. Take note of REAL shotgun with REAL rounds hanging off the side.yep, I am sure actors walk around off set looking just like that all the time. Especially in Dallas Texas.

This guy...

[G.A. Heath]

You focus on the movie aspect only, there are other potential reasons you might see someone dressed up like that. To simply shoot someone for appearence could easily become a tragic mistake and can easily put you in prison or the grave. I would hope beyond hope you get some better training than what you got in your CHL class and avoid the mall ninja mindset, by making the statements above you have placed yourself in the same category as the guy in the meme photo. As CHL holders we are the good guys, we are people who can think and reason not sheep dogs. As such we have a duty to observe, rationalize, and act responsibly. One does not have to wait until someone starts shooting to know they are a bad guy, and take action to stop them, but at the same time you can not act preemptively. Additionally how do you know the ammo and shotgun are real? I have seen some VERY realistic replicas. It would be sad if you killed a mall employee with replicas preparing for a publicity photo shoot, or someone participating in a hidden video TV show, or even a LEO responding to a shooting themselves. Unless you know for a FACT do not engage a target. Statements like yours hurt all efforts to further gun rights and I hope you do not encounter any of the OC crowd walking around with long guns because they might just set off your inner sheep dog.

BTW, I am trying to keep this thread on topic while addressing your statements, if you want to continue this discussion I would suggest starting a new thread for this topic so this one doesn't get hijacked and thus locked by the admin or staff.