Under 21 Question

[Rooster]

Hello, new member here, I really like the site and have a question i've been trying to get answered for a while. I'm 18 but would like to be able to carry a pistol in my truck while i'm traveling mostly from Corpus to Galveston and trips to the ranch. Is there any way I can do this but still be legal or do I need to just wait untill I can get my concealed carry permit? Any help would be really appreciated. Thanks

[seamusTX]

Welcome to the forum.

You can carry a handgun in a vehicle, but you could be arrested and have to prove that you are traveling. To get to that point, a police officer would have to have a reason to search your vehicle.

Legally speaking, you would be better off having it in a locked case.

You can always carry a long gun.

- Jim

[Rooster]

Thanks for the quick reply. What distance from home is concidered "traveling" i thought it was something like 3 counties?

[Syntax360]

There is no legal definition of traveling. However, in Sept. the law changed so that the burden of proof now falls on the county, not you, to prove whether or not you were traveling. This should prove very difficult to nearly impossible for the prosecutor, depending on the circumstances. However, as has already been stated, you may beat the rap, but you won't beat the ride.

In your circumstances, I would carry a long gun only because of your age - you may get pulled over by some officer who just "knows" you cannot legally own a handgun (even though we know this to be false). If I were over 21 but did not have a CHL, I would just do my best to give no officer a reason to search me vehicle and take comfort in the fact that the law is, more or less, on my side.

[gregthehand]

Get a 12 gauge 870 and keep it behind your seat. I did this until I had turned 21, and then after when I was waiting on my CHL. I used a Remington 870 Marine Magnum.

[kauboy]

+1 on the Mariner. A good scattergun will be just as effective if you ever need a firearm. The chances that you will have to use a gun while inside your car, while possible, are slim.

[CHL/LEO]

To get to that point, a police officer would have to have a reason to search your vehicle.

Not entirely true. Let's say I stopped Rooster on a traffic stop and while I was conversing with him I asked the question, "Are there any guns in your vehicle?" Now Mr. Rooster being an honest person with nothing to hide replies, "Yes officer I do have a handgun in my car." No warrant needed as Mr. Rooster volunteered that he had a handgun.

Now me personally, I usually could care less if a person is traveling with a handgun - CHL or not - if they are not a criminal and red flags aren't popping up all over the place. Now that's just me; there are plenty of officers on my department that feel exactly that same way and yet there are others that don't - luck of the draw.

My advice is get a CHL as soon as you can and follow the rules so that "gray area" is removed from the formula.

By the way - way back before CHLs ever existed, or I was in LE I carried a gun for protection when I "travelled" which I believe every law abiding citizen should have the right to do.

[Tacomaoffroader]

Hey Rooster,

Just FYI if ya didn't know; you can take the CHL class up to 6 months (last I heard) before you turn 21 so that all you have to do when you turn 21 is get your instructor to sign it and notarize it and you can turn the paperwork in without having to wait.

Dunno how much it really helps in terms of time, but every day you can get closer to plastic is better, IMO.

-Laurence

[kauboy]

Technically all law abiding citizens should have the right to carry regardless of "travelling" or CHL status.

But thats a debate for a different thread.

[txinvestigator]

A person who is traveling may lawfully carry a handgun in his vehicle.

Texas Penal Code 46.02
(a) A person commits an offense if he intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his person a handgun, illegal knife, or club.

TPC 46.15
(b) Section 46.02 does not apply to a person who:

(3) is traveling;


(i) For purposes of Subsection (b)(3), a person is presumed to be traveling if the person is:
(1) in a private motor vehicle;
(2) not otherwise engaged in criminal activity, other than a Class C misdemeanor that is a violation of a law or ordinance regulating traffic;
(3) not otherwise prohibited by law from possessing a firearm;
(4) not a member of a criminal street gang, as defined by Section 71.01; and
(5) not carrying a handgun in plain view.

No distance is required.

[seamusTX]

Not entirely true. Let's say I stopped Rooster on a traffic stop and while I was conversing with him I asked the question, "Are there any guns in your vehicle?" Now Mr. Rooster being an honest person with nothing to hide replies, "Yes officer I do have a handgun in my car." No warrant needed as Mr. Rooster volunteered that he had a handgun.

Right.

I have made my mind up not to answer questions at traffic stops. That might get me in trouble some day, but I figure when a LEO starts asking where I'm coming from, going to, etc., I would already be in trouble.

- Jim

[seamusTX]

...a person is presumed to be traveling if the person is:
(1) in a private motor vehicle; ...

And there's the rub. It is a presumption. Some DAs want officers to arrest and then determine whether the presumption applies.

Galveston and Brazoria counties are OK. Harris isn't. I'm not sure about the other counties between Galveston and Corpus Christi.

- Jim

[txinvestigator]

Not entirely true. Let's say I stopped Rooster on a traffic stop and while I was conversing with him I asked the question, "Are there any guns in your vehicle?" Now Mr. Rooster being an honest person with nothing to hide replies, "Yes officer I do have a handgun in my car." No warrant needed as Mr. Rooster volunteered that he had a handgun.

Right.

I have made my mind up not to answer questions at traffic stops. That might get me in trouble some day, but I figure when a LEO starts asking where I'm coming from, going to, etc., I would already be in trouble.

- Jim

You guys KNOW how pro-LEO I am, but I too, refuse to participate in fishing expeditions.

As I have said repeatedlly here, obey the traffic laws, don't act like a goober, and you won't have reason to be in contact with the police.

There seems to be much worry about getting stopped and grilled.

However, should I ever be stopped, I will answer the questions the officer needs to establish my identity, determine the location of my handgun if he asks where it is after I provide him with my chl. Much past that I will be friendly, but not vulunteering with info.

If the officer asks if I know why he stopped me, I will answer, with a smile, "I bet your gonna tell me". I will keep my other answers light like that. If he asks me if he can search my vehicle, I'll tell him I do not give consent to search. All the while I will be POLITE.

[seamusTX]

As I have said repeatedlly here, obey the traffic laws, don't act like a goober, and you won't have reason to be in contact with the police.

That's generally the case, but I have been stopped when I hadn't done anything wrong. The last time it happened, I had a temporary plate (I had just bought the car) and the officer wanted a better look at it.

It's also possible to get in a wreck that isn't your fault. In that case, if you are not injured and start retrieving things from the vehicle, they will watch you closely.

- Jim

[Charles L. Cotton]

If HB1815 (Motorist Protection Act) passes this session, then you will be able to have a handgun in your truck without having to get into the traveling issue. This Bill redefines TPC §46.02 such that having a handgun in your vehicle is no longer a violation. HB1815 does create a violation for having a handgun in your vehicle if 1) the handgun is in plain view; 2) if the person is engaged in criminal activity, other than Class C traffic violations; 3) the person is prohibited from possessing firearms under state or federal law; or 4) the person is a member of a criminal street gang as defined in the Penal Code.

This bill had no opposition in public hearings and I believe I remember HPD signing in in support, but I may be wrong about that part.

Chas.