DPS on that new section of George Bush Turnpike

[knotquiteawake]

Coming home from the in laws last night I took that new section of George Bush between i30 and firewheel parkway. A little bird in a local PD told me that the reason there was no posted speed limit there yet was because the road was "unmetered" so they can't set a speed limit until they do that and as such couldn't give out speeding tickets. Apparently you CAN still get pulled over though.

I pulled off to the side of the road, turned off the car, turned on all the interior lights, rolled down the window and waited. The DPS trooper was professional, only took a half glance at my CHL before handing it back to me (he did ask if and where I was carrying, I told him my right hip and he just said to keep my hands away from there) and he was going to go run my license and come back with a warning. He came right back with a written warning, told me to drive safely and have a good evening. He never did tell me how fast he clocked me, or how far above the speed limit I was going. The written (printed) warning doesn't have a speed on it either.

I am not a speeder, if there was a posted speed limit I would not be going more than a mile or two above that (to keep people from tailgating). Since there was no posted speed limit I decided to drive "no faster than the conditions would allow." Which was apparently faster than the DPS Trooper felt I should be going and to be honest he was probably right. I was really only going about 10mph faster than what the posted speed limit is likely to be.

[The Annoyed Man]

Isn't there some state statute somewhere which says something to the effect that "unless otherwise posted, the maximum speed limit permitted in the state of Texas is XX mph?" I know that Texas isn't California, but California has (or had) some similar type of statute which set a default maxium speed limit anywhere in the state.

[knotquiteawake]

Isn't there some state statute somewhere which says something to the effect that "unless otherwise posted, the maximum speed limit permitted in the state of Texas is XX mph?" I know that Texas isn't California, but California has (or had) some similar type of statute which set a default maxium speed limit anywhere in the state.

That possible. If thats the case then it was either my CHL, my 2 week old baby in the back seat (who started to fuss with the windows down and the cold air coming in), or just the goodness of that DPS trooper's heart that got me a warning.

Although, I really should be more careful, I've been pulled over 3 times now in my short 8 years of driving and each time been given a warning.

[Keith B]

Isn't there some state statute somewhere which says something to the effect that "unless otherwise posted, the maximum speed limit permitted in the state of Texas is XX mph?" I know that Texas isn't California, but California has (or had) some similar type of statute which set a default maxium speed limit anywhere in the state.

Yep, it's here http://info.sos.state.tx.us/pls/pub/rea ... h=25&rl=21" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

However, I believe the Tollway Authority can set the speed on their roadways as long as the follow the guidelines established for other highways

(J) The authority of regional tollway authorities, regional mobility authorities, and the Commanding Officer of a United States Military Reservation to alter the speed limits are addressed in Transportation Code, §§370.033, 545.354, and 545.358. These decision making authorities are required to follow the speed zone procedures adopted by the department when altering, on the basis of an engineering and traffic study, speed limits on off-system turnpikes or on-system highways within the confines of a military reservation.

So, I would say since the rest of the tollway is 70, that would be the prima facie speed for the unposted secitons

[knotquiteawake]

Wikipedia for what it worth. If it was indeed 70mph then I was just under 10mph over that.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_limi ... ates#Texas" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Texas is the only state that does not prescribe a different speed limit for each road type in its state or federal highway system. Any rural road—two lane, four lane, freeway, or otherwise—that is numbered by the state or federal government (United States Numbered Highways and Interstate Highways) has a 70 mph (113 km/h) statutory limit.[38]
Texas generally has 60 mph statutory limits for all county roads and 30 mph limits for all city roads.
The law allows raising or lowering the statutory limit only if a study recommends a different limit.[135]
Texas generally allows a speed zone up to 75 mph speed limit to be posted on virtually any road, regardless of ownership or jurisdiction, provided that 75 mph is determined to be a reasonable and safe speed for that part of the highway system.[136] As of summer 2011, the Texas Department of Transportation is reviewing 50,000 miles of highway that are currently posted at 70 mph for a possible increase to 75 mph. TxDOT expects this process to be completed, and all new 75 mph speed limits to be posted, by early 2013. As of January 2012, part of the highway system got higher limits: virtually all rural Interstate highways that did not already have 75 or 80 mph limits, and some TxDOT-owned tollways, have had speed limits increased to 75 mph.[137]

[knotquiteawake]

That little bird from the local PD had told me his guys can't run radar or traffic enforcement on the sections of the new George Bush that go through his city because there was no set speed limit yet. I think any tickets given out there have a high likely hood of being able to get thrown out (some shyster lawyer should have no problem doing that if theres no posted speed limit). Not worth the hassle though. I'm just going to adjust my speed to match my normal driving speeds on the rest of GBTP.

[n5wd]

That little bird from the local PD had told me his guys can't run radar or traffic enforcement on the sections of the new George Bush that go through his city because there was no set speed limit yet.

If y'all in DFW will remember, the same set of circumstances blew up in the faces of DPS and local PD's when they started enforcing the 'statutory speed limit' on the newly finished tollway section of SH 121 a couple of years ago. NTTA had just taken over as the authority for the tollway portion of SH121 and posted 60 mph limit signs - until a couple of TV stations publicly disclosed that the tollway authority had not run the mandatory speed assessments (IIRC it's 80% of the mean average of the faster drivers, or something similar, winds up being the posted speed). So they covered up the signs, but the DPS and local PDs started enforcing the 'statutory limit' (probably to try and get the average test speed down), but got caught. Thus the DPS and local tickets had to be dismissed until those assessments were done and legal speed limits posted.

As the story was told then, if it was just a plain old highway, then the statutory limits would have applied, but since this piece of roadways wasn't in fact owned by DoT, then the AHJ (authority having jurisdiction) had to follow the provisions to set a speed limit.

[DFWTT]

I think the real question here is...How can a privately controlled section of pavement be patrolled with my public tax dollars?

[MadMonkey]

I really should be more careful, I've been pulled over 3 times now in my short 8 years of driving

Yeah, you have a TERRIBLE record

[AEA]

I think the real question here is...How can a privately controlled section of pavement be patrolled with my public tax dollars?

State Police, Public Safety, etc.......
But, I see your point!

[WildBill]

Isn't there some state statute somewhere which says something to the effect that "unless otherwise posted, the maximum speed limit permitted in the state of Texas is XX mph?" I know that Texas isn't California, but California has (or had) some similar type of statute which set a default maxium speed limit anywhere in the state.

Yep, it's here http://info.sos.state.tx.us/pls/pub/rea ... h=25&rl=21" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

However, I believe the Tollway Authority can set the speed on their roadways as long as the follow the guidelines established for other highways

(J) The authority of regional tollway authorities, regional mobility authorities, and the Commanding Officer of a United States Military Reservation to alter the speed limits are addressed in Transportation Code, §§370.033, 545.354, and 545.358. These decision making authorities are required to follow the speed zone procedures adopted by the department when altering, on the basis of an engineering and traffic study, speed limits on off-system turnpikes or on-system highways within the confines of a military reservation.

So, I would say since the rest of the tollway is 70, that would be the prima facie speed for the unposted secitons

There is also a law [in California] that you can't drive at a speed that is not safe so you can still get a ticket for violating a prima facie speed limit if the officer believes that there are extenuating circumstances such as low visibily [rain or fog], heavy traffic, workers present, etc.

In California, road surveys have to be done every so many years to allow enforcement of certain speed limits. I went to traffic school for a ticket in California and the instructor, a CHP officer, said that finding the road survey was out of date was one certain way to get the judge to dismiss the ticket. As TAM stated, this is for California, so it may not apply in the Great State.

[BrianSW99]

I think the real question here is...How can a privately controlled section of pavement be patrolled with my public tax dollars?

The NTTA pays DPS to patrol the tollways. I don't remember how much it was, but it wasn't a small amount. I read that in a news story a while back when tollway speed limits were previously in the news.

Brian

[WildBill]

Here's an interesting "article"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_limits_in_Texas" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[n5wd]

I think the real question here is...How can a privately controlled section of pavement be patrolled with my public tax dollars?

Privately controlled? NTTA is a State of Texas government agency. And, per the statute that created NTTA, DPS is the police authority on their property.

[DFWTT]

Isn't the oversight of toll roads in N. Texas done by a foreign company? There was a big stink about it a couple of years ago regarding 121.