Suarez Int'l Close Range Gunfighting coming to Dallas area

[ske1eter]

Coming to the Texas Defensive Shooting Academy near Ferris on May 28-29. http://www.suarezinternationalstore.com ... lastx.aspx

[Beiruty]

Very interesting, is expensive or cost is fair? I guess it high caliber instructor/school. It might be worth it.

[Texas Dan Mosby]

Integrity matter to me.

I would not attend a course that would benefit Mr. Suarez when there are plenty of other trainers that have performed their duties in a more honorable manner.

[pcgizzmo]

I've done some research on him and from what I can tell I have no issues with him. Unless there is something I have not read about. Everyone makes mistakes and I'm all about second chances. I've been given more than a few myself and have always appreciated them. He's not running for president he's showing you how to defend yourself. From what I can tell his company teaches very innovative tactics and will show you things that not many civilian trainers will share. Not that it's the holy grail but I've seen great reviews of their training.

[gigag04]

As has been said by someone wiser than I, "buyer beware."

[pcgizzmo]

As has been said by someone wiser than I, "buyer beware."

Please elaborate. I respect your opinion. My research shows that they have hundreds of positive reviews and yes, he did screw up in the past but what does that have to do with training? I don't believe that everyone has to be squeaky clean to teach self defense courses if the information is accurate but if there is some other reason you are saying "Buyer Beware" could you elaborate or PM me? I don't think some of the top MMA fighters are squeaky clean but if I wanted to learn how to fight on the ground I would consult with them. I thought about taking this course.

[ske1eter]

Myself and two buddies are taking this course so I guess we'll find out if it's worth it. The three of us have taken Fighting Pistol and Advance Fighting Pistol with Tactical Response in the past. There are plenty that will bad-mouth that outfit as well so I'm not really concerned with what armchair quarterbacks think regarding SI.

[baldeagle]

As has been said by someone wiser than I, "buyer beware."

I had never heard of Suarez until this post, so I did some research. According to Gabe, he was on workers comp for a work-related back injury. He asked his attorney if it would be a violation for him to teach classes while he was recuperating. HIs attorney said no. He notified his employer (Santa Monica PD) and the police union in writing of what he was doing. They later decided to charge him with the kitchen sink of violations, including some felonies, one of which was workers compensation fraud. After some time and a lot of lawyers fees he decided to plead guilty to a misdemeanor to get the whole mess over with. Here's a copy of the news story about his conviction. He was ordered to pay a $100 fine and $112, 250.01 restitution for wages he was paid while he was on workers comp. He also had to serve a year in jail and five years probation. His "crime" was teaching classes while he was on workers comp, classes which he had notified the PD he was teaching and which he had cleared with both his doctor and his attorney.

I would not take one of his classes, because they are too expensive for me. I have no idea if he's a good teacher or not, but, from what I've read, it's a bit unfair to accuse him of lacking integrity.

[gigag04]

http://www.warriortalknews.com/2011/01/ ... ering.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This ludicrous article, among others. If you search on here somewhere we had a little chat about him a while ago.

[scud runner]

His "crime" was teaching classes while he was on workers comp, classes which he had notified the PD he was teaching and which he had cleared with both his doctor and his attorney.

There are three sides to every story.

[baldeagle]

http://www.warriortalknews.com/2011/01/ ... ering.html

This ludicrous article, among others. If you search on here somewhere we had a little chat about him a while ago.

OK, I'll bite. What's ludicrous about it?

[Excaliber]

http://www.warriortalknews.com/2011/01/ ... ering.html

This ludicrous article, among others. If you search on here somewhere we had a little chat about him a while ago.

Mr. Suarez is not on my list of folks whose classes I'd jump through hoops to attend either. I won't elaborate on my reasoning here other than to say that a reading of the article Gigag04 cited above should raise enough red flags to serve as fair warning for anyone who has not come across his work before.

[baldeagle]

http://www.warriortalknews.com/2011/01/ ... ering.html

This ludicrous article, among others. If you search on here somewhere we had a little chat about him a while ago.

Mr. Suarez is not on my list of folks whose classes I'd jump through hoops to attend either. I won't elaborate on my reasoning here other than to say that a reading of the article Gigag04 cited above should raise enough red flags to serve as fair warning for anyone who has not come across his work before.

Please elaborate. Innuendo does none of us any good. What is wrong with the article?

[MoJo]

Caveat emptor.

Mr Saurez seems to think he's the holy grail of training. The article in question is pushing violation of one of the cardinal rules of gun safety. A rule stressed by generations of firearms trainers before Mr. S was even born. Men like Jeff Cooper, Elmer Keith, Skeeter Skelton, Bill Jordan, Charles Askins, and Clint Smith all advocate keeping your trigger finger off the trigger until you're ready to fire. Many of these men have survived life or death gunfights and were talking from personal experience. I somehow doubt Mr. S has ever seen the elephant and I doubt he ever will.

If I were going to spend my hard earned money on training I would spend it with a trainer with less baggage and a whole lot smaller ego.

[Excaliber]

http://www.warriortalknews.com/2011/01/ ... ering.html

This ludicrous article, among others. If you search on here somewhere we had a little chat about him a while ago.

Mr. Suarez is not on my list of folks whose classes I'd jump through hoops to attend either. I won't elaborate on my reasoning here other than to say that a reading of the article Gigag04 cited above should raise enough red flags to serve as fair warning for anyone who has not come across his work before.

Please elaborate. Innuendo does none of us any good. What is wrong with the article?

Mr. Suarez is out and out wrong about the startle response and sympathetic contraction not causing unintentional discharges, and in my opinion his experiments to disprove these phenomena are not valid because the participants were not surprised or startled and knew what was about to happen. Different and very bad things happen when these events occur suddenly and with complete surprise under high stress conditions.

You can find the basic facts of several such instances here. There was a similar incident several months ago where a Plano undercover officer unintentionally shot a suspect he was attempting to place under arrest. It has been alleged that he accidentally pulled the trigger while trying to activate his weapon mounted flashlight. This may or may not turn out to be the case, but it would be hard to argue that the gun would have fired if his trigger finger had remained outside the trigger guard until and unless a deadly force situation had arisen.

When I went through my first police firearms training at the academy, we were trained to cover a suspect with finger on the trigger. During the following years I personally saw enough close calls (including some of my own) and read enough incident reports to conclude that was an unacceptably dangerous practice. When I assumed command of training operations I made finger off the trigger until a decision has been made to fire an explicit part of the firearms training program. Officers were skeptical until I provided each one with a dozen or so historical incidents of where the finger on the trigger practice had led to tragedy. Was agency liability a concern in changing the practice? Yes. Training officers to do known dangerous things certainly creates liability when those practices lead to disaster. However, the more important consideration was preventing a readily foreseeable tragedy that would devastate an officer, a suspect, and both families if a negligent shooting occurred.

Mr. Suarez had an active police career and speaks from personal experience on the realities of what happens during violent encounters. However, he takes some positions that I would consider irresponsible. This is a major issue when one is a trainer whose words are taken as gospel by others. The article in question is one example.

In this instance he is correct that there is somewhere between .1 and .3 or so seconds in response time lost to moving the trigger finger onto the trigger when a decision has been made to fire, and that having the finger already on the trigger is marginally faster. I can't argue that those very brief time intervals couldn't be critical in a given situation, and in a situation where one was in extreme danger and one already had justification to use deadly force, a finger on the trigger tactic might be appropriate when facing an unrestrained highly dangerous suspect. However, I also maintain that the risk of accidentally shooting someone without either justification or a decision to use deadly force is so high with a finger on the trigger before a decision to fire has been made that, in my opinion and the opinion of many other knowledgeable folks, that practice in most circumstances would constitute gross negligence and be indefensible in light of well documented history and research.