Got Pulled Over Three Times in Ten Minutes

[seamusTX]

I would argue that the Roman Praetorian Guard was more like the modern Secret Service, acting as bodyguards for a general or the emperor. (The Secret Service of course has never been a military force or resorted to bullying or political corruption.)

In the 18th century, the concept of paid civilian police was foreign to English and American common law. It is an important point that sheriffs and constables are elected officials directly answerable to the voters.

Prohibition was one of several ways that the federal and state governments asserted themselves into the daily lives of citizens (the federal income tax being another from the same era). Before that, a police officer would have to observe a person committing a crime, answer the hue and cry, or possibly know that there was an outstanding warrant.

I think you and I agree that this is a case where the chosen solution (warrantless search) is worse than the problem it was supposed to solve.

I certainly agree, as you know.

It would be one thing to search a vehicle for an abducted person or a corpse if probable cause existed, like the textbook blood and hair on the bumper.

Even during Prohibition they were looking for jugs and barrels of liquor.

However, at the risk of repeating myself, now they find contraband the size of a grain of sand. One of the more notorious cases involved finding illegal drugs that someone had stashed in a baby's diaper (on the baby at the time).

While I rush to add that people should not be using illegal drugs around babies or hiding drugs in their diapers, that was one clever cop.

The problem with Terry, as I see it, is that the surface justification is to enforce a law that is itself unconstitutional (carrying concealed weapons). If the officer perceives an immediate threat he does not need the justification established by Terry.

I am pretty sure you and I agree that we are on a slope towards a police state and it is getting steeper and steeper. I am a firm believer that the question is not if we will have a new revolution, but when.

It's too late.

All we can do now is maintain some fences. We have made progress in the area of the RKBA, huge progress in the cases of Heller and McDonald. Habeus corpus has been preserved. Total Information Awareness was scrapped.

- Jim

[seamusTX]

It's also interesting to consider the men who wrote the Bill of Rights were likely well aware of the mobility of wagons and carts drawn by horses, oxen or other animals, as well as the much greater mobility of horseback riders like Paul Revere.

That's a great point.

One of the British atrocities of the 1770s that led to the revolution was searching carts and buggies and even wheelbarrows, contrary to common law. Among the things that they were looking for were weapons and ammunition that the Americans were buying from smugglers.

- Jim

[WildBill]

BTW:

except for my destination; Gilhooley's. Gilhooley's is a restaurant that caters mostly to the locals. It's a "dive", but it has "character" and has the best osyters in the county.

What can you tell me about Noah's Ark restaurant in the same general area?

It's a good place. I'll send you a PM with some specifics.

[Fangs]

I've generally driven cars with two sets of bulbs. One being on for low beams, and both for high beams. Every time a low beam light has gone out, I'd just dirty up my headlights and drive home with my brights on. I've passed several LEO like this without instance.

[maxlib]

It may explain if I told you where this occurred. It was on West Bayshore Drive [FM 646] on a stretch of a road that follows along the bay. The highway goes from Texas City through Bacliff and basically leads to nowhere [San Leon], except for my destination; Gilhooley's. Gilhooley's is a restaurant that caters mostly to the locals. It's a "dive", but it has "character" and has the best osyters in the county.

Man that was my grazing area when I was a youngster. Lived almost next door to Clifton By The Sea for awhile, lived all over San Leon, owned a house on Fourth St in San Leon as an adult, but sold it and got out of there after my daughter was born because of the drugs that were coming in via the shrimp boats.

[mkosmo]

Ok a question. If your headlight is out and you turn your driving or fog lights on, does that help avoid being stopped?

Off the topic and onto one of my major 'rroids for a moment:

Your driving lights are your headlights. If I was a LEO, I'd write tickets for anyone driving with their PARKING LIGHTS on. That is a moving violation by definition and so...

Back on track, if you please.

Not exactly... It's a violation to use parking lights instead of headlights, but nothing in the traffic code makes driving with parking lights on illegal.

[KD5NRH]

Not exactly... It's a violation to use parking lights instead of headlights, but nothing in the traffic code makes driving with parking lights on illegal.

IIRC, it's legal to use fog lights + parking lights without headlights if the fog lights meet the low-beam requirements for placement and illumination pattern. Driving lights, OTOH, should be off anytime you wouldn't use high beams.

[LikesShinyThings]

Not exactly... It's a violation to use parking lights instead of headlights, but nothing in the traffic code makes driving with parking lights on illegal.

IIRC, it's legal to use fog lights + parking lights without headlights if the fog lights meet the low-beam requirements for placement and illumination pattern. Driving lights, OTOH, should be off anytime you wouldn't use high beams.

Maybe it's the programmer in me, but the way I'm reading this is "If you wouldn't be using high beams, it is illegal to use your driving lights (aka, headlights)". I know that can't be what you mean, because seems like 50% of the time I'm driving at night, I have oncoming traffic, and I need my headlights (nighttime) but the oncoming drivers would be swearing a blue streak about me blinding them if I had my high beams on. But I'm not sure I can make out exactly what your intent was.

BTW: before I bought a car with DRLs (daytime running lights), I would turn my headlights on immediately after starting my engine, day or night, and not turn them off until the car was parked and I was turning the engine off. Granted, that was before I moved to this wonderful state, but I can't imagine being ticketed for doing what I considered enhancing the visibility and safety of my vehicle.

[srothstein]

Maybe it's the programmer in me, but the way I'm reading this is "If you wouldn't be using high beams, it is illegal to use your driving lights (aka, headlights)".

What he meant was auxiliary driving lights, which are a special type of supplemental light in Texas, as opposed to headlights. When you see a Jeep or truck that has those extra lights on it by the winch or on the roll ball (or other places), they may be driving lights and not just fog lights.

Texas allows up to four headlights (and requires two), plus up to two fog lights, two auxiliary driving lights, two auxiliary passing lamps, and two spotlights. There are limits on where you can mount them and how the light may be distributed. There are even limits on how you can use them when approaching other cars (in either direction). All of this is in chapter 547, subchapter E of the Transportation code at: http://www.statutes.legis.state.tx.us/D ... .547.htm#E" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[LikesShinyThings]

Maybe it's the programmer in me, but the way I'm reading this is "If you wouldn't be using high beams, it is illegal to use your driving lights (aka, headlights)".

What he meant was auxiliary driving lights, which are a special type of supplemental light in Texas, as opposed to headlights. When you see a Jeep or truck that has those extra lights on it by the winch or on the roll ball (or other places), they may be driving lights and not just fog lights.

Texas allows up to four headlights (and requires two), plus up to two fog lights, two auxiliary driving lights, two auxiliary passing lamps, and two spotlights. There are limits on where you can mount them and how the light may be distributed. There are even limits on how you can use them when approaching other cars (in either direction). All of this is in chapter 547, subchapter E of the Transportation code at: http://www.statutes.legis.state.tx.us/D ... .547.htm#E" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

See, I knew I couldn't be interpreting the statement correctly.
Thank you for the clarification.