CHL holder killed by police in Las Vegas at a Costco

[WildBill]

Contagious shooting, didn't a lot of this go on in the Army during Viet Nam? Maybe that was just in the movies. If it did, I wonder how much it still happens. Doesn't your average Soldier or Marine receive much more weapons training than the average LEO? Or is this comparison apples and oranges?

It probably did happen in Viet Nam, and yes this is apples and oranges. Soldiers and Marines are trained for combat. Las Vegas is not a combat zone.

[baldeagle]

Contagious shooting, didn't a lot of this go on in the Army during Viet Nam? Maybe that was just in the movies. If it did, I wonder how much it still happens. Doesn't your average Soldier or Marine receive much more weapons training than the average LEO? Or is this comparison apples and oranges?

My next thought might be a little out there. There's a very little part of me that hopes the deceased did do something wrong that will justify the officers. If not, I hope the officers get what they deserve, but I would also like to have a little more faith in LE.

I don't know how much of it went on in Vietnam, because I wasn't there. I know it got my cousin, Donald, killed. He was point man on a recon mission with a bunch of green recruits straight from the states. They were ambushed and opened fire, killing Donald. I went to his funeral three days before I entered boot camp. You can bet it sobered me up in a hurry.

[jester]

I am not a lawyer, but to my knowledge, failure to follow a police command does not constitute justification for the use of deadly force anywhere in the United States, even when that order consists of a warning to cease an immediate threat to an innocent party - e.g., pointing a gun and refusing to drop it.

Sure, but based on the news reports I saw, the third party witnesses don't say the West Point graduate was pointing a gun at anyone, or even had a gun in his hand. Instead, witnesses said the police were the ones with guns in their hands. (I'm going solely on third party witness statements because neither his girlfriend nor the police are unbiased observers.)

In any case, as I've said before, video would answer a lot of questions.

[davidtx]

I hope the victim's dad has enough spook juice to get justice, one way or another.

I am not sure exactly was "spook juice" is, but I am confident that he has plently.

One of the first articles said that the dad had extensive military and intelligence (spooks) contacts.

[Pinkycatcher]

Don't think this has been posted but the video in this case is having "technical difficulties"

http://www.8newsnow.com/Global/story.asp?S=12816105" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Keith B]

Don't think this has been posted but the video in this case is having "technical difficulties"

http://www.8newsnow.com/Global/story.asp?S=12816105" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This is from the 15th, so kinda out-dated. Sounds fishy to me, but then again, I run a surveillance system in our buildings. I have had a couple of instances when it looks like things are OK when the recorder is actually having issues and not capturing video.

[Pinkycatcher]

This is from the 15th, so kinda out-dated. Sounds fishy to me, but then again, I run a surveillance system in our buildings. I have had a couple of instances when it looks like things are OK when the recorder is actually having issues and not capturing video.

It is kind of outdated, but it is a legitimate news source, and I can see how we in Texas would miss it, as it's from a Vegas station. I bet you I could walk in any Costsco right now, walk to the back of the store, grab an item, and walk straight out to my car and they would present my entire trip without fail from my car back to my car at my trial. Again I think this is highly suspect as both Costco and the police (both of whom are in charge of tapes) have incentives to not show an event that turns out bad for them. I would think the same if the girlfriend had a tape of the incident and it showed up technically wrong.

[ExMarlboroMan]

This is just sad.


I hope the truth comes out eventually... one way or the other.

[03Lightningrocks]

Unfortunately, without video, I bet this ends up with nobody other than the witnesses ever knowing the truth.

[baldeagle]

Unfortunately, without video, I bet this ends up with nobody other than the witnesses ever knowing the truth.

The cops know.

[03Lightningrocks]

Unfortunately, without video, I bet this ends up with nobody other than the witnesses ever knowing the truth.

The cops know.

Oh yeah.... I have a real bad feeling this was not a good shoot, mostly because I believe the police would have released the video immediately if it showed this guy pulling a gun on them.... IMHO. I am not buying that a technical glitch happened. By nobody I meant the population at large. We will be left to speculate.

One thing I have decided from this is that my hands stay up in the air and I don't move until the cops make up their mind who is going to issue commands. One other thing I have decided I will always do while carrying is avoid confrontation of all kinds. I don't want to get into a situation that escalates out of control. Even getting into a simple fist fight is no longer an alternative for those of us carrying. the other guy could get the gun and shoot you. Nope... everybody I run into on the street wins the argument... at least while I am carrying.

[baldeagle]

I just read on this Nevada Shooters Forum.

In talking with a very close friend over the weekend who is a manager at one of the Costco’s locally, I was told that Metro not only confiscated the surveillance video’s but also went as far as taking the hard drive too.

Wonder if Costco has a dual feed for backup purposes?

[jimlongley]

"Contagious shooting" (some officers firing only because others did) is a mark of an agency with a drastically deficient training program. Even when shooting is justified, not every officer at a scene may be in a position to see the justification. A well trained and conscientious officer must and will hold his fire until he is both individually justified in using DPF and he believes it is necessary to do so.

I am glad that you posted this. I was going to bring this up in an earlier post, but was not aware of the term "contagious shooting." I can easily visualize this happening in a tense situation when several officers are pointing their guns at a suspect." After the first shot is fired, I can imagine the volley of shots that would follow without further consideration.

Wouldn't Amadou Diallo be a good example of that?

[Excaliber]

I just read on this Nevada Shooters Forum.

In talking with a very close friend over the weekend who is a manager at one of the Costco’s locally, I was told that Metro not only confiscated the surveillance video’s but also went as far as taking the hard drive too.

Wonder if Costco has a dual feed for backup purposes?

More than likely they're one and the same.

The days of "surveillance tapes" are long over. Today's video images are converted to pixels which are digitized and stored on hard drives as data. In such cases, taking the drive on which the images are stored is the only way to secure the original evidence. This is neither unusual nor inappropriate.

[philip964]

If the digital video evidence is being properly handled the hard drive will be brought to a place like this http://www.rcfl.gov/index.cfm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. I did not see a location for Las Vegas.

An exact digital picture of the hard drive will be copied onto a specially prepared hard drive which has only zeros written on every space in the hard drive.

All of the examination will be done with the prepared hard drive so as to not corrupt the original hard drive (evidence) in any way.

You do not want to commit a crime while using a computer or cell phone.