Others access to a handgun while in a vehicle.....

[xHypex]

I have read many posts here regarding various traveling issues, but I have never seen this weapon access question asked regarding other parties.

Say you have a CHL but are traveling a long distance so you decide to move your handgun into the unlocked glove box for comfort reasons.

If there are other persons in the car is there a concern over their access to the weapon desipte your CHL status? Also, would the age of passenger make a difference in the view of the law (i.e. a minor in the front seat)?

To me, having a minor in the front seat with ready access to a weapon is not a good idea, but since my wife does not have a CHL I wanted to make sure there are no additional legal implications since the weapon is "on or about" both of our persons and I do not fully have the weapon under my control.

This crossed my mind as I was driving with my wife up to the northeast, as I also did not know the Texas interpretation of this situation much less the other state's interpretations. Therefore, I played it safe and always kept the handgun under my control.
-hype

[The Marshal]

Let me add my angle to this as well.

I work in Downtown DFW.
Can't carry at my office, so need to leave gun in car.
However, Wifey drops me off and takes car to her work.

Q: What are the ramifications for my Wife (no CHL) if she is stopped with a pistol in the car?

[longtooth]

We had to deal w/ that before the presumed traveling law took effect. When she got her CHL it really made thing easy a few times. ie: Early on my only carry was .45 Commander. No back pocket pistol. One car at church & she needs to go somewhere. Simplest answer is get the plastic.

[gigag04]

This will quickly going to turn into another HB 823 discussion, which has happened alot lately. However, we can go there, but I don't think it will answer y'alls questions.

In my reading of the law, within the texas border, if you meet the 5 presumptions for the travelling non-applicability, then you can legally have a handgun in the car. This is dangerous because of (thanks for the phrase txi) lefty prosectutors that do not uphold the law in the books, but thier own opinion instead.

-nick

[Flatland2D]

That is an interesting question. Nothing I have ever read on TX CHL law has ever said anything about other people in a car (from what I can remember), so I would presume you would at least be okay with your wife sitting there. A minor could be a different story. Would the "allowing access of a handgun to a minor" trump CHL law?

[gigag04]

IIRC any gun in the car is "carried" under any CHL in the car (pre HB 823)

-nick

[xHypex]

IIRC any gun in the car is "carried" under any CHL in the car (pre HB 823)

-nick

That's what I presumed was the case, but it's a very very gray area. I was gearing this question towards CHL statutes rather than HB 823, because we already know technically this is ok under HB 823.

The real reason I thought of this question is because for Non-CHLers we always talk about HB 823 and the "on or about ones person" statutes. However, to me it makes sense for a CHL holder to always have the gun under their direct control. Shared access is never mentioned anywhere, but could pose problems in many situations.
-hype

[G36Packer]

I asked my local LEO and they said I was OK as long as I was in the car. Once I leave the car the non-CHL holders in the car would be illegal. So when we stop I holster my weapon on me before I exit the car if there is any chance they will stay in the car.

I was told that "locked" in the glove box or trunk was not good enough.

[txinvestigator]

I asked my local LEO and they said I was OK as long as I was in the car. Once I leave the car the non-CHL holders in the car would be illegal. So when we stop I holster my weapon on me before I exit the car if there is any chance they will stay in the car.

I was told that "locked" in the glove box or trunk was not good enough.

Please cut out these laws and show them to your local LEO, as it seems they do not know the law.

Texas Penal Code
§46.02. Unlawful carrying weapons.

(a) A person commits an offense if he intentionally,
knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his person a handgun,
illegal knife, or club. . It has been clear by the courts that "about your person" means within your immediate access. The locked trunk of your vehicle is not in your immediate access. If your LEO has a court precedent I am not aware of I would be interested to read it.

Also show him this;

§46.15. Nonapplicability.



(b) Section 46.02 does not apply to a person who:



(3) is traveling;








In the regular session of the 79th Legislative Session in Texas, House Bill 823 was passed.

It reads



SECTION 1. Section 46.15, Penal Code, is amended by adding
Subsection (i) to read as follows:
(i) For purposes of Subsection (b)(3), a person is presumed
to be traveling if the person is:
(1) in a private motor vehicle;
(2) not otherwise engaged in criminal activity, other
than a Class C misdemeanor that is a violation of a law or ordinance
regulating traffic;
(3) not otherwise prohibited by law from possessing a
firearm;
(4) not a member of a criminal street gang, as defined
by Section 71.01; and
(5) not carrying a handgun in plain view.

So even if the CHL holder leaves the vehicle, the others are covered under 46.15 (i)


Just because he is a cop does not mean he knows all of the laws. As a cop I once wrote a ticket to a Big Rig tractor operator who was not pulling a trailer for not having a rear LP. I learned in court that he did not need a rea LP.