Lake Meredith carry

[hoytinak]

Can one carry on their boat at Lake Meredith and if so if a Park Ranger ask to see your fishing license do you have to show him your CHL with it?

[The Annoyed Man]

Can one carry on their boat at Lake Meredith and if so if a Park Ranger ask to see your fishing license do you have to show him your CHL with it?

I don't know if it is a Corps of Engineers lake, but it is, then I believe that current regulations say that you can't carry on the lake, or the CoE land surrounding it.

[hoytinak]

Yep, you are correct I just got off the phone with the Ranger Station out here. Nope can not carry at Lake Meredith.

[coltm4223]

Did the ranger give you a basis or reference for this? Lake Mer. is not a COE lake, the lake is managed by the NPS and is classified as a National Recreation Area it therefore follows state law reguarding firearms possesion such as hunting. I've researched this and I have yet to find anything federal or state prohibiting carry on the lake or the land surrounding.

[amaguy]

The rules and regulations posted around the lake say no firearms allowed, CHL holders included. There are exceptions during legal hunting seasons...migratory bird, deer etc. Of course, this would also pertain to long guns and not pistols.

amaguy

[Kalrog]

Signs can say just about whatever they want, but that doesn't mean that they are enforceable.

[Pinkycatcher]

Signs can say just about whatever they want, but that doesn't mean that they are enforceable.

Yah, it has to be a proper 30.06 sign, or verbal (which you received) and private property, if it's a state lake then you're good to go anyway, if it's a federal lake then you can't.

[amaguy]

Lake Meredith is a National Recreatioal Area...Feds.

amaguy

[coltm4223]

If you can tell me where those exceptions are in writting I would greatly appreciate it. I got into a long conversation over this subject with a Texas Parks and Wildlife Agent and he couldn't cite any document or current regulation. In the end of the conversation he agreed with me and promised to let me know if he heard anything to the contrary that was reputable. As far as hunting not applying to pistols, that is wrong as hunting with a pistol in Texas is legal and the lake follows Texas Parks and Wildlife regulations. I wish someone could produce some document concerning this subject but I really don't want 50 people calling the Park Rangers all that does is bring attention to a subject thats all about concealment. The only thing I can find is Texas Law concerning firearms and the NPS HQ refers to state law concerning every area except a national park.

[coltm4223]

The following is directly from the NPS Lake Meredith website, hopefully this will put this to rest. "It is unlawful to be in possession of a hand gun not being utilized as a primary hunting weapon (including a person licensed to carry a concealed handgun) during the entire hunting season in the boundaries of Lake Meredith National Recreation Area."

[Kalrog]

The following is directly from the NPS Lake Meredith website, hopefully this will put this to rest. "It is unlawful to be in possession of a hand gun not being utilized as a primary hunting weapon (including a person licensed to carry a concealed handgun) during the entire hunting season in the boundaries of Lake Meredith National Recreation Area."

That doesn't put it to rest. Since they are a governmental agency, the stuff they do has to be backed by statute somewhere. And the only statute so far quoted says that this type of a facility follows state law - which would mean that it is legal to carry there. Anyone know differently?

[couzin]

That doesn't put it to rest. Since they are a governmental agency, the stuff they do has to be backed by statute somewhere. And the only statute so far quoted says that this type of a facility follows state law - which would mean that it is legal to carry there. Anyone know differently?

Here is the NPS regulation http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/cfr_2004/ ... cfr2.4.htm. The current Code of Federal Regulations for DOI/NPS states that State law is followed with regard to the illegal possession of "weapons" as defined by 36 CFR 1.4. Since it was written prior (around 1980) to the common legal possession of a loaded firearm (esp the current concealed carry laws) - that is the reason for the current rewrite to allow weapons per the State regulations in which the park is located. The rewrite does not waive sovereignty for the Feds - it just says that, if weapons (concealed, open, whatever carry or possession) are permitted in the State and one is in compliance with all State laws with regard to that carry or possession, then the NPS (and FWS) will permit it withing the confines of violating any existing Federal statutes or regulations.

Instead of griching over little stuff, shouldn't anyone that utilizes either NPS or FWS land just be glad that the DOI is actually willing to entertain a rule change instead of just sticking their toes in and refusing to budge. Things are changing, be glad for the little (big?) victories. Nothing in the Federal government happens overnight (unless someone at a very high pay grade or political standing gets inconvenienced - then...).

[coltm4223]

Looks good to me, so use good judgement and enjoy the disappearing lake and be thankful that it's not a COE lake. Now the question whether or not you are required to inform LE (NPS or TX P&W) that you are armed when they do a no-notice inspection of your vessel and you have not been stopped for any violation or cause. The last time I was inspected they never asked for ID, just life jackets and fire extinguisher. NPS Rangers are not by definition Peace officers certified by the state. I don't believe the CHL statue mentions federal LE

[couzin]

NPS Rangers are not by definition Peace officers certified by the state.

Actually they come in three flavors - Some NPS rangers are LE and have full arrest, search, and detain authority. Some, like COE rangers, have citation authority only (write a ticket). And other NPS rangers are 'interpretive rangers' with practically no authority. Just FYI.

[coltm4223]

Unless they are licensed as a peace officer by TCLEOSE in the state of Texas they do not meet the definition of "Peace Officer" in Texas. The statue reads that you are required to display your license when a magistrate or peace officer demands. Federal Law Enforcement Officers are not certified by TCLEOSE unless they pursue this certification and must be serving in this capacity not as a Fed.