Can I carry at my office, the county courthouse??

[shootthesheet]

The TX legislature doesn't trust us to maintain control when excited. Not in schools or bars or sporting events as written. I can personally say I have never, ever wanted to pull a gun and shoot someone because of a game or because a teacher didn't treat my child right. It is ignorant.

I don't mind the courtroom restriction. However, if they restrict us then I think they should be forced to screen everyone entering. They may in larger places but not anywhere I go. They rely on what...signs. So, I am forced to disarm but the gang bangers friends can walk in with whatever they choose. That is a problem in the law. Either they are going to have to spend a load of money on screening and metal detectors or they need to change the law. I look at court like voting in that guns should not be present. However, they are and controlled by the bad guys who don't follow the law. Sure they have armed Bailiffs but, after he/she is shot with the first shot/s, it is over for everyone else. I think any place allowed to restrict us or that is restricted by law must be made to ensure our security. We obey the law and risk being killed or hurt because of it. That is not acceptable for any government to allow.

[txinvestigator]

Why should a law abiding citizen with a CHL not be allowed to carry in a courtroom?

For the same reason he/she should not be allowed to carry in a prison. Should he become incapacitated for any reason, his weapon would be available to all sorts of people who society would rather not have access to weapons. Courtrooms are frequently visited by felons or soon-to-be-felons.

No, it is because courtrooms are often charged with emotion, and people's lives are often changed dramatically in courtrooms. After several high profile shootings by people subject to the orders of the courts (mostly civil courts) these laws were passed.

So we CHL holders automatically become unable to control ourselves emotionally when we are in a courtroom? Sorry, that argument doesn't work when you are talking about college campuses any better than it does in a court room.

Maybe if you were CHARGED with something and in a court room, but then you probably couldn't carry because of what you were charged with.

I didn't say that. I said that is why the laws were passed. I don't agree with them. And people being charged with crimes, traditionally, have not been the shooters. They have been those is civil courts. Usually men in divorce/child custody proceedings, at least that I recall.

[txinvestigator]

The TX legislature doesn't trust us to maintain control when excited. Not in schools or bars or sporting events as written. I can personally say I have never, ever wanted to pull a gun and shoot someone because of a game or because a teacher didn't treat my child right. It is ignorant.

.

[cxm]

There is an interesting provision in the law with respect to carry in a Courthouse or court. The same anonomly exists with respect to schools.

Carry is allowed in both places "with written permission." Curiously the law does not say who can give such permission in either location.

That raises the question of who can grant written permission... For example can the clerk of court give permission? The law is silent on the issue. Can a school teacher grant permission to carry? The principal? The janitor?

This part of the law is interesting... raises quite a few issues.

I'll be happy to grant written permission to anyone who wants to carry in either location...

V/r

Chuck

[Photoman]

There is an interesting provision in the law with respect to carry in a Courthouse or court. The same anonomly exists with respect to schools.

Carry is allowed in both places "with written permission." Curiously the law does not say who can give such permission in either location.

I would assume that the person in legal control of the property. But that is an assumption on my part.

[Turfspanker]

No, it is because courtrooms are often charged with emotion, and people's lives are often changed dramatically in courtrooms. After several high profile shootings by people subject to the orders of the courts (mostly civil courts) these laws were passed.

I was thinking the same thing before you posted this. The same logic holds true for sporting events.

From a firearms perspective, I think courtrooms and even the halls outside of courtrooms are more dangerous than attending a Soccer game.

Brings back memories from the 60's of infamous criminals being gunned down after verdicts were handed down. In addition, there is plenty modern day mahem in Courts from family members and friends of the accused.

[Dragonfighter]

Why should a law abiding citizen with a CHL not be allowed to carry in a courtroom?

For the same reason he/she should not be allowed to carry in a prison. Should he become incapacitated for any reason, his weapon would be available to all sorts of people who society would rather not have access to weapons. Courtrooms are frequently visited by felons or soon-to-be-felons.

No, it is because courtrooms are often charged with emotion, and people's lives are often changed dramatically in courtrooms. After several high profile shootings by people subject to the orders of the courts (mostly civil courts) these laws were passed.

So we CHL holders automatically become unable to control ourselves emotionally when we are in a courtroom? Sorry, that argument doesn't work when you are talking about college campuses any better than it does in a court room.

Maybe if you were CHARGED with something and in a court room, but then you probably couldn't carry because of what you were charged with.

I will speak from personal experience here. I am typically a non-emotional person. I was involved in a case where a young man had attacked several girls in church. The way the parents conducted themselves (very trusted members, dad was an elder), the way many of the members of the congregation rallied around the young man and his family while rejecting the girls, the distortion and the way so much of the evidence was squelched by the defense as well as the smug arrogance of the young man added up to a completely charged situation. Had I been armed, I may have succumbed. It frightens me to think I allowed that kind of anger to well up. I am a very rational and analytical person, but I will go with this one.

Oh yeah, who has the longest run on sentence now? Hah!

[mikeloc]

Carry is allowed in both places "with written permission." Curiously the law does not say who can give such permission in either location.

That raises the question of who can grant written permission... For example can the clerk of court give permission? The law is silent on the issue. Can a school teacher grant permission to carry? The principal? The janitor?

I've taught Hunter Education in schools from the 1980's I always got a letter from the school principal and informed the local police about the details; date of class, time of day, etc.

After the shooting in Colorado in 1999 a school asked me to teach a class and I contacted the local Police Chief about teaching Hunter Ed at the school and he asked me do the class at the police station. It worked out great.

Mike

[Nazrat]

Having been the prosecuting attorney on the case with the courthouse shooting in Tyler in 2005, I can vouch for the fact that most courthouse shootings are on the civil side and/or involve children.

I directly contacted my legislators in 2005 to add me to the list of authorized personnel to carry in the courthouse and was denied. I believe that they added the elected DA in 2005 and the subordinate DA's in 2007. As an Assistant AG, I am still not allowed to carry in any courthouse even though my case was the cause of the shooting and many of our courtrooms do not have any security.

I'm not sure that everyone should be allowed to carry at the courthouse but I do agree that the list should be expanded.

[Sailor]

Why should a law abiding citizen with a CHL not be allowed to carry in a courtroom?

For the same reason he/she should not be allowed to carry in a prison. Should he become incapacitated for any reason, his weapon would be available to all sorts of people who society would rather not have access to weapons. Courtrooms are frequently visited by felons or soon-to-be-felons.

No, it is because courtrooms are often charged with emotion, and people's lives are often changed dramatically in courtrooms. After several high profile shootings by people subject to the orders of the courts (mostly civil courts) these laws were passed.

It would seem to me that the reasons you give above are the reasons we should carry in a courtroom. Just like many of the judges do. Just think, if all CHLs could carry in the courthouse how much nicer everyone would behave. Especially if the Presiding Judge put up a sign for everyone to see that all CHL holders are welcome in his courtroom.

Cody

[charlie]

My office is on courthouse property. My understanding is that one cannot carry in a building that contains a courtroom. A couple of years ago the county built a new annex building and my office was moved there. One of the large meeting rooms is used as a courtroom twice a month. Because of that I'm told that carry is not permitted anytime. The courtroom is used for family court (Child support issues) and things can get heated in the hallways and parking lot. I would not be surprised if violence resulted from from one of these hearings. There are no metal detectors in the Annex

Both the courthouse and the annex are 30.06 posted.

I once worked for a state agency that moved into a new building. They designated one room in the building as a "courtroom". They would schedule a "hearing" in that room about 2-3 times a year. One of the brass told me that the courtroom designation was for the express purpose of keeping CHLs out of the entire building all of the time.

[iflyabeech]

Here is a sign posted at our county building in Robstown. I think they sometimes hold JP court there! I took the pic just a few weeks ago, sorry about the quality.

[cxm]

If you read the law it says with permission... it does not state WHO may give that permission.

Whilst I would agree a judge can, I would think the clerk of court could as well... or maybe the janitor... or the bailiff, or the secretary in the clerks office... it is vague.

FWIW

Chuck

If you're friends with the judge under 46.03 just get written permission.

(3) on the premises of any government court or offices utilized by
the court, unless pursuant to written regulations or written authorization
of the court;

[Kalrog]

Here is a sign posted at our county building in Robstown. I think they sometimes hold JP court there! I took the pic just a few weeks ago, sorry about the quality.

I don't believe that sign is referencing the appropriate statute. I also understand that the legislature intentionally changed the wording of the statute to be only the portion of the building in question - specifically to get around entire buildings being off limits because court is sometimes held there. Now you can carry there legally, except for the portion of the building being used for court (probably nothing most of the time based on what you say).

[Mike1951]

The sign is definitely PRE- 30.06.