Texas State Fair Carry Rules

[Grayling813]

The problem being will be folks will go unarmed. Just like they loaded the train cars to be executed. Sheep are not real smart animals.

[ScottDLS]

Here's the deal: The State Fair probably can't exclude gun carriers pursuant to Texas gun laws. However, they can trespass you and they don't need a reason. I don't believe the property is "public property" since is leased by a non-governmental entity.

You are probably correct.

I’m not picking at nits in your statement but am thinking about the overall logic.

If the state fair cannot legally exclude gun carriers from entering then why is it possible to legally trespass them out? Does not make sense! Citizens legally exercising their RKBA where they are legally allowed to be and not doing anything to meet the standards of breaking any law should be allowed entry and th fair should not be able to do anything to prevent it.

The fairgrounds property IS public property, belonging to the City of Dallas, and they cannot charge you with Trespass. However, they will have private security physically prevent you from entering armed. And there will be nothing you can do about it.

[carlson1]

Received this email today.

NRA Submits Brief to AG Ken Paxton on State Fair of Texas Gun Ban


Yesterday, NRA-ILA submitted a brief to state Attorney General Ken Paxton as an interested party in the matter of RQ-0558-KP, the opinion request sought by State Rep. Dustin Burrows (R-Lubbock) and State Sen. Mayes Middleton (R-Galveston) on the matter of the State Fair of Texas' misguided firearm prohibition for License To Carry holders at Fair Park in Dallas.

The brief outlines a "robust statutory scheme" that the Texas Legislature has enacted, protecting law-abiding Texans' Right to Carry firearms for self-defense across the Lone Star State. NRA-ILA led the fight for passage of these important safeguards over the last two decades, including legislation restricting political subdivisions from posting public premises off-limits to LTC holders (SB 501, 2003), a bill imposing legal remedies and civil penalties on these entities for wrongfully excluding LTC holders from such locations (SB 273, 2015), and critical improvements to the state firearms preemption law to prevent a patchwork of conflicting local restrictions (HB 3231, 2019). Attorney General Paxton and state lawmakers have repeatedly referenced these laws in their actions and communications with the City of Dallas (which owns Fair Park but leases it out to the State Fair of Texas for three weeks in the fall during the fair), since announcement of the ban earlier this month.

The clock is ticking on the City of Dallas to take corrective action and direct the State Fair of Texas to rescind the ban. Attorney General Paxton sent a letter to the city on August 13, notifying them that unless the wrongful exclusion of LTC holders is corrected within 15 days, he will file suit to seek injunctive relief and civil penalties under Texas Government Code Section 411.209. We thank General Paxton for his swift and decisive action, and Sen. Middleton & Rep. Burrows for seeking key clarifications from his office on the application of the aforementioned statutes to these types of restrictions on the lawful carrying of firearms on public property.

NRA-ILA: Institute for Legislative Action
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[anygunanywhere]

Here's the deal: The State Fair probably can't exclude gun carriers pursuant to Texas gun laws. However, they can trespass you and they don't need a reason. I don't believe the property is "public property" since is leased by a non-governmental entity.

You are probably correct.

I’m not picking at nits in your statement but am thinking about the overall logic.

If the state fair cannot legally exclude gun carriers from entering then why is it possible to legally trespass them out? Does not make sense! Citizens legally exercising their RKBA where they are legally allowed to be and not doing anything to meet the standards of breaking any law should be allowed entry and th fair should not be able to do anything to prevent it.

The fairgrounds property IS public property, belonging to the City of Dallas, and they cannot charge you with Trespass. However, they will have private security physically prevent you from entering armed. And there will be nothing you can do about it.

The legislature needs to fix this. Being treated as second class citizens and being denied access to public property while exercising our constitutional rights is growing old.

[carlson1]

[chasfm11]

The fairgrounds property IS public property, belonging to the City of Dallas, and they cannot charge you with Trespass. However, they will have private security physically prevent you from entering armed. And there will be nothing you can do about it.

Perhaps it is just me but the latter part of the statement raises some interesting philosophical concepts. Private security is "mercenaries. The elected leaders of Dallas already have a law enforcement arm - the Dallas Police - who are paid by the tax payers to enforce State and local laws. If the City can hire a private firm who hires mercenaries, what is the limit of that power? Perhaps, to properly identify them, the mercenaries should wear Red Shirts. The slope gets very slippery, very fast.

[RottenApple]

Red Shirts

I dunno... Red Shirts aren't good for much except for cannon fodder.

[Grayling813]

Red Shirts

I dunno... Red Shirts aren't good for much except for cannon fodder.

None of those guys have trigger discipline.

[ScottDLS]

The fairgrounds property IS public property, belonging to the City of Dallas, and they cannot charge you with Trespass. However, they will have private security physically prevent you from entering armed. And there will be nothing you can do about it.

Perhaps it is just me but the latter part of the statement raises some interesting philosophical concepts. Private security is "mercenaries. The elected leaders of Dallas already have a law enforcement arm - the Dallas Police - who are paid by the tax payers to enforce State and local laws. If the City can hire a private firm who hires mercenaries, what is the limit of that power? Perhaps, to properly identify them, the mercenaries should wear Red Shirts. The slope gets very slippery, very fast.

The city doesn't hire them, the State Fair Non-Profit does. I've been through this with Cowboys Stadium (owned by the City of Arlington, not Jerry) 8 years ago for a non-scholastic non-professional event. They post an unenforceable sign. They have private security with wands and they won't let you in. What are you going to do about it? I wrote the City Attorney and they said pound sand. I didn't bother with the Texas AG because he already put out his ruling which basically says he isn't going to do anything.

[ScottDLS]

Here's the deal: The State Fair probably can't exclude gun carriers pursuant to Texas gun laws. However, they can trespass you and they don't need a reason. I don't believe the property is "public property" since is leased by a non-governmental entity.

You are probably correct.

I’m not picking at nits in your statement but am thinking about the overall logic.

If the state fair cannot legally exclude gun carriers from entering then why is it possible to legally trespass them out? Does not make sense! Citizens legally exercising their RKBA where they are legally allowed to be and not doing anything to meet the standards of breaking any law should be allowed entry and th fair should not be able to do anything to prevent it.

The fairgrounds property IS public property, belonging to the City of Dallas, and they cannot charge you with Trespass. However, they will have private security physically prevent you from entering armed. And there will be nothing you can do about it.

The legislature needs to fix this. Being treated as second class citizens and being denied access to public property while exercising our constitutional rights is growing old.

The most important thing the legislature did, and I'll at least say I posted the idea here years ago, is lower the 30.05/6 trespass offenses to no-jail $200 ticket misdemeanors. At that point I stopped looking for signs or trying to understand the "owners' intent", verbal notice, written notice, oral notice, aural notice, an-l notice or whatever the heck a frownie face with a toy gun picture means. I carry everywhere where I want to unless I know it's a felony, or it's a class B or higher misdemeanor with a high chance of getting caught.

[The Annoyed Man]

Here's the deal: The State Fair probably can't exclude gun carriers pursuant to Texas gun laws. However, they can trespass you and they don't need a reason. I don't believe the property is "public property" since is leased by a non-governmental entity.

You are probably correct.

I’m not picking at nits in your statement but am thinking about the overall logic.

If the state fair cannot legally exclude gun carriers from entering then why is it possible to legally trespass them out? Does not make sense! Citizens legally exercising their RKBA where they are legally allowed to be and not doing anything to meet the standards of breaking any law should be allowed entry and th fair should not be able to do anything to prevent it.

The fairgrounds property IS public property, belonging to the City of Dallas, and they cannot charge you with Trespass. However, they will have private security physically prevent you from entering armed. And there will be nothing you can do about it.

The legislature needs to fix this. Being treated as second class citizens and being denied access to public property while exercising our constitutional rights is growing old.

The most important thing the legislature did, and I'll at least say I posted the idea here years ago, is lower the 30.05/6 trespass offenses to no-jail $200 ticket misdemeanors. At that point I stopped looking for signs or trying to understand the "owners' intent", verbal notice, written notice, oral notice, aural notice, an-l notice or whatever the heck a frownie face with a toy gun picture means. I carry everywhere where I want to unless I know it's a felony, or it's a class B or higher misdemeanor with a high chance of getting caught.

WINNAH WINNAH CHICKEN DINNAH!

[gemini]

SFOT.....seems it never ends....and the saga continues. I think I have a headache.

[rtschl]

TXAG Ken Paxton has filed suit against the City of Dallas and the State Fair:

Texas Attorney General Ken Paxton sued the City of Dallas and the State Fair of Texas for unlawfully prohibiting firearms from government-owned public property in violation of Texas law.

Attorney General Paxton asked the court to grant injunctive relief to prevent the City of Dallas or the State Fair of Texas from enforcing the unlawful ban on firearms.

“Municipalities cannot nullify state law nor can they avoid accountability by contracting official functions to nominally third parties,” said Attorney General Paxton. “Neither the City of Dallas nor the State Fair of Texas can infringe on Texans’ right to self-defense. I warned fifteen days ago that if they did not end their unlawful conduct I would see them in court, and now I will.”


https://www.texasattorneygeneral.gov/ne ... state-fair

[ScottDLS]

TXAG Ken Paxton has filed suit against the City of Dallas and the State Fair:

Texas Attorney General Ken Paxton sued the City of Dallas and the State Fair of Texas for unlawfully prohibiting firearms from government-owned public property in violation of Texas law.

Attorney General Paxton asked the court to grant injunctive relief to prevent the City of Dallas or the State Fair of Texas from enforcing the unlawful ban on firearms.

“Municipalities cannot nullify state law nor can they avoid accountability by contracting official functions to nominally third parties,” said Attorney General Paxton. “Neither the City of Dallas nor the State Fair of Texas can infringe on Texans’ right to self-defense. I warned fifteen days ago that if they did not end their unlawful conduct I would see them in court, and now I will.”


https://www.texasattorneygeneral.gov/ne ... state-fair

[The Annoyed Man]

I’m happy that AG Paxton has filed the suit, but unless the defendants are forced to pay the accruing fines, I’d guess that the city of Dallas, the State Fair of Texas, and Fairpark First will stonewall and get delays in court proceedings long enough for the fair to finish running before the court ever has a chance to slap the defendants down.

Then next year, Fairpark First will be reorganized and operating under a new name, and the same old song and dance will begin again.