Taco Cabana; NO WEAPONS ON OUR PROPERTY

[txinvestigator]

I got confused. How did the LEO rreference come up? 30.06 does not apply to LEOs.

30.05 does not apply to Peace Officer OR Special Investigators

(g) This section does not apply if:
(1) the basis on which entry on the property or land or
in the building was forbidden is that entry with a handgun or other
weapon was forbidden; and
(2) the actor at the time of the offense was a peace
officer, including a commissioned peace officer of a recognized
state, or a special investigator under Article 2.122, Code of
Criminal Procedure, regardless of whether the peace officer or
special investigator was engaged in the actual discharge of an
official duty while carrying the weapon.

It is not possible for Taco Cabana to keep Peace Officer or FBI agents from carry firearms inside thier stores.

[Lucky45]

I got confused. How did the LEO rreference come up? 30.06 does not apply to LEOs.

Keep up, TXi. Keep up!!!!. Don't worry, they are driving me crazy too. Here is how it got into the mix.

lawrnk wrote:

Dear Taco Cabana,

As a recent concealed handgun licensee, I was very disappointed to read about your company policy. Prior to my license my family ate about twice a week at your Missouri City, TX location. Since you prohibit "ANY" weapon on your facility (see this email from your lawyers http://www.texasshooting.com/TexasCHL_F ... aco+cabana, I will be sure and inform the Missouri City police department that they are also not welcome. I know most of the officers. I have enjoyed your food for going on 18 years, and sorry to say neither myself or any of my family with be doing business with you while this policy exists.

Regards,

Kevin E. Lawrence

[KBCraig]

Also, since FBI Agents are not Peace Officers, it appears they, along with other Special Investigators are banned from carrying there. Well, at least us CHLs are in good company.....

In a nutshell, if they are ON-DUTY then they can carry. If they are OFF-DUTY, then they have to obey PC30.06 like everyone else.

Actually, it's questionable if 30.06 applies to non-TCLEOSE federal LEOs who are covered by LEOSA (FBI, U.S. Marshals, Bureau of Prisons, Border Patrol, DoD police, etc., etc., etc.), because 30.06 refers specifically to CHLs.

Personally, as a member of that group, I observe 30.06 signs, which isn't a problem since I seldom have reason to go to posted locations (I only know of two in Texarkana; I might have to go to the hospital, but I don't have to patronize Red River credit union!)

Kevin

[Renegade]

The response lawrnk posted was based on Taco Cabana Policy, which he wrote in this letter from Nov 9 post:

Dear Taco Cabana,

As a recent concealed handgun licensee, I was very disappointed to read about your company policy. Prior to my license my family ate about twice a week at your Missouri City, TX location. Since you prohibit "ANY" weapon on your facility (see this email from your lawyers http://www.texasshooting.com/TexasCHL_F ... aco+cabana, I will be sure and inform the Missouri City police department that they are also not welcome. I know most of the officers. I have enjoyed your food for going on 18 years, and sorry to say neither myself or any of my family with be doing business with you while this policy exists.

Regards,

Kevin E. Lawrence"

Seems like I am the only one with the English Comprehension skills.

No apology needed.

[Renegade]

While we are on the subject of reading comprehension, I notice a lot of folks who like to quote the LEOSA seem to have trouble comprehending this portion of the law:

`(b) This section shall not be construed to supersede or limit the laws of any State that--
`(1) permit private persons or entities to prohibit or restrict the possession of concealed firearms on their property; or
`(2) prohibit or restrict the possession of firearms on any State or local government property, installation, building, base, or park.

[txinvestigator]

Also, since FBI Agents are not Peace Officers, it appears they, along with other Special Investigators are banned from carrying there. Well, at least us CHLs are in good company.....

In a nutshell, if they are ON-DUTY then they can carry. If they are OFF-DUTY, then they have to obey PC30.06 like everyone else.

Actually, it's questionable if 30.06 applies to non-TCLEOSE federal LEOs who are covered by LEOSA (FBI, U.S. Marshals, Bureau of Prisons, Border Patrol, DoD police, etc., etc., etc.), because 30.06 refers specifically to CHLs.
Kevin

Humm, I don't see how it is questionable;

Texas Penal Code
§ 30.06. TRESPASS BY HOLDER OF LICENSE TO CARRY CONCEALED
HANDGUN. (a) A license holder commits an offense if the license
holder:
(1) carries a handgun under the authority of
Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code....

First, officers under LEOSA are not carrying under 411 of the govt code, so 30.06 does not apply to them.

Secondly, 30.05 specifically INCLUDES off duty in the non-applicibility. it matters not if Peace Officers or Special Investigators are on or off duty; 30.05 does not apply to them, and neither does 30.06.

[Lucky45]

Actually, it's questionable if 30.06 applies to non-TCLEOSE federal LEOs who are covered by LEOSA (FBI, U.S. Marshals, Bureau of Prisons, Border Patrol, DoD police, etc., etc., etc.), because 30.06 refers specifically to CHLs.
Kevin

Hey KBCraig, I wish you would have quoted part of the US Law that I posted when you made your objection. Partially quoting me kinda takes my statement out of context. But let's get down to business anyway.
What part of the US Law is questionable??? It says..

H.R.218: The Law Enforcement Officers Safety Act of 2004
Chapter 44 of title 18, United States Code
SEC. 2. EXEMPTION OF QUALIFIED LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS FROM STATE LAWS PROHIBITING THE CARRYING OF CONCEALED FIREARMS
(Sec. 926B.)(a)`Notwithstanding any other provision of the law of any State or any political subdivision thereof, an individual who is a qualified law enforcement officer and who is carrying the identification required by subsection (d) may carry a concealed firearm that has been shipped or transported in interstate or foreign commerce, subject to subsection (b).
`(b) This section shall not be construed to supersede or limit the laws of any State that--
`(1) permit private persons or entities to prohibit or restrict the possession of concealed firearms on their property; or
`(2) prohibit or restrict the possession of firearms on any State or local government property, installation, building, base, or park.

[stevie_d_64]

very insightful. The MPD are exempted from this.

So... what they are saying there is "Police are the only ones that are safe with guns....everybody else is unsafe with guns."

Seems like a reasonable question to ask of:

Shanna M. Ramirez
Vice President, Associate General Counsel
Carrols Restaurant Group, Inc.
8918 Tesoro Drive, Ste. 200
San Antonio, Texas 78217
Phone: (210) 283-5569
Fax: (210) 804-2328

Since it only makes sense...This is one of those pots that begs to be stirred some more...

Heck, I'll even call her...Haven't had a lawyer hang up on me today...

What up with everyone in the last couple days...or over the weekend? Everyone pretending like they don't understand English now, as well as following responses. The lady said in her response to a specific question, that MoCity PD are exempt from having to disarm in the restaurant, by LAW. Not according to any slack given by Taco Cabana. TEXAS LAW.!!!
Geeezz.

Well I certainly comprehend English as well as I need to for the last few years...

Maybe its the way she felt compelled to tell Mr. Lawrence in the response something most of us already know, but had to rub noses in it...

Certainly many people can ignore that kind of dig on people like us who are not the problem, but thats ok, I understand why you could dismiss that kind of insulting attitude...

I personally gave up on T.C. and the Katy Mills organization, and many others in this state that rightfully choose to restrict us...I might occasionally go for a Papusa, but thats just a moment of weakness I suppose...

This kind of issue just must bring out the best and worst in people...

[dihappy]

Its Pupusa :)

[srothstein]

In a nutshell, if they are ON-DUTY then they can carry. If they are OFF-DUTY, then they have to obey PC30.06 like everyone else.

Lucky, there has been a lot of debate in the police circles over this very point. In other states, this may be more concrete, but the way Texas and the Federal law are worded, it is not as clear as you think. Note that the federal law says that the state laws must allow a person to ban guns from the property. Texas law does not truly allow that, in that our law allows a person with certain conditions to enter the property despite the 30.06. For example, the 30.06 does not apply to a person who is traveling and not a CHL.

Also, Texas law specifically says it (gun laws) does not apply to police officers and special investigators from the federal government.

Thus, in Texas, a peace officer or a federal special investigator does not have to comply with 30.06. He should, but should and do are two different things.

[lawrnk]

Regarding LEO's, I was quoting the originator of this thread.

I emailed Taco Cabana about their policy on 30.06 signs. I received this in response.

I am Vice President, Associate General Counsel for Taco Cabana and I am writing because I received your April 16,2007, comment to the company regarding our Concealed Handguns Policy.

First, let me tell you that I appreciate your patronage and that you took the time to let us know how you feel about our policy.

I understand that anyone licensed to carry a concealed weapon has undergone a significant amount of screening and training. I also understand that each of us has concerns about our safety and wellbeing. Taco Cabana has made a decision based on a number of competing factors, to prohibit all weapons from our premises. I believe it is the best we can do to keep our customers and employees safe.

I have confirmed that our interior sign is in full compliance with the posting regulations. In addition, we have placed a smaller courtesy sign on the front door so that patrons are informed of the policy prior to entering the store.

Thank you again for taking the time to let us know how you feel. I know we may not be in agreement on the best method to ensure safety. However, we respect your opinion as our customer and hope that you will continue as our customer and respect our decision.

Sincerely


Shanna M. Garcia
Vice President, Associate General Counsel


So Taco Cabana is an official VICTIM DISARMAMENT ZONE. No chl and NO COPS! It's maybe one thing to ban chl. But to ban COPS? I sure wouldn't trust my safety to a place like that. Not even in the drive thru lane.

[lawrnk]

True, and the 30.06 aside a business owner may ban any weapon of any sort from his premises. Now my reference to LEO was based on what I thought may have been conveyed to 50cal. Either way, I'll never give them another nickel in my life.

Also, since FBI Agents are not Peace Officers, it appears they, along with other Special Investigators are banned from carrying there. Well, at least us CHLs are in good company.....

In a nutshell, if they are ON-DUTY then they can carry. If they are OFF-DUTY, then they have to obey PC30.06 like everyone else.

Actually, it's questionable if 30.06 applies to non-TCLEOSE federal LEOs who are covered by LEOSA (FBI, U.S. Marshals, Bureau of Prisons, Border Patrol, DoD police, etc., etc., etc.), because 30.06 refers specifically to CHLs.

Personally, as a member of that group, I observe 30.06 signs, which isn't a problem since I seldom have reason to go to posted locations (I only know of two in Texarkana; I might have to go to the hospital, but I don't have to patronize Red River credit union!)

Kevin

[lawrnk]

I believe you are wrong.
My wife's uncle is seventh day adventist. He owns a organics shop and has worked with his lawyer to ban any weapon on his property, including LEO.

I hate his policy, but as a private business owner, you do have certain rights.

I got confused. How did the LEO rreference come up? 30.06 does not apply to LEOs.

30.05 does not apply to Peace Officer OR Special Investigators

(g) This section does not apply if:
(1) the basis on which entry on the property or land or
in the building was forbidden is that entry with a handgun or other
weapon was forbidden; and
(2) the actor at the time of the offense was a peace
officer, including a commissioned peace officer of a recognized
state, or a special investigator under Article 2.122, Code of
Criminal Procedure, regardless of whether the peace officer or
special investigator was engaged in the actual discharge of an
official duty while carrying the weapon.

It is not possible for Taco Cabana to keep Peace Officer or FBI agents from carry firearms inside thier stores.

[GrillKing]

It is not possible for Taco Cabana to keep Peace Officer or FBI agents from carry firearms inside thier stores.

How about: "Do you have a warrant or are you here on official business? If not, I'm asking you to leave."

Nothing to do with firearms....

BTW, I'm not supporting this. If I owned a business, I'd want LEOs as customers. Money is green and it's free security!! And I like cops....

[lawrnk]

I have many Missouri City cops as customers and I completely agree. I've lived all over town, and I think I have the most outstanding LEO's anywhere. As I understand it my wife's uncle has a good rapport with his LEO customers. They respect that it is part of his religion, well some of them do. Being an organics shop he does not get many LEO's in his shop, other than holidays when they shop for their wives.

It is not possible for Taco Cabana to keep Peace Officer or FBI agents from carry firearms inside thier stores.

How about: "Do you have a warrant or are you here on official business? If not, I'm asking you to leave."

Nothing to do with firearms....

BTW, I'm not supporting this. If I owned a business, I'd want LEOs as customers. Money is green and it's free security!! And I like cops....