FL:Stand your ground law under fire for parking space dispute murder

[Chaparral]

These must be a lot of people here that have never been blindly attacked. During that shock, can you make a split decision? You will only possibly pay with your life if you are wrong.

Just sayin, put yourself in his shoes and remember...

I can’t put myself in his shoes because I’m not a jerk who thinks he has the right to confront people about parking violations.

Now, if I’m minding my own business and an unprovoked attack like that occurs then the attacker is likely to face deadly force. I would hope that I have the opportunity to not pull the trigger should my attacker back away when I draw my self defense handgun.

What happened to the 1st amendment?

Just because it is legal to initiate a verbal confrontation with a stranger, doesn’t mean it is a smart thing to do.

[mojo84]

These must be a lot of people here that have never been blindly attacked. During that shock, can you make a split decision? You will only possibly pay with your life if you are wrong.

Just sayin, put yourself in his shoes and remember...

I can’t put myself in his shoes because I’m not a jerk who thinks he has the right to confront people about parking violations.

Now, if I’m minding my own business and an unprovoked attack like that occurs then the attacker is likely to face deadly force. I would hope that I have the opportunity to not pull the trigger should my attacker back away when I draw my self defense handgun.

What happened to the 1st amendment?

The government wasn't involved until the guy shot an unarmed guy. This is not a 1st amendment issue.

[K.Mooneyham]

DISCLAIMER: I DON'T THINK THE SHOOTER IS THE BEST GUY ON EARTH! (some acted as if I thought that elsewhere on the 'Net).

And, I wouldn't have done what the shooter did in confronting the people parking illegally. Not my business, I leave that sort of enforcement up to the police who get paid to do that. However, after having a discussion on another site regarding this story, a lot of folks seem to not understand escalation/deescalation, but they do seem to think it's okay to lay hands on due to verbal provocation alone. Who knows, maybe in Florida that's okay? I just know it's not here in Texas, per PC 9.31. That said, I still do my best not talk trash to folks.

If the shooter had a history of doing that sort of thing, and threatened them in the process, why did no one ever call the police on him? Or did they? If they did, what was the result of those calls?

[mojo84]

DISCLAIMER: I DON'T THINK THE SHOOTER IS THE BEST GUY ON EARTH! (some acted as if I thought that elsewhere on the 'Net).

And, I wouldn't have done what the shooter did in confronting the people parking illegally. Not my business, I leave that sort of enforcement up to the police who get paid to do that. However, after having a discussion on another site regarding this story, a lot of folks seem to not understand escalation/deescalation, but they do seem to think it's okay to lay hands on due to verbal provocation alone. Who knows, maybe in Florida that's okay? I just know it's not here in Texas, per PC 9.31. That said, I still do my best not talk trash to folks.

If the shooter had a history of doing that sort of thing, and threatened them in the process, why did no one ever call the police on him? Or did they? If they did, what was the result of those calls?

I have not seen anyone say it was ok to push the guy. My contention is that it is not acceptable or legal to shoot someone over being pushed if the attack was not continuing. Shooting someone out of retaliation is not acceptable.

[rp_photo]

I agree with the charges. When carrying, it's even more important to not look for trouble, which hassling strangers over handicapped parking certainly is.

[rp_photo]

And, I wouldn't have done what the shooter did in confronting the people parking illegally. Not my business, I leave that sort of enforcement up to the police who get paid to do that.

People tend to get involved when they shouldn't and vice-versa.

[TreyHouston]

I’m not saying I agree with what he did or disagree. I am glad many here KNOW he was in a “verbal altercation” with the guys wife! There are many people who use their hands to talk. I dont know if the wife text her husband or not. I sure don’t know that either! I have seen people get beat up simply because some dude thought he was talking to his wife/gf. In reality, they had not said a word to each other.
I do however know what it is like to get blindsided like that, mostly by friends messing around, and it is very disorienting! (Military) You get the whole vision tunnel dream like state going on. The other guy was pretty big as well!
Witnesses - I don’t know if the people that are talking are telling the truth or not. I have seen people jump on the band wagon without knowing the facts! The only way to get most of the real story is to hear it in the court where both sides can be heard.
The other day in my company parking garage I had some guy come up to me after I parked and exited my truck, he told me I was over the line. I was in a hurry, I thanked him and reparked my truck. No biggie. If I showed you the video without audio, it could have looked like he was yelling at me...

Do I agree what happened? I DON’T KNOW! I do know that is very unfortunate a man died. I do also agree that it could have happened the other way around as well do to a head injury or a continued attack. 12 FT is AWFULLY close even if a handgun is already pulled.

Just sayn’!!

[K.Mooneyham]

DISCLAIMER: I DON'T THINK THE SHOOTER IS THE BEST GUY ON EARTH! (some acted as if I thought that elsewhere on the 'Net).

And, I wouldn't have done what the shooter did in confronting the people parking illegally. Not my business, I leave that sort of enforcement up to the police who get paid to do that. However, after having a discussion on another site regarding this story, a lot of folks seem to not understand escalation/deescalation, but they do seem to think it's okay to lay hands on due to verbal provocation alone. Who knows, maybe in Florida that's okay? I just know it's not here in Texas, per PC 9.31. That said, I still do my best not talk trash to folks.

If the shooter had a history of doing that sort of thing, and threatened them in the process, why did no one ever call the police on him? Or did they? If they did, what was the result of those calls?

I have not seen anyone say it was ok to push the guy. My contention is that it is not acceptable or legal to shoot someone over being pushed if the attack was not continuing. Shooting someone out of retaliation is not acceptable.

Mojo84, my comment wasn't directed at you or anyone else here on the Forum. My conversation on the subject happened elsewhere. I put that in the top statement, but I guess I could have done more to make it clear. The folks on here seem to have a much better grasp on the subject, even if disagreeing with each other, than some others out across the Internet. I guess I shouldn't have interjected that into the topic already being discussed as it caused some confusion. My apologies.

[Zen]

I carry. I do so for self-protection of myself and my loved ones. It is a responsibility as well as a right. As a carrying individual, I do not put myself in situations that may raise the odds of having to pull my pistol. It’s not there to bolster me to confront people.

This gentleman failed in that responsibility. Whether he shot in good faith or not believing his life was in danger, he created that situation by acting an ass and irresponsibly. A confrontation with someone who is armed, citizen or law enforcement, automatically escalated the danger of the confrontation.

[montgomery]

It's fake news to attack the Florida stand your ground law based on this. The victim was attacked and knocked to the ground. He wasn't standing when he shot his attacker, and it's not likely a person knocked to the ground can crawl fast enough to escape a standing attacker.

Agreed. Mass media attempt to politicize and demonize SYG in a situation that has absolutely nothing to do with SYG

[tomneal]

A couple of thoughts.

I am not the 'parking police' and don't want to be.

After being shoved to the ground, there were at least 3 people 'converging' on the shooter. The shover, the wife, and a 'random' guy coming out of the store and walking toward the shooter.

The shooter didn't have much time to make his decision to pull the trigger.

Everyone on the video seems to have made mistakes.

The one thing the shooter is doing correctly is 'shutting up'. If only George Zimmerman, Joe Horn, and many others had shut up after the shooting, their legal fees would have been lower.

[der Teufel]

… Everyone on the video seems to have made mistakes.

That's certainly a major truth!

Without audio it's difficult to really know for certain what happened.
Was the victim saying "Now I'm gonna kick your butt!" ?? Or was he saying "Leave my girl friend alone!" ?? Or was he saying nothing?

What, if anything, did the shooter say?

There's little, basically none, justification for coming up and knocking someone to the ground. It's terrible that a parking space argument ended with a death.

[BBYC]

Just because it is legal to initiate a verbal confrontation with a stranger, doesn’t mean it is a smart thing to do.

And just because it is legal for a young woman to wear provocative clothing in public, doesn’t mean it is a smart thing to do.

[dlh]

Not familiar with Florida law. Isn't there a grand jury in any of this? And, of course, I understand a prosecutor can "indict a ham sandwich."