Crypto-currencies

[Wolverine]

On the other hand, the basis of BTC is pretty strong, not so much on what it's backed by, but the fact that it's getting harder and harder to make more of it.

Isn't that true of every crypto currency based on block chain? Even if the concept has a long term future, maybe BTC is the next Betamax or the next Friendster. The barrier to entry is low and banks talk about creating their own coins.

Of course, before you turn your nose up at "fake" currency, do you think your dollars are backed by ACTUAL gold?! Last I checked, only 3% of circulating US currency is backed by gold, the rest is "full faith and credit", which is pretty much what Bitcoin is, except with cryptography/full custody chain accounting.

What's the transaction cost when you pay with paper dollars? What's the cost when you play with debit card? Now what's the cost of a bitcoin transaction?

[Liberty]

We can by real things with but coin, when you purchase an item with most venders, there is typically no mark-up or very little. For instance; a large precious metal dealer JM Bulion has a special for 10 coins.
If you send them a check it will. Cost $162.30
Bitcoin will cost 163.99
Credit card or PayPal 168.99
Although Bitcoin is $1.69 higher there is no mailing of checks involved. There are no fees involved with transferring bitcoin from your wallet. There aren't a large amount of benders that accept bitcoin yet, but lousy is growing. It's kind of nice to make purchases without banks being involved and tracking your purchases.

[OldCannon]

On the other hand, the basis of BTC is pretty strong, not so much on what it's backed by, but the fact that it's getting harder and harder to make more of it.

Isn't that true of every crypto currency based on block chain? Even if the concept has a long term future, maybe BTC is the next Betamax or the next Friendster. The barrier to entry is low and banks talk about creating their own coins.

I only cited BTC as an example. There are actually several cryptocurrencies.

As for banks making one -- more power to them. I wish them well if they compete fairly. Of course, I would expect that the big banking orgs band together, create a crypto currency, then lobby billions to have the congress declare all other cryptocurrencies invalid for transactions within the US or face penalties (it will be titled "The Currency Neutrality Act," because that's how bills are named now -- for the EXACT opposite of what they will do). I mean, that's how crony capitalism works, after all

[OldCannon]

I wish I would have had the additional "play money" to buy more Ethereum. I still think it's a good price point to buy at, but I got in pretty early.

[The Annoyed Man]

So here’s the status of my crypto investment to date:

12/14/17 - purchased 1.26399204 ETH for $900.00 at $712.03/ETH. Not too long afterward, the price went down considerably for a short time.

12/22/17 - purchased 0.17693105 ETH for $99.00 at $559.54/ETH.

Since then, I’ve “lost” about $20 in a little side transaction on another coin (Ripple), but that was an inexpensive learning opportunity.

In the meantime, my original $999.00 investment is worth $1,424.05 today, 01/06/18 - almost exactly 3 weeks after I first got in, and that’s after transaction fees were paid, and counting my little loss on the side. That’s 42.6% profit in 3 weeks. There is nothing in the stock market performing like that. There is nothing in mutual funds that performs like that. There is nothing in CDs or savings accounts that performs like that. Not even precious metals perform like that. I made $425.05 just by sitting on my thumbs. And that is REAL money. I can transfer all of that back to my Chase Bank checking account in dollars, and I’ll still have $425 more than I started with.

I’m really looking forward to this time next year......52 weeks from now.

[Abraham]

TAM,

You've made or lost when you do your final transaction.

[Liberty]

In the meantime, my original $999.00 investment is worth $1,424.05 today, 01/06/18 - almost exactly 3 weeks after I first got in, and that’s after transaction fees were paid, and counting my little loss on the side. That’s 42.6% profit in 3 weeks. There is nothing in the stock market performing like that. There is nothing in mutual funds that performs like that. There is nothing in CDs or savings accounts that performs like that. Not even precious metals perform like that. I made $425.05 just by sitting on my thumbs. And that is REAL money. I can transfer all of that back to my Chase Bank checking account in dollars, and I’ll still have $425 more than I started with.

I’m really looking forward to this time next year......52 weeks from now.

Precious metals have been pretty boring lately. My crypto has been an exciting ride. That's OK though, I own Crypto for the exciting ride. I hold paper securities to live off of, and Precious metal as an inflation hedge. If precious metals start getting exciting it's probably a good indication that most of my other investments are in trouble.

[The Annoyed Man]

TAM,

You've made or lost when you do your final transaction.

Would it make you feel better if I said, “SO FAR, I made $425”? Just to spite you, I’m going to wait until I’ve doubled my money before spending any of it. That will be some time in the next month or two.

I know it is hard to get your mind around cryptocurrency. It was for me too, initially. But this is real. It is really happening. In the 1950s and ‘60s, we all thought the Dick Tracy watch was comic book stuff that would never happen because you can’t miniaturize electronics like that.......or couldn’t. Today, I am wearing an Apple Watch that will do all that and more. The naysayers either changed their mind, or they got left behind. Getting left behind because you were unable for some reason to take advantage of the technology is not a bad thing....it just means that you don’t get to benefit from it. However, getting left behind because you willfully chose to ignore it disqualifies you from having an informed opinion about it.



A friend of mine has already used some of his cryptocurrency profit to pay for an expensive pistol with money he did not have before he initially bought in. He was able to afford a piece of durable goods he could not previously afford, because he made money in cryptocurrency. Plus, more and more, there are merchants accepting cryptocurrency online payments, which cuts the banks out of their pound of flesh in transaction fees. Pretty soon, it is going to be common, and very hard to ignore.

But it’s a free country. You can ignore it and poo-poo it if that’s what floats your boat. Meanwhile, I’ll be converting Etherium or Bitcoin or whatever down the road back into $$ as pure profit, and using that money in creative ways to fund things I cannot currently fund.

[The Annoyed Man]

And by the way, it’s $465 now, since my last post 3 hours and 40 minutes ago....

[Liberty]

Never invest in something if you're not comfortable with it. I poo-pooed Microsoft in the 80s and into the 90s because they didn't have any real assets behind it. I invested in MCI WorldCom instead afterall It was the infrastructure of the internet after all. Oh well, you win some and you lose some. You pick a few more winners than losers and we do alright. One thing is true though, money in the bank will cost ya, Blue chips bought while young helps us from eating catfood in our old age. Real estate will give us a place to live and maybe even an income. Invest in guns and ammo your investing in security. Everyone makes different decisions. For the most part, diversity is king, nobody is getting rich by leaving money in the bank.

The thing about the U.S Dollar is there is nothing behind the dollar. There is nothing but the confidence behind it that we can trade it for real goods and services. One thing that we be pretty well assured of is that it will be worth less in the future than it is today. Crypto is backed only by the confidence of those who buy and trade from their wallets (supply and demand). Those who hold and trade it are solely the ones who determine its value the government can't just decide to print more to pay it's bills. While we can be pretty confident that the U.S. Dollar will be worth less next year than today, Most of us expect that the mainstream cryptocurrencies will actually be worth more.

[The Annoyed Man]

Never invest in something if you're not comfortable with it. I poo-pooed Microsoft in the 80s and into the 90s because they didn't have any real assets behind it. I invested in MCI WorldCom instead afterall It was the infrastructure of the internet after all. Oh well, you win some and you lose some. You pick a few more winners than losers and we do alright. One thing is true though, money in the bank will cost ya, Blue chips bought while young helps us from eating catfood in our old age. Real estate will give us a place to live and maybe even an income. Invest in guns and ammo your investing in security. Everyone makes different decisions. For the most part, diversity is king, nobody is getting rich by leaving money in the bank.

The thing about the U.S Dollar is there is nothing behind the dollar. There is nothing but the confidence behind it that we can trade it for real goods and services. One thing that we be pretty well assured of is that it will be worth less in the future than it is today. Crypto is backed only by the confidence of those who buy and trade from their wallets (supply and demand). Those who hold and trade it are solely the ones who determine its value the government can't just decide to print more to pay it's bills. While we can be pretty confident that the U.S. Dollar will be worth less next year than today, Most of us expect that the mainstream cryptocurrencies will actually be worth more.

Exactly.

Profit right now stands at $489 on a $999 investment made just 12/14/17 - just 24 days ago. 49%...

[MaduroBU]

Precious metals aren't an investment, they're a hedge. Cryptocurrencies are often valued as investments rather than hedges or currency, which is worriesome.

Why is money, in any form, valuable? I would argue that you need to fully consider that question for any sort of investment, but even more so with cryptocurrency. The Theory of Money and Credit is a landmark in the field, and it is more relevant than ever. Many questions that arose when it was written in the 1920s surrounding fiat currency are being revisited with the rise of cryptocurrency. I find Mises's theory of money and value to be far more compelling than those of Marx (see Das Kapital) or Keynes (see The General Theory of Employment, Interest, and Money).

That saidb I use a mining program called nicehash to essentially rent out my rather fancy gaming computer to those who wish to mine coins without directly buying hardware or coins. My investment is a computer that I'd have purchased anyway, and I'm well on my way to paying for it. A friend has nearly paid for his $2600 machine. I think that's a reasonable way to hedge without exposing yourself to an obvious bubble.

[The Annoyed Man]

Precious metals aren't an investment, they're a hedge. Cryptocurrencies are often valued as investments rather than hedges or currency, which is worriesome.

Why is money, in any form, valuable? I would argue that you need to fully consider that question for any sort of investment, but even more so with cryptocurrency. The Theory of Money and Credit is a landmark in the field, and it is more relevant than ever. Many questions that arose when it was written in the 1920s surrounding fiat currency are being revisited with the rise of cryptocurrency. I find Mises's theory of money and value to be far more compelling than those of Marx (see Das Kapital) or Keynes (see The General Theory of Employment, Interest, and Money).

That saidb I use a mining program called nicehash to essentially rent out my rather fancy gaming computer to those who wish to mine coins without directly buying hardware or coins. My investment is a computer that I'd have purchased anyway, and I'm well on my way to paying for it. A friend has nearly paid for his $2600 machine. I think that's a reasonable way to hedge without exposing yourself to an obvious bubble.

I don’t have the desire to do that (maybe I’m a little intimidated by the tech involved.....I don’t know), but that is a great way to make money, and you’re not the first person I’ve heard with a testimony like that. Mining is great because it doesn’t matter which way the transaction is going, or whether it’s headed up or down, you always get your little cut for processing it.