Thoughts On Foreign Trained MD's

[bnc]

What would concern me is a US born/raised doctor who went to med school in a 3rd world country - were they not good enough for a 1st world school? A foreign born doctor educated in their country wouldn't bother me nearly as much since they are probably the best and brightest from wherever they are from (that tends to be the case in engineering at least).

[Bitter Clinger]

May I ask you to please share your data? Thanks!

I don't have any data to share or otherwise.
I have stated my opinions and impressions about the issues.
If working as an MD in the US is so awful why do we have so many foreign trained doctors wanting to work here?

Because it is the US, the best country to live in ever in the history of the world. We are indeed blessed and I know that on that point, you and I share the same opinion! Having traveled overseas, I certainly understand why engineers, MD's, and just about everyone else wants to move here.

[mojo84]

Considering some people's comments and opinion regarding the education system in the United States, one wonders why anyone would want anything to do with anyone educated here. How can we trust any US trained and educated doctor, engineer, architect or manufacturer that's been educated in this dumbed down indoctrination sytem?

Abraham, I believe it is best to consider experience, office staff, hospital privileges at your choice of hospital, minimal malpractice history, no AMA sanctions, good English communication skills and reasonable bedside manner. You can get some info from healthgrades.com and your insurance carrier.

Wishing you the best in your search. I am also looking for a new PCP. Mine has become to busy and has become too difficult to deal with. Sometimes it takes 15 or so calls to get through to them.

[rotor]

What would concern me is a US born/raised doctor who went to med school in a 3rd world country - were they not good enough for a 1st world school? A foreign born doctor educated in their country wouldn't bother me nearly as much since they are probably the best and brightest from wherever they are from (that tends to be the case in engineering at least).

Again, not necessarily so. Have you heard of affirmative action? The best candidate may go to an out of the country med school because he/she did not meet the profile of an affirmative action program. Things are not always what they appear to be. As a matter of fact, the lawsuits going to the supreme court I believe were about a med school admission.

[WildBill]

May I ask you to please share your data? Thanks!

I don't have any data to share or otherwise.
I have stated my opinions and impressions about the issues.
If working as an MD in the US is so awful why do we have so many foreign trained doctors wanting to work here?

Because it is the US, the best country to live in ever in the history of the world. We are indeed blessed and I know that on that point, you and I share the same opinion! Having traveled overseas, I certainly understand why engineers, MD's, and just about everyone else wants to move here.

I can't argue with that.

[rotor]

Last issue, is he/she on your insurance?

[Abraham]

O.K.

I'm reassured.

High quality doctors can and do come from any country.

I wasn't casting aspersions, just seeking feedback, which I got in welcome abundance.

Thanks all!

[C-dub]

Ya'll are correct. Just because someone has a medical degree in another country doesn't mean they can just come on over and hang out a shingle and start taking patients. They gotta go through part of the process here to become certified and licensed. That even happens within the country from state to state. Doctors moving from one state to another must take a board exam to become certified to practice in their new state. Those that can't pass that exam after 3, IIRC, attempts cannot practice in the state. The number and time frame may vary from state to state.

I worked in a nursing department many years ago while I was in school. That's how I picked out my future daughter's pediatrician.

You guys just make this stuff up? They have to be licensed but they don't need to be certified to practice in Texas.

You're right, I'm just making it up as I go. Busted! Never mind that I've been in healthcare for over 20 years now and every doctor hired by the two major company's I've worked for that could not pass their boards to be certified in Texas were fired because they could not work in Texas. But that's meaningless. BTW, they were all doctors that went to school in the US and were licensed to work in other states before being hired to move to Texas under the condition of passing their boards here.

[rotor]

Ya'll are correct. Just because someone has a medical degree in another country doesn't mean they can just come on over and hang out a shingle and start taking patients. They gotta go through part of the process here to become certified and licensed. That even happens within the country from state to state. Doctors moving from one state to another must take a board exam to become certified to practice in their new state. Those that can't pass that exam after 3, IIRC, attempts cannot practice in the state. The number and time frame may vary from state to state.

I worked in a nursing department many years ago while I was in school. That's how I picked out my future daughter's pediatrician.

You guys just make this stuff up? They have to be licensed but they don't need to be certified to practice in Texas.

You're right, I'm just making it up as I go. Busted! Never mind that I've been in healthcare for over 20 years now and every doctor hired by the two major company's I've worked for that could not pass their boards to be certified in Texas were fired because they could not work in Texas. But that's meaningless. BTW, they were all doctors that went to school in the US and were licensed to work in other states before being hired to move to Texas under the condition of passing their boards here.

20 years doesn't make you right. Doctors do not have to be board certified to be licensed or even hired in Texas. You can have a quality doctor who is not board certified and a lousy doctor who is board certified. Most boards require doctors to re-certify every 10 years and the older and more experienced ones are just not going through the hassle of doing that especially those that are getting closer to retirement age. They have the most experience and usually skill but just don't want to waste time or money on re-certifying. Many hospitals will not hire a doctor that is not board certified. Same for many companies but that actually has no bearing on the skill of the doctor. As I said, I would prefer a board certified doctor probably in his/her 50's as my doc ( guess what-that's what I have as my primary care doc). C-dub, many doctors from other countries have to repeat a residency here but they do not have to become board certified. You are not busted, you are just mistaking company policy for Texas requirements.

[VMI77]

Considering some people's comments and opinion regarding the education system in the United States, one wonders why anyone would want anything to do with anyone educated here. How can we trust any US trained and educated doctor, engineer, architect or manufacturer that's been educated in this dumbed down indoctrination sytem?

Abraham, I believe it is best to consider experience, office staff, hospital privileges at your choice of hospital, minimal malpractice history, no AMA sanctions, good English communication skills and reasonable bedside manner. You can get some info from healthgrades.com and your insurance carrier.

Wishing you the best in your search. I am also looking for a new PCP. Mine has become to busy and has become too difficult to deal with. Sometimes it takes 15 or so calls to get through to them.

You're mixing apples and oranges. The best and brightest still have the ability to be educated in technical fields. It is dumbed down indoctrination for the average and below average students. Some of the brighter students may recognize the indoctrination and ignore or escape it. Most schools have special programs for the very top students.

In fields like engineering and medicine that are reality tested educational quality remains high. CAL Tech and MIT are probably still the best advanced technical institutions in the world.

[mojo84]

Considering some people's comments and opinion regarding the education system in the United States, one wonders why anyone would want anything to do with anyone educated here. How can we trust any US trained and educated doctor, engineer, architect or manufacturer that's been educated in this dumbed down indoctrination sytem?

Abraham, I believe it is best to consider experience, office staff, hospital privileges at your choice of hospital, minimal malpractice history, no AMA sanctions, good English communication skills and reasonable bedside manner. You can get some info from healthgrades.com and your insurance carrier.

Wishing you the best in your search. I am also looking for a new PCP. Mine has become to busy and has become too difficult to deal with. Sometimes it takes 15 or so calls to get through to them.

You're mixing apples and oranges. The best and brightest still have the ability to be educated in technical fields. It is dumbed down indoctrination for the average and below average students. Some of the brighter students may recognize the indoctrination and ignore or escape it. Most schools have special programs for the very top students.

In fields like engineering and medicine that are reality tested educational quality remains high. CAL Tech and MIT are probably still the best advanced technical institutions in the world.

I'm not mixing any fruits. I did use a heavy dose of sarcasm though.

[Antares]

I have no qualms about having a board certified doctor from a foreign country my wifes and I cardiologist was from India he was outstanding when we lived in MO. What does gripe me is going to the VA hospital here in Houston and getting treated by foreign people fresh out of medical school that can barely speak English. They had them in VA in KC MO too but they always had a real doctor with them or they came in to check with them during the appt. .

[gregthehand]

One impact I've seen in my own family (my father is a practicing OBGYN/doctor) is that the influx of foreign doctors lowered the wages of many doctors here long before Obamacare due to insurance agencies. Basically a doctor from some foreign country would open some crappy OBGYN office in a strip center, by some used medical equipment, and start seeing patients. The insurance companies would work with them to see how much they charge for exams, procedures, delivering babies, c-sections, etc and they would all have low rates. The same insurance companies go back to guys like my dad and say that he needs to lower his rates if he still wants his practice to receive patients from their insurance company. Some plans he had to just tell to take a hike, many he was able to work with, but still wound up taking a lower rate. The end result was that he had to work twice as hard in 2000 as he did in 1980 for the same amount of money. Not the same amount adjusted for inflation, I mean he had to work twice as hard for $100 now than he did then. When Obamacare passed he finally gave it up and became a hospitalist. Him and some of his partners started a little hospitalist company dealing with hospitals that have a need for OBGYNs. Now he works Sunday through Tuesday and makes the same as he did in private practice.

That's the concerning part. As more and more doctors move away from private practice and in to working for hospitals people's choices will rapidly degrade. I can see in my life time a point where whenever you're sick or just need a check up, just just go to the hospital. Whichever doctor you see will be somewhat luck of the draw based on what day it is. Many US doctors can't and just won't continue to practice with insurance companies continually trying to pay them less and less.

[VMI77]

One impact I've seen in my own family (my father is a practicing OBGYN/doctor) is that the influx of foreign doctors lowered the wages of many doctors here long before Obamacare due to insurance agencies. Basically a doctor from some foreign country would open some crappy OBGYN office in a strip center, by some used medical equipment, and start seeing patients. The insurance companies would work with them to see how much they charge for exams, procedures, delivering babies, c-sections, etc and they would all have low rates. The same insurance companies go back to guys like my dad and say that he needs to lower his rates if he still wants his practice to receive patients from their insurance company. Some plans he had to just tell to take a hike, many he was able to work with, but still wound up taking a lower rate. The end result was that he had to work twice as hard in 2000 as he did in 1980 for the same amount of money. Not the same amount adjusted for inflation, I mean he had to work twice as hard for $100 now than he did then. When Obamacare passed he finally gave it up and became a hospitalist. Him and some of his partners started a little hospitalist company dealing with hospitals that have a need for OBGYNs. Now he works Sunday through Tuesday and makes the same as he did in private practice.

That's the concerning part. As more and more doctors move away from private practice and in to working for hospitals people's choices will rapidly degrade. I can see in my life time a point where whenever you're sick or just need a check up, just just go to the hospital. Whichever doctor you see will be somewhat luck of the draw based on what day it is. Many US doctors can't and just won't continue to practice with insurance companies continually trying to pay them less and less.

That can't be right....our ruling class masters tell us that immigration has no effect on the wages of US citizens. They're only doing work Americans refuse to do.

[karder]

My primary physician was trained in Mexico. He seems competent enough and I have no complaints, but truth be told, he does have a little bit of a "Doctor Nick" vibe. Fans of the Simpsons will understand that reference.