Dallas Diocese posting all churches .3006 and .3007 !!

[Tracker]

Don't get defensive. My posting was for the other Catholics. It a factual statement about competitive religions/beliefs. The Catholic Church doesn't do a great job in teaching this stuff, especially in CCD. I know cradle Catholics who left and joined the baptists church who thought the church believed in a literal Genises. It doesn't page down to Fundamentalism https://www.ewtn.com/library/CURIA/PBCINTER.HTM. When it come to biblical interpretation the church has never taken everything literal. We do however take the eucharist literally. My baptist deacon friend and I don't argue about religion. We talk about the difference.


So while we Christians can worship and pray together the mass is much more than that to Catholics. We see Leaving as much more than finding some place else to worship.


Btw I posted a quote from CC of the church on self defense. I bring that to any talk with a priest or bishop. That said but if you go to a small church and the priest is indifferent he wouldn't file charges anyway. It would be the fist time a priest ignored a buroctstic rule from the diocese

Tracker I'm afraid you misinterpreted the meaning of my post . I am not being defensive at all . Not a problem .

that's what I get for typing from a phone auto check "comparative religion" not "competitive...."

I respect others beliefs, Chuck. I don't see the point in debating which religion is correct. For example, I once sat down with a couple of friends. One was cradle Baptist (not the deacon friend) and the other a cradle Catholic who late in life converted to the Baptist religion. They asked me a question and I mention human evolution. The CB asked: "Now, _____, do you believe the anthropologist or do you believe in the bible?" I didn't answer and dropped it because he wanted to debate. The question assumes that Catholics and Fundamentalists have a common belief about the Bible and that a dichotomy must exist between science and the Bible... I must make a choice must be made. That isn't true for Catholics. For us there is no dichotomy

Well, at a later time I was sitting with my ex-catholic friend for coffee and he brought it up again. I didn't let it pass this time because he should've known better. I said: "Look, I'll give, C, a pass because he's been raise Baptist and doesn't understand these core belief differences but you having been a Catholic for most of your life you should know better. The reality was, even though he'd been Catholic for 50 years(?), he didn't know the Catholic church's theological teachings. That stuff doesn't get taught in the homily. It's supposed to be taught in religious ed but think the teachers are doing a very good job of it. Most Catholic don't even know the Church owns and operates an astronomical observatory at the Vatican and one in Arizona http://www.vaticanobservatory.va/conten ... na/en.html.

If the Fort Worth diocese takes a similar stance as Dallas, I may get some LTC friends and have a talk with our priest.

[Right2Carry]

Don't get defensive. My posting was for the other Catholics. It a factual statement about competitive religions/beliefs. The Catholic Church doesn't do a great job in teaching this stuff, especially in CCD. I know cradle Catholics who left and joined the baptists church who thought the church believed in a literal Genises. It doesn't page down to Fundamentalism https://www.ewtn.com/library/CURIA/PBCINTER.HTM. When it come to biblical interpretation the church has never taken everything literal. We do however take the eucharist literally. My baptist deacon friend and I don't argue about religion. We talk about the difference.


So while we Christians can worship and pray together the mass is much more than that to Catholics. We see Leaving as much more than finding some place else to worship.


Btw I posted a quote from CC of the church on self defense. I bring that to any talk with a priest or bishop. That said but if you go to a small church and the priest is indifferent he wouldn't file charges anyway. It would be the fist time a priest ignored a buroctstic rule from the diocese

Tracker I'm afraid you misinterpreted the meaning of my post . I am not being defensive at all . Not a problem .

that's what I get for typing from a phone auto check "comparative religion" not "competitive...."

I respect others beliefs, Chuck. I don't see the point in debating which religion is correct. For example, I once sat down with a couple of friends. One was cradle Baptist (not the deacon friend) and the other a cradle Catholic who late in life converted to the Baptist religion. They asked me a question and I mention human evolution. The CB asked: "Now, _____, do you believe the anthropologist or do you believe in the bible?" I didn't answer and dropped it because he wanted to debate. The question assumes that Catholics and Fundamentalists have a common belief about the Bible and that a dichotomy must exist between science and the Bible... I must make a choice must be made. That isn't true for Catholics. For us there is no dichotomy

Well, at a later time I was sitting with my ex-catholic friend for coffee and he brought it up again. I didn't let it pass this time because he should've known better. I said: "Look, I'll give, C, a pass because he's been raise Baptist and doesn't understand these core belief differences but you having been a Catholic for most of your life you should know better. The reality was, even though he'd been Catholic for 50 years(?), he didn't know the Catholic church's theological teachings. That stuff doesn't get taught in the homily. It's supposed to be taught in religious ed but think the teachers are doing a very good job of it. Most Catholic don't even know the Church owns and operates an astronomical observatory at the Vatican and one in Arizona http://www.vaticanobservatory.va/conten ... na/en.html.

If the Fort Worth diocese takes a similar stance as Dallas, I may get some LTC friends and have a talk with our priest.

The Fort Worth Diocese has taken that stance.

[Rex B]

When you say "recently" was this before or after December 31? If it was December 31 or earlier, and the 30.06 sign had the new wording. it would have been invalid and you could have carried, I believe.

Wait, did I miss something?
Did the wording of the 30.06 notice change?
If so, does that make the old signs invalid?

[Vol Texan]

When you say "recently" was this before or after December 31? If it was December 31 or earlier, and the 30.06 sign had the new wording. it would have been invalid and you could have carried, I believe.

Wait, did I miss something?
Did the wording of the 30.06 notice change?
If so, does that make the old signs invalid?

Yes, if you see an old 30.06 sign on a business, it is quite invalid. The language was updated, effective 1 Jan 2016.

[Rex B]

OK, so how did it change so I can tell the difference?

[spx74]

Thanks for mentioning it changed, I hadn't noticed.

[Rex B]

OK, found this on http://www.stateoftexaschl.com/open-carry/

Penal Code 30.06 Signage Wording Change

The wording of the PC 30.06 sign has changed. Property with a sign using the old wording after 12/31/2015 are out of compliance. However, I suggest you still not carry on these premises.
Old 30.06 Sign Wording

“Pursuant to Section 30.06, Penal Code (trespass by holder of license to carry a concealed handgun), a person licensed under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code (concealed handgun law), may not enter this property with a concealed handgun”
New 30.06 Sign Wording

“Pursuant to Section 30.06, Penal Code (trespass by license holder with a concealed handgun), a person licensed under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code ( handgun licensing law), may not enter this property with a concealed handgun”

So, if the last line has "Licensing" in it, it's the new, compliant wording.

[spx74]

I would be curious if the Pastor can give permission for a person to carry past the sign? The diocese would order the signs put up, but the Pastor is the supreme authority on the property.

[Vol Texan]

I would be curious if the Pastor can give permission for a person to carry past the sign? The diocese would order the signs put up, but the Pastor is the supreme authority on the property.

In the eyes of the law, the priest can do that. But we Catholics don't see our priests disobeying the rules of their bishops often.

[dhoobler]

I would be curious if the Pastor can give permission for a person to carry past the sign? The diocese would order the signs put up, but the Pastor is the supreme authority on the property.

The parish pastor does not have the authority to opt out of a directive of the bishop, or in the case of the Galveston-Houston diocese, the Cardinal.

[spx74]

I'm sure he would not disobey. I mean does he ,as the authority on the property, have the legal right if he chooses.

[dhoobler]

I'm sure he would not disobey. I mean does he ,as the authority on the property, have the legal right if he chooses.

Here is another way of asking the question. Does the pastor own the property? No.

[spx74]

Honestly I'm not sure, but I think the ownership runs deeper than the Bishop.

[The Annoyed Man]

Honestly I'm not sure, but I think the ownership runs deeper than the Bishop.

It looks like the parish normally owns the property: http://ordinariate.net/parish-property-ownership. However, they own it under canonical law as well as civil law, and my guess is that canonical law imposes certain standards on how the property must be used. Further......and I'm just spitballing here (I'm not Catholic and I don't really know)....but I would be willing to bet that those standards include a requirement to be obedient to directions handed down from higher up the ecclesiastical food chain in matters of how individual parish properties are to be used. Ultimately, the "chain of command" and authority ends with the Pope. I have no idea if the Pope was involved in this decision or not, but open carry in Texas has been a national story, and if it is a national story in America, then it is an international story. I suspect that the order came down from Cardinal Daniel DiNardo, who is also Archbishop of Galveston-Houston. And as a cardinal, he may have received direction from Pope Francis. This is purely speculation on my part.

It seems to me that the degree to which a given denomination's ecclesiastical government is centralized is the degree to which church decisions over major public policy issues can and will cause upsets and tensions within the larger church body. A non-gun related example would be when the Episcopalian church underwent a major upheaval, first over the decision to ordain gay priests, and then later, its decision to sanction gay marriage.....both decisions of which, by the way, embroiled some local congregations in legal disputes with the parent church over the local congregation's property rights, or lack thereof.

A friend of mine is on his way to being ordained as a minister in the United Methodist Church, and I can see certain advantages in a pastoral hierarchy that provides mentoring to lower level pastors as they enter the ministry, or assist impoverished local congregations with financial matters; but I can't say if those kind of advantages offset the potential pitfalls of a centralized church government. The flip side of a Baptist pastor having to seek out pastoral mentoring from outside his own local church body, or that a local church body may not be as well funded as other local bodies of the same denomination, is that church policy decisions that may or may not affect secular rights are more likey to reflect the will of the congregation in those matters than if the decision is handed down from a leadership that is possibly geographically removed from the local church body, and therefore not culturally, socially, or politically on the same page as the local congregation.

This country has a long history of civilian gun ownership. While we are not the only country with that kind of history, we are probably the only country where firearms are as prevalent in society as they are in ours. And yet, only 1/3 of Americans own guns......which of course means that 2/3 do not. So when a denomination makes an anti-gun decision, fewer people will be adversely affected by that decision than the combined number of people who either have no opinion or who are happy about it. In 2008, apparently 32% of Texans self-identified as Catholic (SOURCE). That represented about 7.78 million people at the time.....at a time when there were 314,574 active CHL licenses in the state. IF 32% of those 314,574 CHL holders were Catholics, that would mean that 100,663 Catholics had CHLs........out of 7.78 million total Catholics...... or, about 1.3% of the Church.

I don't know if the Catholic Church has increased in numbers in Texas in the intervening years since 2008. It is reasonable to assume modest growth as the state's population has grown. But even with the tripling of the number of CHL holders in the intervening years, the number of Catholic CHL holders will still be a tiny percentage of the total Church in Texas. I feel bad for my Catholic brothers and sisters in Christ who face some difficult choices. Obedience is difficult sometimes. As is rebellion.

I wish you the best.

[dhoobler]

st. Bernadette Catholic Church is 30.07 posted but not 30.06. It is in the Galveston-Houston diocese.