Addison Oktoberfest - Improper posting

[Taypo]

Another aspect of this is regarding the wanders. The ones that I faced in Lewisville were the same - paid private security.

As soon as you let them wand you or you tell them you have a CHL, you have now set up to walk down the path toward verbal notice. The wander that wanted to wand me clearly had no lack of intestinal fortitude and could easily have told me that he had the authority to deny access to CHLs, whether he had that authority or not or whether he could have that authority on city property. Then I would be faced with a he said/she said. For me, that is a much more slippery slope than not telling them or letting them wand me. My concern with just walking in and letting them wand me, discover a beep and then lift my shirt to determine its source is that it could go south. It one thing for LEOs to come to me when I'm being uncooperative with the wanding process and another for them to respond to a MWAG call.

I made an in-person call to the Lewisville PD the day after my problem at the event. I asked to speak with an officer who could answer questions about the event and met a Lt. with a great attitude. He is very CHL friendly and I've seen him at other events since. Perhaps an in person call to the Addison PD would determine if they follow the same thinking pattern or not. I'd rather see them get a warning over the signs rather than a citation.

That would certainly be a very polite thing to do. Let us know how that works out. A handful of experiences with Addison PD in the past (business, not personal) would lead me to believe it's not going to go far, but that was several years ago.

[mr1337]

I'm confused.

This event was posted with 30.05 signs. I would have walked up to security and let them wand me. If they asked any questions or wanted to see my gun, i would have requested they bring an officer over, much like the State Fair a few years ago.

As someone already pointed out, a CHL excepts you from 30.05.

If they did not post 30.06 then they did not violate the new law.
If they did not inform you explicitly that your CHL was unwelcome, they did not violate the new law.

What am I missing?

NotRPB posted the text from 30.05 on the previous page, and as I understand it "defense to prosecution" is different than "exempts you from 30.05". As I understand it, they can arrest you and charge you, but you have a defense you can make during the trial. Assuming I'm reading this correctly, the 30.05 signs are not in violation of the law, and in using them cities could arrest CHL holders for entering, even though they will likely fail to get a criminal conviction.

Any sign or notice that signifies that a CHL cannot carry is against the law. Something I saw when I went to Atlanta - their metro had a sign that included "No weapons" but also said "unless legally authorized" which covers CHL holders.

[RoyGBiv]

^^^^

He gives you verbal notice under 30.05 and you tell him to read the CHL exception.

Verbal notice under 30.06 does not apply because 30.06 does not apply on municipality owned property.

[chasfm11]

^^^^

He gives you verbal notice under 30.05 and you tell him to read the CHL exception.

Verbal notice under 30.06 does not apply because 30.06 does not apply on municipality owned property.

It still ends up as as a he said/she said with him blocking the entrance. I'm much more comfortable letting the LEOs sort out the penal code rather than some hired security guy with unknown credentials. The premise of Grapevine and others who put up signs is that they have the legal right to do so and that they will haul you to jail to prove it. It is unclear whether Addison is following Grapevine's path or not.

One of the police chiefs that I talked to about OC said candidly that the CHLs probably understand the related parts of the TPC better than most of his officers. I reminded him that CHLs have to understand a lot less of the TPC than his officers do and could spend the time focusing on the parts that specifically affect them. I have zero confidence that people outside of the CHL and LEO communities can find the TPC, let alone understand it relative to guns. I can also say that there is a pretty good universal mis-understanding of rules related to RVs, too. How many know that there is an exception to the open container rule for RVs?

[Photoman]

This event is primarily a beer drinking event. I would assume someone has to hold a TABC license to sell. Has anyone looked at the license map for his event? I would assume they mapped the whole park and it would be 51%.

[ScottDLS]

This event is primarily a beer drinking event. I would assume someone has to hold a TABC license to sell. Has anyone looked at the license map for his event? I would assume they mapped the whole park and it would be 51%.

I think individual booths and vendors don't get to map out the whole city as their licensed premises. If they do, how do we carry at the State fair where there are plenty of alcohol only or >51% booths?

[Photoman]

Not the whole city. The whole park (which is completely fenced in). I ran into issues with the local ice rink that has a bar upstairs. When they mapped their license, it covered the whole building and thus the 51% signs were on the front door of the building. Surely there are 51% issues at this event.

[zipmac22]

Not the whole city. The whole park (which is completely fenced in). I ran into issues with the local ice rink that has a bar upstairs. When they mapped their license, it covered the whole building and thus the 51% signs were on the front door of the building. Surely there are 51% issues at this event.

If a 51% sign is used then the upstair bar is bringing in 51% or more of the cash flow. I'm thinking that the percentage isn't that high...IMHO.

[jrene]

Has anyone been to the Addison Oktoberfest this year? Are they still posting unenforceable "no firearms" signs?

[treadlightly]

Has anyone been to the Addison Oktoberfest this year? Are they still posting unenforceable "no firearms" signs?

Interesting, and a possible sign of rare enlightenment. From the event's FAQ's at http://addisonoktoberfest.com/faqs/:

- NO illegal weapons, knives, or sharp objects.

I've never really thought much of State imprimatur, particularly in some states, like what those poor folks on the West Coast endure, but I'm right on board with this. It would be wrong, nasty, and completely inappropriate to bring illegal weapons.

Particularly considering how many legal choices we have.

I doubt I will go. It's too far away. But if I went, I'd be armed to the same extent my habits dictate. I'd stay sober, just like I always do, and I wouldn't cause the slightest alarm, 'cause I never do, just me and my 1911.

No, wait, Oktoberfest. Nicht der johannmosesbrowningschüsse - der Sig Sauer Handfeuerwaffen!

That's assuming there is no other reason to believe I'd be on the wrong side of the law.